Is the Behringer K-2 Eurorack-compatible?

Anyone got a K-2?

I may have wires crossed but seem to recall that the original Kors use a different system to the 1v/octave and could only be used with a Eurorack via a converter.

Is the K-2 the same or is it directly compatible with 1v/Oct Eurorack?

Ian

Hi Ian,

As far as I know the K-2 is not compatible with the 1v/octave Eurorack default (the K-2 is a clone of the Korg MS-20), so you might need a converter. Luckily for us that Behringer plans just a module like that for Eurorack, the "961 - Interface" module, not available yet though. So this 961 together with K-2 should do the trick.

Kind regards, Garfield.

Ah... :-(

Not heard of the 961. the K-2's designed for Eurorack so why not make it externally compatible? Hey ho...

Any idea on price? It might negate Behringer's price advantage.

I was planning on getting the Neutron and K-2 as rack starters. Now it looks like the Model D or Pro 1. The K-2 seems to have better patching options, though

Decisions,. decisions...

EDITED May 22nd 2020, 14:04

Hi Ian,

I would recommend the Neutron then to start with and take it from there. You don't need a Eurorack to get started with a Neutron. Once and if you are happy with it, then you can consider a Eurorack.

Regarding the K-2, since it's a clone of an MS-20, it wouldn't be a clone any more if you would make it 1V/octave compatible, right? ;-) But other than that it is Eurorack compatible, just unscrew the screws, remove the front-plate module, remove the attached cables and you can put it in your Eurorack case.

To be precise it's the 961 module of Behringer, not the 061 (might be a typo I guess) :-)

I just recently acquire the Model D too, it's nice no doubt, however compared to the Neutron, I would recommend to go for the Neutron instead of the Model D.

Yes, it's terrible all these decisions ;-) Why we all can not just win in the lottery, so at least we have one worry less? ;-)

Kind regards, Garfield.

One point about these presumably "Eurorack" synths: they already have cabs and power. So, if you remove them from those and put them in a larger Eurorack case, you then have to factor the cost of how much of that larger case is being taken up by the device into the actual price of the K2, Model D, etc. And this can get spendy; let's take an example from the Tiptop Mantis here...

The Mantis retails for $335 (using US pricing here, same principle applies in any currency) and has 208 hp of space. This means that each hp has a cost of approximately $1.61.

Now, the Behringer Neutron requires 80 hp if you opt to put it into a larger Eurorack case. 80 x $1.61 = about $128.85. The "base" cost of the unit is $289.99 (looking at Sweetwater right now), so the total for a Euroracked Neutron actually comes in at $418.84. Also, you lose 80 hp of cab space for modules that don't have power or housing by doing this, which means that if you want that 80 hp of space after all, you'll have to spring for another Mantis. Now we're looking at $753.84, and this is starting to get ridiculous.

So, recabbing an already-cabbed synth like a Neutron, Mother32, etc is actually a big fiscal mistake. Don't do it! If you go with this "patchable" route (not a bad idea, really), this is a surefire way of overrunning your costs.

I've just ordered a Neutron! Phew! One decision down, 999 to go :-)

Yes, 961 typo (now fixed). Apparently they are now available: https://www.thomann.de/gb/behringer_961_interface.htm

I really wanted an MS-20 back in the day, hence interest, but will likely give it a miss. Patching all this stuff together it going to be tough enough as it is :-)

@Ligia - wonderful!! :-)

I came across a post listing the cost per HP of various cases which was very interesting.

You're absolutely right. I wouldn't consider housing such a module in a rack (until I get one which fills wall!), mainly because of the loss of HP. I hadn't worked out the REAL cost which is even more frightening :-)

I'm still trying to decide on a case...

That 961 has nothing to do with V/Oct. Its purpose is converting different kinds of triggers. It can be useful with an MS-20/K-2, but for V/Oct to Hz/V conversion you'll need a different module. The G-Storm KVP does both. You already went for a Neutron, so no need for that, but I thought I'd mention it.

That's useful, thanks.

The K-2 and Eurorack is def not a road I'm going to go down. There are so many other amazing modules that work out the box so it really seems superfluous unless you really want to control its 'MS sound' from the rack and I can live without that :-)

Shame, though.

Even though the K-2 is a close. I'd have thought some clever software could have made the sockets Eurorack-compatible.

Ah well..

Hi Senor-Bling,

Thanks a lot, yes you are right, the 961 is for triggers only, not for the V/Oct to Hz/V conversion.

Kind regards, Garfield.

There ARE Eurorack modules that can standard-shift from Korg's standard to Euro and vice-versa, though.

Fact is, this is a bit of a throwback to the "bad ol' days" where there WERE a lot of different interfacing standards. Korg and Yamaha both used the Hz/V and negative trigger/gate standard, EML had their 1/12V steps, Moog had the awful, rotten, ROT-TEN S-trigger system, and things like the Buchla 100 were off in wackyland, with no real scaling and two different signal paths for audio and control signals. When MIDI came along, some of this was still going on...and remained as an annoying "latency" for those using the older gear. That we have to deal with these NOW is due to either exact replication (Korg's redux of the MS-20, or EMW's rework of the EML 200/300) or outright copying with no foresight to correcting these shortcomings (Behringer's you-name-it).

Do yourself a favor though, and grab an MS-20 mini on the used market (where there's plenty). Be careful to NOT buy an MS-20ic, though, as those were just gimmicky controllers for a software analog emulation system Korg kicked out many years back, and some unscrupulous/ignorant sellers try and foist these off as MS-20 minis. Look for the BLACK nut around the phones jack; the ic has a silver one. Anyway, even with the voltage standard issues, the MS-20 (of any sort) is a real face-ripper! It's hard to say what's the most fun about it, too...the VCF pair? The input section (drum machine + that = instant Aphex Twin!)? The fubar patching routings? Really, it's a fun little box, not to be idly dismissed. But do get the real thing; a lot of the point of that synth DOES depend on its form factor, which still works at 81% size.

Not heard of the MS-20ic. Interesting.

The desire for a MS-20 (or clone) is def a throwback for me :-) I lusted after one of these back in the day.

I had an original Roland 100M system but sold it when MIDI arrived - I saw the writing on the wall for analogue! :-) I don't regret it as I wanted polyphonic stuff. And not tempted even by Behringer's 100m-a-like.

I'm in the UK and most MS-20 mini sellers (ebay) want MORE than you can buy a new one for. Crazy. I wish my customers were as ignorant :-)

And I DO like the form factor as you say. The diff between a Behringer and the real thing over here is only about £180. The interest in the behringer was more a space issue and potential Eurorack connectivity.

At the time I also lusted after an ARP 2600. Really interested in Korg's re-issue - until I saw the price :-)

Oddly, I watched 3 demos on YT by Korg's Luke (I think), all basically the ame and done for different shops. Just scratched the surface but ultimately disappointing and cured me of my luisting :-) I just hope I don't see any really good demos... :-)

It's not like you or 99% of the rest of the people waiting for a KARP 2600 were going to get one anyway. Without a doubt, the "reissue" of that synth is probably Korg's moment of ultimate, crowning stupidity amongst a series of gaffes, starting with the release of the NONsyncable KR-mini and KR-55 Pro drum machines. These could've been stock-in-trade machines for the electro and retro-disco crowd IF they'd had that...but someone at Korg seems to have lost their mind, and then continued losing it. There's the inherent defects with the Prologues, reissuing the FS MS-20 in ugly-ass colors for $1400 (the original wasn't even close to that!) when the market is already saturated with electronically-identical MS-20 minis, and so on. For me, the last "safe" Korg was probably the Minilogue; I won't drop good money on their new stuff now until I see some judicious and overdue firings in their marketing and artist relations departments (for starters!).

At this pace, those a-holes will probably next reissue the MS-50...in a limited run of 12 for $5,000 because...well, why break a moronic trend, right?

EDITED May 23rd 2020, 16:47

I'll see if I can pre-order one... :-)

Must confess most of my music stuff has been in software for the last umpteen years. I'm thinking it would be nice to twiddle a few knobs as software is so hands off. So not up to speed with recent hardware developments.

M last remaining synth is a SY77 - if anyone's interested in buying it (needs new drive belt which I haven't got around to fixing.

I think my re-interest in hardware is partly driven by nostalgia. Now I can actually afford most of the stuff I couldn't when I was younger - but really struggle to justify it :-(

Yes, the 2600 is disappointing

It's not like you or 99% of the rest of the people waiting for a KARP 2600 were going to get one anyway. Without a doubt, the "reissue" of that synth is probably Korg's moment of ultimate, crowning stupidity amongst a series of gaffes, starting with the release of the NONsyncable KR-mini and KR-55 Pro drum machines. These could've been stock-in-trade machines for the electro and retro-disco crowd IF they'd had that...but someone at Korg seems to have lost their mind, and then continued losing it. There's the inherent defects with the Prologues, reissuing the FS MS-20 in ugly-ass colors for $1400 (the original wasn't even close to that!) when the market is already saturated with electronically-identical MS-20 minis, and so on. For me, the last "safe" Korg was probably the Minilogue; I won't drop good money on their new stuff now until I see some judicious and overdue firings in their marketing and artist relations departments (for starters!).

At this pace, those a-holes will probably next reissue the MS-50...in a limited run of 12 for $5,000 because...well, why break a moronic trend, right?
-- Lugia

i dunno they had a boatload of success from monotron up to the period you are talking about

i dunno they had a boatload of success from monotron up to the period you are talking about

-- euPothrou

Exactly my point. It doesn't matter if they kept hitting things out of the park with the Volcas, the Monotrons, the Mini and Monologues, the reissues of the MS-20 and Odyssey...all it takes is a string of really moronic moves, and gains even on THOSE levels can be negated. And the KARP 2600 FS is, as far as I'm concerned, one seriously rotten cherry on Korg's cake.

It's hard to believe that you could see a synth go from "most desired" to "most uncool" just by a massive marketing f**kup, but Korg managed it here. And I know of at least three retailers who, if they could wrap their fingers around the necks of whoever at Korg thought releasing only 500 units worldwide was a great idea, they'd squeeze until the "problem" got "dealt with", so to speak. Easily the greatest disappointment in synths since the Micor Coupland, and pretty much an invitation to Uli to come in and eat Korg's lunch.

I'll see if I can pre-order one... :-)

Must confess most of my music stuff has been in software for the last umpteen years. I'm thinking it would be nice to twiddle a few knobs as software is so hands off. So not up to speed with recent hardware developments.

M last remaining synth is a SY77 - if anyone's interested in buying it (needs new drive belt which I haven't got around to fixing.

...and speaking of recent hardware developments, you might want to have a peek at https://floppyusbemulator.com/product/n-drive-extreme-emulator-for-yamaha-sy77-sy99 No need to chuck that synth out because the FD is shot, and this sort of upgrade allows for MASSIVE storage of data that the FD could never pull off. My aim here is to eventually replace all floppy drives in my synths, samplers, etc with these; on something like my S6000, the ability to store multiple gigabytes of sample data on a thumb drive easily supercedes even the internal HD in speed and capacity.

...and speaking of recent hardware developments, you might want to have a peek at https://floppyusbemulator.com/product/n-drive-extreme-emulator-for-yamaha-sy77-sy99 No need to chuck that synth out because the FD is shot, and this sort of upgrade allows for MASSIVE storage of data that the FD could never pull off. My aim here is to eventually replace all floppy drives in my synths, samplers, etc with these; on something like my S6000, the ability to store multiple gigabytes of sample data on a thumb drive easily supercedes even the internal HD in speed and capacity.
-- Lugia

That's interesting. Also available in the UK from Amazon (if anyone's interested). However, it costs more than my SY77 is probably worth :-) Also, I don't use it and want rid of it. However, I do have some material on floppies which I'd like to save if poss. Interestingly, I no longer have a computer with a floppy drive!

Hi Ian,

For a few bucks you can buy a cheap USB floppy drive ;-) Then you are at least able to transfer your old stuff to your computer.

Hmm, they are not as cheap as I hoped for but one looks quite reasonable (amazon.co.uk).

Kind regards, Garfield.

Edit: Removed typo

EDITED May 24th 2020, 22:32

Hey Garfield

Thanks for taking al ook.

However, I've done without the into for donkeys so I guess it would be no big deal if it went to the grave with me :-)

The SY77 is the only hardware synth I have left so no others to back up.

Very useful to know, though, if anyone needs to use floppies.

Hey Ian,

Sorry, I meant to say floppy drive, not floppy disk.

Enjoy the planning phase of modular and look forward to hearing from you once you got your first modules and your first impression :-) Kind regards, Garfield.