Sequencer search, with repeat option

I am looking for a sequencer with a repeat option, the obvious one is the Metropolis from Intellijel that has a repeat option (i.e. at one step it can repeats itself up till 8 times, configurable from 1 till 8 times). I am actually really impressed by what the Metropolis can (or what I believe it can since the lack on experience here from my side ;-) ).

However... it's 34 units wide and it's price causes me quite some tears in my eyes when I am honest. So my question is, are there any other sequencers that have this "repeat" option (without the need of going deep in a menu's structure)?

The only other module I found so far that comes close to it or at least hast a repeat function as well is the Xaoc Devices Tirana II module that can repeats one step up till 4 times and one module is a 4 steps sequencer (it's chainable!). I haven't found a slide function though (the Metropolis has).

Does anyone know any other sequencer that has this "repeat" functionallity? Or anyone that was perhaps in the luxurious position two had both, the Metropolis and the Tirana modules and can give here perhaps some experience values of these modules?

The strong point for Tirana II for me is, it's chainable (as far as I am aware the Metropolis isn't or is it?), so if you have unendless money and you take one row as a maximum for a sequencer then with a 168 width row, one could theoretically go up till: 168 TE / 6 TE = 28 modules * 4 steps = 112 steps sequencer ;-) I am joking of course, that's not really realistic because 28 modules would be about Euro 5320 and for that money most of us would buy other things ;-) But 8 or 16 steps might be realistic. At least for the money of one Metropolis one can buy at least 3 Tiranas II and have thus a 12 step sequencer (instead of the 8 step Metropolis).

The Metropolis on the other hand has more options, more settings can be changed and even saved and loaded, that's all not possible with the Tirana II, therefore my question: is there any other sequencer that's affordable and has this repeat option?

As always, your opinion, feedback and experiences is very much appreciated, thank you!

The thing you're looking for here isn't a sequencer...it's a clock multiplier, and the function you're talking about is "ratcheting". Have a look at Doepfer's A-160-5. That module can output multiple clock pulses based on an incoming clock, and the amount of repetitions can be voltage-controlled. Now, as to how to get it to work...that's going to vary from sequencer to sequencer that you use it with. By and large, though, you're looking at clock modulation and logic functions when you're talking about something of this sort. In some cases, you might be able to trigger the ratcheting from a stage pulse. Others might require something a bit more elaborate with some logic gating. It all more or less depends on which sequencer seems like a good fit for you...and once you sort that out, then the next step will be figuring out how clocking should work for you and all of the related fun with that.

"Sequencers" is a big topic. There are many types of sequencers and very different uses and strong opinions (Metropolis and Tirana II are pretty much at opposite ends of the spectrum). This has been debated extensively at Muffwiggler, and I can recommend reading through the threads over there.

A quick search gave the following places to start (but there are many others):

http://www.muffwiggler.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=216839

http://www.muffwiggler.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=161153

http://www.muffwiggler.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=180779

There is also an extensive comparison of sequencers here:

http://doudoroff.com/sequencers/

EDITED May 19th 2019, 06:04

Hi Lugia, Mosorensen, All,

Thanks a lot for your feedback and information, very useful, I am already hours busy "processing" your provided information and provided links, very helpful!

Regarding the Doepfer A-160-5, I saw this module as well as the A-160-2, these modules are certainly interesting however I don't think it can do what I want however I might need one of these modules for other purposes later on.

The links to muffwiggler are very useful, provides a lot of information and it... he, he... it gives me a good feeling that I realise that I am not the only one here on this planet that's struggling to find a sequencer that suits one well, looks like it's a big & difficult job to find the "perfect" match regarding a sequencer.

The doudoroff.com/sequencers/ link is fantastic, thank you! It gave me some ideas of sequencers I didn't know about yet, on the other hand it confirmed a little bit of what I was afraid... there aren't many sequencers that have this repeat option, especially in combination with availability and reasonable price.

The Koma Elektronik - Komplex Sequencer is certainly a nice one, but it's not modular and the price is "nice" too...

Two modules might be interesting but I guess they aren't released yet and thus we have to wait for them to become available to see if it would fit ones "specifications" and that are: Erica Synths Black Sequencer and Endorphin.es Ground Control, both sounds interesting and I can't wait for them to become available!

Oh yes, just for my understanding (and please correct me if I am wrong), repeat is rather repeating the same tone at the number of times it has been set to and in the same tempo of the entire sequence, where ratcheting is rather very fast (as fast as possible?) repeat the same tone to the number of times set and not necessarily in the same tempo as the sequence itself. Right?

To summarise: A sequencer with direct knobs/sliders without menu stuff (or just a simple menu might be still okay), with repeat option and a reasonable price seems not to exist, if one put on top of that yet another requirement: "Chainable" (and even forgetting the price) then to me it looks like that I might need to look on another planet for such devices, perhaps a hole in the market for some manufacturers lurking here around on the forums? ;-)

Right...ratcheting is a rapid repetition of a single stage's voltage settings, generally at some fraction of the main clock pulse. Although, I will point out that while that Koma Komplex is a rather spendy device, it has a lot of possible control routings that can give you this result along with many others...particularly if you have a Boolean logic module (or two) in your build. Also, modules such as comparators can be used to output controlling gates in conjunction with using a sequencer row for timing CVs. Given enough logic, clock counters, dividers and multipliers, extra gate/trig sequencers and comparators, you can make even a fairly simple sequencer turn backflips.

Asking which sequencer is best is like asking what beer is the best. Now... if you're looking to get intoxicated... well beer is beer. If you're all about the journey to inebriation... you can branch off into sub-category after sub-category and still not cover them all.

Buy a small, inexpensive sequencer or module with sequencing built into it. Chances are you'll probably keep it around... since most sequencers can be clocked externally and synced to another sequencer... and sequencers can do a lot more than trigger notes.

As you build up some proficiency with your inexpensive, "simple" sequencer you'll start to develop a taste for what you like about it and what you don't. You could even buy two different types of inexpensive sequencers and see how you get on with them. Once you have some wiggle time under your belt, you'll probably feel more confident about selecting a larger sequencer.

I'm not recommending modules here but telling you about my own experience.

I started with an Ornaments and Crime module paired with a Temps Utile. I could get a fair bit done between the two modules.
I then bought a Pittsburgh Modular Micro Sequence. It looks pretty simple at first glance... but accessing features using long and short button presses and remembering which and what blinking light means what was infuriating. I pulled it from the rack in anger.

I bought a 1010 Music Toolbox because of the screen. I use it a lot but it isn't something I'd want to structure an entire song on. But it's really flexible and offers quite a few neat features like recording CV and audio (in a limited way). I also bought a Mimetic Digitalis from Noise Engineering around the same time. The Mimetic does almost everything the Micro Sequence can do and more.

I'm considering a Westlicht Performer... however they have to be built as they can't be bought retail. It's similar to the Eloquencer... which is something I thought about getting.

My recommendation is start small with the sequencer and don't be afraid of using small ones sync'ed together rather than trying to find a large one that does everything in multiples. You can never have enough VCAs... and you can never have too many sequencers. Also... anything that wasn't pulled from the rack in anger has an easy to manage interface. That's also a requirement for me as well.

EDITED May 22nd 2019, 03:33

Hello Lugia and Ronin1973,

Both thank you very much for your feedback/information.

Though I usually don't mind complexity... I think, Ronin1973, I am going to follow up on your advice to start rather simple than spend a fortune on a large sequencer. Better start easy first and figure out what fits me best, exactly what you mentioned. It's also good to hear that you never can have enough sequencers :-) It puts me at ease ad not to worry and just start small, again, just as you mentioned :-)

All right, thank you very much both and though I had already a sequencer in mind, it's likely now that I might change that into just a smaller and cheaper one just to get started with that, will take that up into my planning of my new modular system.

Arduino clone of intellijel, with repeat / stop step function.
Totally DIY. Doesn't exist as a project you can buy. You have to figure it yourself.
I'm working myself on it too:

The same project detailed on GitHub:
https://github.com/tomarus/diymetro

Another great video, the principle of functioning explained.
Start here to build from scratch:

if you want a metropolis - get a used one - they usually seem to go for about 70% retail - and if you don't like it you can flip it for the same money

or get a ryk m185 - maybe diy it - not a starter project though

Check out Pamela's New Workout- that has tons of super features including clock multipliers, dividers, all types of sequencer rhythm type features. Pair it with a good sequential switch and should get you closer to your goal. For sequencers, the 512 Vector has ratcheting and host of features. As an IME/Harvestman fan, the Stillson Hammer looks incredible as well.

EDITED Sep 25th 2020, 01:54

Hi Sacguy71,

Thanks a lot for the hints. I definitely will keep Pamela's New Workout in mind, however looking for "the perfect" (I know, it doesn't exist and also what for one means perfect might be a disaster for another) sequencer, I don't think it's going to be my number one sequencer though. As a clock and clock divider it sounds indeed pretty interesting.

Have a good weekend, enjoy your modular systems and kind regards, Garfield.

The muxlicer, 8 steps sequencer with cv-able gate ratcheting (up to 8 gates per step), can be chain with other muxlicer using the EOC output and reset input (never tried this one). It's also a sequential switch and more. Negative side, there is no quantizer built-in. This video cover most features.

For a great sequencer, I would check out the following:

WMD Metron
https://wmdevices.com/products/metron

Metron looks awesome for drums and bass. Here is what it can do even for a very small basic setup.

https://www.perfectcircuit.com/wmd-metron-black.html

512 Vector
http://www.five12.com/

IME Stillson Hammer MK2
http://www.industrialmusicelectronics.com/products/18

I am saving up for a new case and sequencer and mixer and fx setup. Would love a high end sequencer and mixer with all the expanders and support tools and FX/sampler to go with it. Very expensive part of modular next to building a setup with modular drum voices. Personally, I like the workflow of sequencer, mixer, FX and controls by my fingertips and the modules with oscillators and stuff separate all neatly patched for a show. Then I can get wild on the sequencer and filter controls and not accidentally unplug a patch cable.

EDITED Sep 26th 2020, 04:53

Hi Defragmenteur and Sacguy71,

Thanks a lot for your ideas and provided links. The WMD - Metron looks quite interesting but is mainly focussing on percussion & drums. I am looking for a mixture of both percussion/drums with 3 or if possible at least 4 sequencer channels beside that. Something like the Arturia - Keystep Pro but then in Eurorack format and without a large keyboard ;-) The only two sequencers I found so far are the non-released ones yet of: Endorphin.es - Ground Control and Erica Synths - Black Sequencer.

If you know of similar (or better) sequencers, especially of those that are currently already available, then please let me know :-)

Thank you very much and kind regards, Garfield.

Hi Garfield,

In that case take a look at the Hermod, Eloquencer and 512 vector sequencers. Those seem to offer the features you want in a sequencer for modular stuff.

Eurorack Pitch + Gate Sequencer Module Comparison

Hi Sacguy71 and Defragmenteur,

Sacguy71: The Eloquencer might be indeed another interesting candidate. The Hermod... I am not sure, not too much of menu diving?

Defragmenteur: Thanks a lot for that list, I think a long time ago I have seen that before but it's good to be reminded of, I will check the entire list once again once I have a quiet moment!

Thank you both very much and kind regards, Garfield.

@Garfield, the eloquencer is nice! I met a guy who had not one but FOUR in his setup.

I'm a big fan of the Malekko Varigate 4+. It's one of the few modules I've held onto in my purge. The sliders aren't the best for performative use, but I don't do a lot of wiggling in my patches so that's not a concern for me. Might be worth your while to look into.

I have a varigate 4+ and it is just ok not precise enough and probably not great for what Garfield wants. I recommend the Winter Eloquencer or 512 Vector those are superb sequencers that have all kinds of great options.

Hi Baltergeist and Sacguy71,

Ha, ha, indeed, I had tested the Varigate last year at my local dealer but somehow, it wasn't my type of sequencer, I guess.

I am currently checking with my local dealer if the Ground Control (Endorphin.es) will become available soon or if we are going to get yet another half year delay... To be honest, for the moment all my hopes are on that one. If it is for some reason disappointing, I might indeed want to test the Eloquencer at my local dealer. Let's see how it goes with the Ground Control.

Thanks a lot for your input and kind regards, Garfield.

I was hoping I could today (Friday) test the Endorphin.es - Ground Control sequencer as it should have been available today at my local dealer. The availability date has been moved to mid October instead :-(

I start wondering if this module every will be released... same for the Erica Synths - Black Sequencer, that one is still not available either.

Yeah a local synth guy is supposed to be getting the Endorphin.es Ground Control soon and said that I can try it out once it arrives.

Hi Sacguy71,

Well, yes that's the entire point here: Will the Ground Control arrive at all? :-(

I am waiting since early summer last year for this thing... is it allowed to be a bit impatient by now? ;-)

Kind regards, Garfield.

Unbelievable, last Friday the Endorphin.es - Ground Control suppose to become available at my local dealer, then it was indicated on their website it will become available by mid of October and now just recently this has been updated to end of October... I need to check if they mentioned a year, perhaps Oct. 2023? ;-)

"Anyways..." I have checked again most interesting sequencers with a lot of input from many of the members here, so thank you very much for that.

Actually my requirements are not that difficult: 8 (or more) triggers for the drums/percussion and 3 or more channels (CV+Gate, mod is a bonus) and a few running directions, at least: forward, backwards & random.

Well then there seems to be no sequencer that can do that, the combination with the running directions seems to be a killer... So letting go that running direction requirement, I see following sequencers as the most interesting candidates:

• WMD - Metron with Axxent extension module and preferable with 2 Voltera extension modules (48 HP total), then one will have 16 triggers (not bad!) and 8 CVs for 8 tracks/channels but it's missing the running direction modes as far as I can see it from the manual; most expensive one from this list
• Squarp Hermod, 26 HP, 8 CVs & 8 gates, not too bad but no triggers and no running direction modes; the cheapest in this list
• Five12 - Vector + Jack Expander (54 HP), 8 triggers (4 available for drums) and 6 channels (6 CVs, 6 gates, 6 velocity & 2 mod-inputs); it does have running direction modes (forwards, backwards, alternate, random); 2nd expensive from this list

• Endorphin.es - Ground Control (not released yet), 42 HP, 8 triggers and 3 CVs & 3 gates, this would be my ideal sequencer, not sure if it has running direction modes though and if it will be released at all; 2nd cheapest from this list of 4

• Perhaps to the above the Winter Modular - Eloquencer could be added with 38 HP, it has 8 CVs & 8 gates so that's not too bad but no triggers for the percussion (unless one uses that from the 8 gates but then less channels left for others). One could consider two pieces of Eloquencers but that would make it the most expensive one of the 5 mentioned here...

Conclusion? There is no perfect and ideal sequencer ;-)

To make the situation more ideal one could consider a combination of 2 or more of the above mentioned sequencers, that makes it however yet again more expensive and one needs tons of HP space...

Anyway, I am going to sleep a night over it and see if there is a more practical solution to this, cheers for now, Garfield.

Edits:
- Updated/corrected the details on the above Five12 - Vector & Jack Expander combination
- Updated HP of Jack Expander of Five12, 12 HP by the way (source: ModularGrid, modules section)
- Updated the running direction modes for Five12 (Vector manual, page 4)
- Updated triggers for Jack Expander (Five12), 8 triggers but only 4 can be used for drums

EDITED Oct 14th 2020, 23:40

Garfield, have you checked into the Voltage Block? It might have some of the repeat step functionality you mentioned earlier in this thread. I use it with the Eloquencer, and really enjoy the combination.

Hi Farkas,

Ah yes, the Voltage Block, forgotten about that one, to be honest, so thanks a lot for reminding me. I am not too sure though...

I tested last year the Varigate 8+ at my local dealer, it was okay but I wasn't overwhelmed I must say. If I remember well (so please do correct me if I got that wrong) then there were sequence settings that once you left them, go for example to another track/channel and then go back to the previous one, you "don't get automatically the values back" of what you did before, if you adjust it then and it might not fit too well, if you get my point, or is it from a practical point of view not too bad?

Did you tried to combine the Voltage Block with the Varigate 8+ or did you straight away went for the combination of the Voltage Block and the Eloquencer?

I am curious after your experience with this one, so if you like to share some details or pros & cons with me that would be nice. Does the Voltage Block supports ratcheting?

Thank you very much, have a good weekend and kind regards, Garfield.

I am dealing with similar issues to Garfield in terms of finding one end all be all modular sequencer. I like the simplicity of my tiny Korg SQ-1 for creating beats and the touch pad of my Make Noise 0-ctrl but hate the lack of complex features like song chaining and pattern creation that my Elektron sequencers have for creating entire tracks of presets to use for sets. I hate the Varigate 4+ it is garbage. I read manuals and watched videos but it is so bad at creating patterns and the least precise sequencer as it just makes a jumbled mess of anything that I connect it to. Hell even LFO does better job of consistent beats. If Voltage Block is as bad as the Varigate 4+ then I'd avoid it. The Stillson Hammer looks fun as well but for $600 there are better sequencers out there.

The mimetic is great for experimentation not as a main sequencer. Currently I do most sequencing with my squarp since I have a bunch of external gear. I may in my next case do more modular sequenencing only time will tell.

I use the Eloquencer for more precise sequencing and the Voltage Block for experimenting. It's not really like the Varigate aside from the Malekko brand and imprecise sliders. What I like to do with the Voltage Block is program in arpeggios and short sequences (you can choose pattern length between 1 and 16 steps) quantized to a scale, and then rearrange the patterns on the fly. You can repeat a single step by holding down the button for the desired step, or hold down a few buttons to pick a few steps of a longer sequence to bounce between, as well as traditional up/down/up-down/random. If quantized, the sliders become a little easier to use. I have used the Baseck/Basimilus Iteritas Alter combination too with some crazy results. It's a fun little box with some valuable tools.

Yeah the Eloquencer, 512 Vector and WMD Metron look super awesome for a master sequencer. I plan to get a much larger case to add one of those and the WMD Performance mixer in the future. One guy I know has 4 Winter Eloquencers in his mobile setup! That is crazy.

Hi Farkas,

What you describe about the Voltage Block, those things, in a way, I have that functionality already in the Sinfonion (from ACL). Sinfonion is fantastic and I wish I can find a kind of main sequencer that can co-operate nicely together with the Sinfonion.

Sinfonion has a bit different setup as the usual sequencer (not in a bad way, by the way), so that's why I am looking for yet another sequencer. The Sinfonion, from my point of view at least, focusses more on arpeggio and chords, which is by the way fantastic and of course has yet another 3 channels available for melodies, though real classic sequencing is for those 3 channels kind of limited or not possible, the focus on those 3 channels is to get a kind of melody out of it, which is superb!

For a good reason the Sinfonion is called a chord progression sequencer; I therefore look for a classic (but good and not too limited in possibilities) sequencer to go along with my Sinfonion.

Thank you and kind regards, Garfield.

Oh, that's right. I forgot you had a Sinfonion. One of these days I would love to try one of those out.

Hi Farkas,

I love the Sinfonion. If you are interested I can recommend to download the manual from ACL's website. The manual is easy to read and here and there a bit humour has been added, so it's not "dry-stuff" you are reading, I feel it's one of the better manuals out there under the Eurorack modules.

Then the Sinfonion itself, well most I told you already in my above post. Though it's a fantastic module, one has to keep in mind that it is a serious black hole that sucks up any module that's nearby located. You are really going to need almost every module you have in your setup (at least in my case) because you need tons of modules to keep all those channels "happy". 3 voices, chords (4 voices/oscillators would be nice, with 3 it can be done too) and an arpeggio, so preferable you need at least 8 oscillators then plenty of LFOs, EGs, large mixer or several mixers, VCAs, filters modules, etcetera (well you know the drill) to keep the entire thing going and working the way you like it. That's why I call it the black hole of my setup, all modules are being "slurped up" by the Sinfonion ;-)

In the far future, I might even consider a second Sinfonion however that costs yet another fortune, so I am not too sure about that at all.

Kind regards, Garfield.

TBH, the Sinfonion (GAH! That spelling is throwing me for a loop! I'm far more used to "SinfoniAn") is one of the very few $1k-area modules that I would ever recommend. Most super-expensive modules are sort of...uh...not really supposed to be super-expensive, but the Sinfoniaaaaaaagh...on is more akin to a scalar "computer". I'm not surprised that it sucks up loads of other signal sources; it's incredibly complex, and has more uses than I can even sort out. For generative work, it would be pretty close to a "core module"...just send it piles of voltage curves and set the scalar/sequential elements, then STAND BACK.

Hi Lugia,

Ha, ha, yeah, funny spelling that Sinfonion ;-) I agree with you on the complexity of the Sinfonion, it might be one of those very few modules that one never stops learning about...

So, my I ask you a direct question and I am hoping for an honest (and not a diplomatic) answer ;-) ? Is the combination of Five12 - Vector + Jack Expander (bit over 1k bucks together) worth it? If yes, why, if not, why not?

Thanks a lot in advance for your opinion and kind regards, Garfield.

Also take a look at the Frap Tools USTA as you can capture CV and replay it:
https://frap.tools/products/usta/

It looks like a fun sequencer. I'd say for me and perhaps you, Garfield:

Frap Tools USTA
512 Vector
Winter Eloquencer
WMD Metron- cool drum sequencer
Endorphin.es Ground Control - if it ever arrives

Once COVID ends and synth shops open again then I will try these out before buying another sequencer.

So, my I ask you a direct question and I am hoping for an honest (and not a diplomatic) answer ;-) ? Is the combination of Five12 - Vector + Jack Expander (bit over 1k bucks together) worth it? If yes, why, if not, why not?
-- GarfieldModular

No, I definitely think it's worth it. The Vector is a wildly complex and super-versatile sequencer, given all of the different algorhythmic/generative capabilities that're hiding inside of it. And the ability to get inside of it with a computer is really appealing, plus you can store complex instruction sets for it internally via its own microSD. The breakout module just ups the ante, too...allowing you to use the Vector to sequence more than just the Eurorack stuff. It's very DEEP, and as a result it's got a bit of learning curve...but man, the POWER...

Hi Lugia,

Thank you very much for your opinion and the provided information. So there are already two modules around (or beyond) the 1k line you approve of ;-) The Sinfonion and the Vector+Jack Expander ;-)

That most likely means that if Ground Control from Endorphin.es is not going to be released that I will seriously going to consider this sequencer (Vector+Jack Expander), just need a "bit" (to be read as: "tons") of time to save money for that bank-plunderer!

Okay, thank you very much and for my bank account's sake I hope the Ground Control will be released ;-) Kind regards, Garfield.

Hi Lugia,

I forgot: It's very DEEP, and as a result it's got a bit of learning curve...but man, the POWER... --> that sounds a bit like an Elektron, especially the learning curve part ;-)

Kind regards, Garfield.

Woah Garfield so you have the ACLSinfonion Complex Harmonic CV Processor? Dude thats freaking awesome but expensive piece of kit. I am looking for a central master sequencer hub in the long run. I will wait until covid ends and synth shops open so I can try a bunch out. My preference is XOXO type programmable sequencers like that in the Elektron gear. Wonder what Eurorack complex sequencer would work for me?

Hi Sacguy71,

Yes indeed, I actually bought (at that time) the Sinfonion a bit too early, I wanted it to buy it a half year later but then there was such a good offer that I couldn't let it go and that module when it just came out was (and still is) so intriguing that I couldn't let it go.

Can one buy a Sinfonion too early? Well yes and no. If you want to feed that "black hole sucking monster module" enough to keep it happy like a happy tail of a dog then yes. You seriously need tons of modules as an input for the Sinfonion, if you don't have that but you still got the Sinfonion then you will realise that you can't provide full and enough input to the 3 voice/melody channels, the chord channel and the arpeggio channel. Now that is not necessarily a disaster though, you can start with the chords, arpeggio and for example one voice channel instead of straight away 3 channels but of course on the long run you like to use it to it's maximum, hence my terminology: "This is a black hole that sucks up all your modules" ;-)

But having all said that, I have not even a single thought or moment of regret, not at all. Yes it's bloody expensive and yes, in my opinion there should come laws to protect us users from ridiculous prices for modules ;-) But putting the fun aside, I wouldn't go as far as saying something cliché as: "It's worth every penny of it" because that's just too cliché but yes I think, it was worth the investment but I agree with everyone saying it's (too) expensive as well and therefore deciding not to buy it. So you just have to consider for yourself: "Is it worth it?". Download the manual if you are more interested in the Sinfonion and completely read it, it's one of the modules I haven't tested it at my local dealer but as mentioned I didn't regret it buying it "blindly" (but of course I read the manual completely and watched all the tutorial video's from Mathias Kettner, who designed the Sinfonion).

Very difficult decision of course but keep in mind two things:

• It's cheaper than the Five12 + Jack Expander sequencer combination, even if it is just a little bit cheaper ;-)
• But... the Sinfonion is not your classical sequencer as such (see also above my earlier message), it's a chord progression sequencer and thus if you like to have some "classical" sequencing (which I indeed like to have) then you have to get yourself another sequencer beside the Sinfonion

Especially that last point makes it unpleasantly expensive, because a Sinfonion costs already a fortune and then yet another fortune is required for a good sequencer next to it.... And yes, I do realise that the above two points are a kind of contradiction...

Or check out this video, didn't know this one till today, quite nice introduction of the Sinfonion:

The Sinfonion you see in that video by the way, looks like a prototype to me. The now available Sinfonion has nice dim yellow lights (not too bright), more comfortable for the eyes and a different setup on the layout of the buttons. You also can see a (very) nice modular setup of "Ströme Studio".

Or if you like to hear the Sinfonion used by myself, the track in my below post demonstrates some of it's possibilities:

https://www.modulargrid.net/e/forum/posts/index/8749

Not the entire track has been done by the Sinfonion though, however the arpeggio you hear in this track is definitely done by Sinfonion.

Regarding that complex sequencer question of yours, why not consider the Five12 - Vector + Jack Expander, yes expensive but it looks like a good sequencer, ask Jingo, he loves it ;-)

However, I still want to give that Ground Control (from Endorphin.es) one more change, I am waiting till the end of this month to see if it's finally going to be released, depending then on perhaps yet another delay message from my dealer, I am going to decide, I think, not sure yet because the Ground Control is attractive in it's way too (beside the much lower price than that Five12 combination).

I realised I haven't answered to your suggestion of the Frap Tool - USTA, that definitely looks like an interesting sequencer but my guts say or warn me a little bit to be careful with the "sexy module look syndrome"; it might be nicer looking than being that "perfect" sequencer I am looking for. Or let me put it in another way, it's too expensive for what it (technically) offers. It has 4 tracks (8 CVs and gates) but no triggers for percussion/drum. Of course you could use those 8 CVs/gates for that but then you have to give up on a few channels. It still looks interesting, I have to give you that :-)

Kind regards, Garfield.

Yeah I watched a video of the guy demo the Sinfonion at Superbooth and it looks wicked. He had a Winter Eloquencer sequencing it and the voices in his massive setup. If I had 10 voices and wanted to create chord progressions and already had a decent sequencer, it would be perfect. I am looking at pairing something like Pamela New Workout + Euclidian Circles for percussion beats and later getting either the Winter Eloquencer, Endorphin.es Ground Control, WMD Metron or Frap Tool USTA when I have a much larger third case to stuff the larger modules into along with a serious mixer.

Hi Sacguy71,

The WMD - Metron with extension modules Axxent and minimum of two Volteras might be indeed a nice sequencer too but bloody expensive and in the manual of Metron I can't find any information about if that sequencer can do running other than forwards, I would expect from a modern sequencer at least backwards and random as well and if possible a ping-pong run too.

Any member has a Metron who can confirm about those running direction modes?

Thank you very much in advance and kind regards, Garfield.

Hi Garfield,

I made progress working with the Varigate 4+ tonite in cranking out some decent modular sequences. It shines with the Malekko Quad Envelope module for creating various patterns. Still a pain to work with this sequencer so my next one will be more precise and have ability to create presets, chains, and songs. I will visit some synth shops after COVID ends hopefully next year to try a bunch out. Right now, my Noise Engineering and IME/Harvestman modules are my favorites so far and have tons of modulation possibilities even if they are digital they sound so amazing in 1-2 modules.

My setup after having checked, bought and sold tons of sequencers!

https://www.instagram.com/p/CGXeAcJBKI8/?igshid=1q1vnwf8w5ysj

Hi Mikeleebirds,

Wow, nice setup! I recognise a few things I consider or have already: the ALC - Sinfonion, nice one :-) (the only one I got so far). The Five12, which I reconsider again and the Hermod. Where do you mainly use the Hermod for, if I may ask?

By the way, what's that aluminium... "control board" with those 16*8 buttons or pads? Looks kind of interesting, self-made sequencer or a DAW controller?

Thanks a lot for sharing this and kind regards, Garfield.

Hi Garfield,

Hermod, aside from being a powerful sequencer on its own, can be an extension of Vector, adding more pitch and gate outputs. You can apply Hermod‘s effects to Vector‘s parts and add interesting variations this way.
Hermod has a nice arpeggiator that I like to use with an external keyboard or simply with a chord part from Vector. Soon Vector will have its own arpeggiator function, though.
Hermod is also great to bring external sequencers such as iPad apps into the rack.

The aluminium board is a Grid from Monome, which is basically a controller whose function changes depending on the program/app/sequencer it is connected to.
I use it with the Monome Ansible (the module between Hermod and Sinfonion) which has several immensely inspiring sequencers built in and can also be used as a simple midi to CV interface.

Do check out Monome! They are also the makers of Norns.

https://monome.org/docs/grid/
https://monome.org/docs/ansible/

EDITED Oct 19th 2020, 08:20

Hi Mikeleebirds,

Thanks a lot for the extensive provided information!

Looks to me like Vector (already mentioned by Jingo) is a (very) good sequencer, if an arpeggiator will be added then that's even better.

Is it a good combination to use the Vector more for the "melody" line and let the Hermod more focussing on the percussion and drum?

Thanks a lot and kind regards, Garfield.

I would use Vector for melodies on a rhythmically quantized grid, whereas Hermod is very useful if you want to play/record more loosely timed melodies or notes.
Vector plays steps whereas Hermod plays midi events, which are not necessarily restricted to certain steps.

As for drums I prefer Vector. Together with a Launchpad it’s super easy to program and change drum hits. And with the upcoming 2.0 firmware adding random elements, muting drum voices, etc. will be super easy.