ModularGrid uses so-called cookies to ensure it's so-called functionality. We also use dubious tracking scripts. Find out more in the Privacy Policy. We use cookies and wanna let you know.
I wanted to get some thoughts as I'm putting some final touches on the rack I'm going to build in the near future. I've got about 35% of the modules so far and things are working just how I want. I was hoping to see if anyone could point out some glaring gaps.
Everything is sequenced by a Digitakt (which also handles basic drum and sample duties), via midi (assimil8or + locotus) and a CVOCD for the melodic parts. The assimil8or is for resampling and mangling the analog stuff, glitches, chords, vocals, and some drums. Endless Processor is pretty much always for making pads. The rest of the top 2 rows are for a 1-2 melodic/lead voices.
The 2 gaps I'm aware of are mixing and mod/utilities. I have enough for barebones mixing but it would be nice to make some more room. I have a decent amount of modulation sources and mixers but no logic, sequencers, etc, which I am somewhat ok with for now, but still open to suggestions. I recognize that I'm being stubborn with effect/processor modules and would obviously ideally like to have all, but I guess curious if anyone has any thoughts on any of it.
Hey, I've been working on my setup for a while, and would love some advice.
This is my setup, it works alongside an Elektron Digitakt and my interface/Ableton. Sequencing, some triggers/gates and clocks come from Digitakt via CVOCD. Goal of the rack is to be able for sound design (both from scratch and processing external audio), genres are house, techno, dubstep, drumnbass, so all beat based, heavy bass and non-generative. everything gets mostly arranged in digitakt/ableton, so only need 1 voice at a time. which also makes me think that since its really just 1 voice i have enough modulation, envelopes, etc already, but maybe more mixers?
would love some advice on the rack. not sold on all of this, but ive been building in piefew and am very happy with what ive got so far. the bottom 2 rows are mostly audio and the top row is mostly the modulation.
im pretty much set with the audio stuff in there (brenso, angle grinder, 100grit, miamsa, altar, rabbit hole, belgrad) and some modulation (falistri, pams, zadar) but open to any suggestions! some other things i have my eye on: xaoc's Leibniz system, compressor/expander, envelope follower at least, and other than that not really sure. would love to hear suggestions on any additional audio processing that could be good, or if things look reptitive!
Are there any kinds of disadvantages to smaller modules? I’m probably being a bit gluttonous, but in my filter section I’d like to have a little taste of a couple different filters, so I’ve found an assortment that fits my needs. Curious if someone would think that 1 18hp filter would be a better move than 3 6hp filters. Just a thought. Probably will stick with the smaller filters cause they still sound great. But like is there a different kind of power/goodness in the ajh 14hp vcf vs 6hp transistor ladder filter.
Also any thoughts on the rack, areangement always appreciated. I use this alongside ableton and a sampler/drum machine to make house music. Modular is mostly for stabs/bass/leads.
After looking at the docs on Isla's site, one caveat here might be the audio output levels not matching normal synth signal levels. I'd suggest something like this: https://www.modulargrid.net/e/ladik-a-520-4ch-in-line-preamp Or rather, two of them, as that'll allow you to send ALL separate channels of the S2400 right into the modular's audio path. This then makes all of those play nice with the synth effects
-- Lugia
Thanks a lot for that suggestion! I had not thought about going this route. This might be the best way to go about it, and make some room for a panning mixer, either in the rack or external, and actually record everything that way I want in one take…
I was hoping I could get some commentary on my rack. I will be pairing my modular primarily with an external sampler (s2400 by Isla Instruments). The goal here is to use the sampler as a bit of a brain, housing drums, chords/leads/vocals, and whatever else. I can also use ableton wherever I’d like, as everything is being run through that.
The modular is there to serve as a “stab lab” creating mostly basslines (which I could sequence live alongside the sampler), as well as sample processing, pre and post s2400 (eg, warm up a break to then be chopped, or chop and then warm up). Eurorack also provides interesting effects like delays, convolution reverb, e560, Morpheus, vocoder and compressor.
There are also a bit of a bare minimum utility modules to be used as well.
Could potentially get some heat from thisb but the eurorack really will serve primarily in creating/processing samples, so I feel, while more utility (logic, random, s+h, etc) it may not be necessary yet since I’m sequencing through the Shuttle Control.
Would love any thoughts, any modules I could look out for, etc.
Took a little while but this is what I think it’s going to look like after taking Lugia’s suggestions into consideration. It doesn’t have every base covered but I think enough for right now. Expansion is certainly in the cards as I’d like to explore some things I don’t have in here, like logic, more random, in rack sequencing, and more sound sources.
Completely agree on the last point and appreciate you saying that. The idea is/has been really a big synth, one big voice, then I record and further mangle on the computer. So that’s how I’m thinking about it for now and use it. But love that you said that because you’re totally right, gotta keep my mind open.
F> Wailed on this...there was a lot there that was sort of superfluous once the organization process got going. This should make more overall sense, though:
OK...the top row is your oscillators and filters, plus a Veils after the oscillators for level control of those. Also, the crossover is up there at the upper left, as it makes more sense to use it to slice up the frequency domain of an external signal.
Second row: modulation, save for the Schippmann Compressor at the end. Notice that the waveshaper from the top row is now down here (for tampering with modulation waveforms) and I replaced the top row one with a design based on the Buchla 259's wavefolder.
Third row: This starts with a Konstant Labs PWRchekr, which I often put into builds where you have no DC rail indicators so that you can keep an eye on those. Then the entire external thing was swapped out for a Nonlinear Envelope Follower...this has a mono audio preamp, but it also extracts the incoming envelope for modulation use as well as sends a gate when the input level is high enough, and does all of this in 4 hp. Then the noise...but since the envelope generation situation here was so insufficient that I yanked all of the previous ones and put in a pair of Zadars with Nin expanders, which now brings your envelope total to eight. After those are all of your main effects; I took that down to a Timizoara multiprocessor, Kaminiec delay, and Springray reverb head, then put in a Ladik AUX mixer so that you can sum down the effects to a single stereo AUX return but still have control over the incoming levels. After this, I added a Beads for all sorts of granular mayhem, then the Resonant EQ is down at the end.
Fourth row: Starts with the MIDI interface, then a WMD Tool Box gives you a number of useful utilities in just 6 hp. ANA is next, then since we're screwing around with CV values, I put in a Joranalogue dual window comparator to pick off gate signals from all sorts of incoming signals. After that, I put in a Frequency Central logic module, which together with the previous couple of modules now gives you more potential gate complexity for firing off the triple S&H after it. Then there's your Nutone distorter and Vocoder in the pre-mixer slots. For the main mixer, I dropped in a Toppobrillo Stereomix2 which gives you VCA control over levels, panning, AUX send levels, mutes on all inputs, a CUE send function which can be very useful for checking things on the fly, such as tuning, and a full AUX loop with a mono out and stereo return. The mixer's outs go before the last two modules...I used the River tilting Baxandall EQ as a post-mixer "tone" control and the stereo field adjustment is right after that and before your main outs.
Now THIS seems to be a lot more balanced. The layout is certainly easier to navigate with your primary synth functions all grouped together, as well. My impression is that it's still a little thin on sources, but the rest of the system is now up to snuff, I think, and you've got plenty of possibilities for faking things so that the build can SEEM to have more sources than it actually does.
-- Lugia
Interesting. Going to take a moment to wrap my head around this, but definitely more coherent flow. Goes a little bit against what I was thinking but I like it. Thanks especially with the utilities. Sound sources are definitely on the more minimal side. The whole thing will typically be for designing/mangling one sound at a time, so can use as many/all or as little of the modules available. So I might slim down on the mixer but otherwise makes a lot more sense.
I keep messing around with it. I think it makes sense to make most/all of the top row mod stuff. Would love suggestions on what could fit in there and satisfy most of my needs
Doesn't seem workable to me. Those utilities that you don't think are necessary are, in fact, VERY necessary. Same goes for the modulation sources and the modules needed to properly control them.
I've done plenty of work over the years with "deterministic" sounds as well...but the difference is that while I might have a certain module or two that I know I want to feed a sound through, I also know that a sound is far more interesting to a listener if it's doing something more than just sitting in the mix like a bump on a log. So, the choice of operating modality for that would be either...
-- Lugia
Hey Lugia - I appreciate the feedback. I’m not sure when you saw the rack but I’ve been changing it a bit for exactly those reasons, adding more modulation and movement. I guess what I don’t understand is - what is your definition of a basic fm patch? I’ve heard 2 vco’s, a wave folder, lpg, vcas and envelopes. Lfos there too. Why does this not at least satisfy the basic definition?
And if you could, would love to hear what exactly I’m missing out of this. More vcas? 8 lfos with ochd so the pmw is there for synced lfos and everything else, trying to use the empty space in the top for an envelope solution, I have a ajh contour generator now but considering other options, tirana for super basic sequencing, and orbit 3 for some random. It doesn’t cover every base but I feel it’s covering a lot. I’d love to know what you’d suggest to add/switch around with this.
I’ve been working on building and completing this rack for a bit of time now, and I am getting quite close!
The 2 main uses are :
1- a basic fm/subtractive voice
2- taking audio from Ableton and processing it
There’s definitely a lot of stuff packed into this and not a huge amount of utilities. That’s because the way I work is very deterministic, so I’ll be working on 1 sound at a time, sequencing from Ableton to Shuttle Control. Could definitely use more lfos/envelopes and probably another couple vcas for sure, but I think I could definitely get by with just this for a while.
Wanted to post this rack that I’ve been working on that is semi complete but lots of room for change. I use this rack in a very deterministic (non generative) way. It’s all controlled from various controllers and ableton through an Endorphines Shuttle Control in a separate rack. That rack also has 4 adsrs, maths, pamelas new workout, ochd, s&h, couple vcas and noise modules, as well as line in.
This rack here is for making leads, baselines, hooks whatever from the top section. Also used as a way to mangle samples. Understood that it’s a bit specific and might be different. I think of it as a sound source/processor that gets recorded track by track, so no need for a big mixer or multiple voices. Ie, use everything for a kick drum then record, then make a lead and record, and so on.
Would welcome any thoughts or suggestions. Thanks!
I've been slowly building my modular system over the last 6 months. I've gone through several phases of what I want out of it, and the conclusion I've come to is this system.. or something like it.. or not.. who knows..
Premise:
- Control Skiff with Endorphines Shuttle Control, being driven by Squarp Pyramid. Control skiff also includes my envelope generators, plus maybe extra modulation/attenuators/verters.
- 2 voices plus drums. I have the option (kind of) of multitracking because I have several inputs on my interface, but honestly I don't think this case will ever need it because I'm focusing on studio production, so recording and overdubbing is most likely how I'll be using this, rather than for live use.
- I have a feeling that some who look at the rack will yell at me that I don't have enough CV or VCAs, but honestly this style has been working for me since its very determinstic dance music, and it isn't for live/generative/multitracking, so I can use what I have efficiently.. I think.
It is 2 voices, plus drums:
- Mannequins Mangrove + Radical Frequencies DPVCO, this can be further modulated by the Serge Ring, HN FM Aid, and the Bifold, and then with several different mixing options into the ACL Ladder Filter.
- Doepfer Quad Precision VCO into their quad vca and filter, and then I have the E440 and Three Sisters to further filter and modulate things. I'm thnking about other additions here, such as the Xaoc phaser or an EQ (maybe AJH finalizer) or something else to make these chords/pads sound nice. At the end of the chain is the Xaoc delay.
Drums are handled mostly by the Rossum Assimil8or with analog kick coming from BD909. As I mentioned earlier, I will not be multitracking, so I can actually use any combination of the processors in my rack for drum sounds. Plus the 100Grit seems like itll fit nicely to dirty up those samples.
Bottom row is my CV/modulation. It's not much... but I feel like its getting close to enough, Ochd, PNW, Maestro/E355 (not totally sold on these). Attenuators etc, and I have some more 1u attenuverters.
Think that covers everything. Thanks for checking out the post, let me know what you think!
One thing I'd suggest about the 2 hp gap in the bottom (sequencing) cab: drop in one of 2hp's Logic modules. This way, you can use TWO Pam's outs that "conflict" with each other in how they're programmed to create even more complex and elaborate clock behavior.
-- Lugia
I bet you could get something as complex/interesting if not more so from (a) different manufacturer(s) in fewer hp - might be more modules though!!! - but I was really meaning the random sampling!
-- JimHowell1970
Gotcha! That makes sense. And totally agreed with the Random Sampling. Thanks again, mate.
@jasper_t I saw the name check accidentally (try @ before the name and notifications kick in)
Jim, thank you very much for the insights! Unfortunately, MG jumbled up the image, so for example, the Rample is no longer in there.. Bummer that this happens sometimes! If you click on the rack, or check out this screenshot, this is accurate: https://cdn.modulargrid.net/img/racks/modulargrid_1469126.jpg
I think MG was showing an older version of my rack, but still - could you further explain format jumbler modules? Or just what you mean by this name.
But I hear you and appreciate that. I think you are right, especially with some larger modules that could probably be broken down into smaller pieces and give me some more room. The Verbos stuff is a good example of this, I do really love the sound and functionality of the Complex Oscillator, but I've been thinking that I could replace it with a Gen 3 and another osc or something like that, but that would cost a couple extra utility modules as well.
Also I am in the US, so I think the output modules have to stay.
I've been looking through this forum and slowly building my own rack for only about 4 months now. I've been working with synths otherwise for a long time. This rack is not even close to complete in real life, but I've been enjoying playing around with future "goal" racks. Would love to hear any thoughts or suggestions.
Quick explanation: This is a Doepfer A-100 (9U/84hp) and an Intellijel Palette (4u/104hp). The 1u row will be mostly attenuverters (8-16 in total). The Palette is the "control" skiff, ER101/102 is driving the 4 voices. Circadian Rhythm will be driving another rack dedicated to drum modules. The 4 voices consist of: Mannequins Mangrove, Verbos Complex Oscillator, Recovery Jupiter Spirits, and Mungo G0, which all go through a filter/vca to the ADDAC mixer, and then multitracked out for more processing.
The music I'm making is pretty beat oriented and intentional, so I'm not really going for a "generative" build. I want to tell it what to do, with some extra random wiggling. Not to say that those types of utilities are not necessary as well.
Modules I do not have that I thought might be useful:
- Tiptop MISO
- Doepfer Matrix Mixer
- Verbos Random Sampling
Ultimately, I'm pretty sold on the rest of the rack, especially as far as oscillator+filters go. I am now trying to figure out how to squeeze the most utility/modulation into the remaining portion of the rack. I always hear the advice (I like the way JimHowell puts it I think), sound sources < sound modifiers < modulation < utilities... something like that.. and while I do not have the same feelings he does yet, I'm pretty sure he's closer to right than I am! Regardless, the bones of this system which I do have has been working out really well for me! So just wondering here how to continue thoughtfully growing this case.
Hi @Lugia, I did some rethinking and got rid of the Bataleur (it had a noise issue as well). Working with this rack now. Much simpler and it sounds good so far. Trying to figure out what else could be a nice addition to this rack now. I'm thinking about a BBD delay, maybe an EQ, also thinking about trying to squeeze in a bass voice with the addition of another row. Reverb and delay are coming outside of the modular.
thanks
First up, separating your modulation/CV from your audio generators and modifiers is a really, REALLY bad idea. For one thing, if you wanted to use a logic gate as a waveshaper (which can be quite neat...results in nasty pulse waves!), you'd have to run a long cable all the way to the other cab, connect to the gate, then another long run back to your audio chain. This is just one example, and I know there's tons of others, but the point is that working this way is VERY inefficient and unintuitive. Remember: one of the strongest points to modular synthesis is that there's a certain degree of interchangeability between things that make noise, things that modify noise, and things that make those two things happen. And having everything in one place, as one unitized whole, is a thing that modular is prized for.
Second, if you have a stereo out here, where's the stereo mixer to feed the stereo out with a proper stereo image? I see a lot of HYUUJE (and in a couple of instances, pointlessly so) modules in a tiny 2 x 84 cab, crowding out any of the room you'll need for other things (VCAs, mixers, modifiers, etc etc) that make these big, expensive modules work to their fullest. This promises to turn into a problem pretty quickly if the target here is "3-4 voices"; if I were to use the DTM mixer as the primary qualifier of how many voices you ACTUALLY have, I'd pin that total at "1".
Remember, a "voice" isn't JUST a VCO. It's the signal chain that goes from a VCO, through a VCF for timbral modification, then through a VCA for amplitude modification. You simply don't have that here, ergo you're not even on track to having those 3-4 voices. You might (read: SHOULD) want to rethink what you're doing here, jettison the idea of splitting the modular functions up into separate cabs, and reconsider putting everything where it belongs...in the same case. It'll make what you're up to a lot clearer in the end.
-- Lugia
Hey @Lugia, thanks for the input. I hear you loud and clear and thanks for pointing me in the right direction.
Without showing you a picture, the setup is small enough where there are no long cables necessary (A100 and Intellijel 108hp that are perpindicular to eachother), but you're totally right when I start growing my set up. This was really just to make up for having a small case and the opportunity to add a smaller case to the mix.
Stereo out in this case could come from Out 1 + 2 of the ER301, but at the moment I'm actually just playing with using those 2 as individual mono outs from each Optomix out to the interface. Seeing how mixing in Ableton works and for producing purposes. So we'll see.
I like the voices, I know it takes up a lot of room (remember there is another 104hp row that is currently not smartly housing cv). I felt the Birdkids was an interesting choice vs AJH Minimod VCO and VCF (which is what i was considering). Verbos is a little big but I love it and doesnt really need a filter IMO. But I hear you on the signal path, etc being the point of a whole voice (though I would say I have 3 definite voices atm in this system, not sure why you disagree, understood its minimal), and thats making me reconsider on the ER301 path.
The ER301 is really just something I was thinking about that could solve some purposes/was having a crisis and rethinking things. Thank you for putting things back into perspective. I was just 1) figuring out my mixing situation that works best with my producing workflow and multitracking, 2) reverbs dont feel like a strongsuit of eurorack when I can use Eurorack or a OTO Bam, 3) I haven't found the sampler that I love yet, been thinking the Mungo G0.
Hey there, this rack is just audio, sequencing+CV is done elsewhere
I'm starting to move in the direction of multitracking my eurorack system, to then be mixed in Ableton. I think this makes the most sense for my setup, though I am not sure about the workflow side of things. I'd prefer to stay OTB but Ableton provides 1) so much more flexibility for mixing and mastering 2) reverb/ambience/effects I think makes a lot of sense ITB 3) sampling probably makes more sense ITB, but I like the vibe of sampling OTB. Well regardless - my setup will consist of 3-4 voices that will be sent to Ableton from Happy Nerding Isolator (or 2, as 4xmono outs) to my Apollo Interface.
I have been thinking that an ER 301 could be a really good addition to this setup because it adds sampling/granular stuff, can be a sort of final mix/master before hitting the computer, could also add in reverb and delay stuff, also as additional VCAs, plus all of the other good stuff in there. But then I start thinking that all of that could be done by skipping the ER 301 and using the computer... But that sounds like a lot less fun, though more clinical.
Sorry for the rant and not a very clear question. Would love to hear any thoughts on the rack, multitracking, ER301, or my specific situation. Just trying to flesh out the best workflow that allows me to have fun, make good music, and mix that music properly. Thanks a lot.
Nice start! Here are my recommendations and suggestions:
logic module like Intellijel Plog or WMD/SSF Toolbox super useful.
sequential switch like Doepfer, Erica Synths or other switch to create fun patches
good complex sequencer My Eloquencer was a game changer for my workflow on modular and I won't build another rack without a good sequencer.
delay and distortion would be nice:
percussion:
-- sacguy71
Sacguy, thanks a lot for the suggestions!! Very helpful. Especially the thinking about a good euro rack sequencer. I’ve been trying to hold off on moving away from the Pyramid until I can be more firmly in eurorack, but simpler sequencers like the metropolis really interest me for good riffs, also something like those you suggested look really inspiring too!
Been playing with this rack for a bit now and it’s great. For the time being, I’ve got sound sources all set. And have about right above the bare minimum of sound support (vca, filters). Stereo mixer was a mistake and will be switching that for a quad mono mixer with sends (topobrillo stereomix). The more I play with the Desmodus Versio the more I like it, I think adding a delay (Xaox Sarajewo) would be fun, also thought about something like a Instant LoFi. The Tallin is actually doing a solid job of taking an output from ableton and bringing that into the rack.
As for the CV side in the bottom row, I like PMW but I would rather move towards dedicated modules (replacing that with Batumi and maybe Tempi) and adding something for random (Verbos). Limited space in this setup but in the future I will be adding a Mantis case to then house the audio and expand, and have the 84 wide A100 for drums.
Welcome and thoughts and opinions. Here are some tunes that I’ve put together this weekend mostly from the modular and a Vermona DRM, and a few ableton samplers, all controlled by Squarp Pyramid.
Looks like everythings back... After some more thought, I think its possible to make a Cs-l work in there (though this will probably be a purchase later on down the road if it’s working out) . Might be tight on VCAs/Mixers if I try to go for a standard 3/4 voice setup, but if they are all talking to eachother, I think it could work. Put in the Bastl Grandpa to make the sample voice a little more functional and less static. Belgrad also seems like a great complement filter to add some character and also having a varied sound to get some different stuff out of it. Also moving away from the effects thinking, just the 2hp delay and the Desmodus Versio (as send effect) would fit everything I need.
Ultimately, if I can make this many voices work in such a small space, I think this will be able to cover a really nice variety of sounds. And the modulation allows for some exciting intermingling of control.
I’ve been making some good progress on my rack and was hoping I could get some feedback.
Would be nice to hear if anything you think is entirely missing. Also what else to fill in the rest. Seriously considering finishing the top row up with a second Mangrove - but on second thought the Cs-l sound amazing, and it fits perfectly, but definitely gets tight on mixers/vcas... Other things I’m considering:
I’m looking for another sound source, but not exactly. 2 voices could be totally fine, but I think I’m considering adding something like an Arbhar to like spice things up a bit, not entirely sure. More effects sounds like the way to spread out my 2 sound sources to become many more things.
another filter (more on the fun/sound design side, not too interested in like QPAS but could be wrong)
a cold mac
a waveshaper or a phaser or Feedback Juno 106 chorus
another oscillator: either to a) modulate/carry and fm pair with mangrove, HO as well (could be ts-l, or anti-osc, or generate 3), or b) as another sound source, was thinking something like a basimilus would be fun but it’s a little too much. I’m trying to get closer to lead sounds because I just gravitate to bass stuff, so really open to suggestions here. The sample player is there for things like chords mostly (maybe vocals) so some kind of harmonic content in a way like that could be nice (thinking telharmonic/saich but they seem to have too much of a sound and can’t vary far from it) otherwise was also thinking of some Random Source stuff like the NTO and the VCFQ/VCFS. Also, have not been thrilled by the sounds of fm/complex synthesis just yet. Getting there with modulating the mangrove, though. So have given serious thought to a second mangrove.
Not sold on anything in the current rack except for the Verbos Harmonic Oscillator, Mannequins Mangrove and the Three Sisters. I am mainly thinking about how to best expand/complement these 3. Organic, warm. Thanks.
Edit: switched to a mantis to give it some more room..
Did some thinking and I think I got it close to a nice 3 voice system. All audio in a Doepfer 6u 84hp case and modulating/sequencing in an Intellijel 104hp palette. Sequencing done externally from Squarp Pyramid.
Hi all,
I've been working on this rack for a bit now, going back and forth, as one does... I am still very much a beginner but I do own some of these modules and others will be coming soon.
effects:
- MN Desmodus Versio
- Instruo Arbhar (coming soon)
CV/utilities:
- MN Maths
- Pamela's new workout
- currently have a MI Stages that will be replaced by incoming Batumi and Quadrax
Looking to add:
- CV VCA's (the 1u vcas are just an idea right now)
- looking to add a new filter.. still looking around, might get the Jove but who knows
- Looking to add another oscillator... open to ideas but no rush here either - loving the Vampire and Saich. The Mannequins Mangrove, Just Friends, and the Verbos Harmonic Oscillator have caught my attention..
- Really interested in more effects/sound processors.. just got the Instruo Tanh waveshaper/limiter which I love but its more of a saturator/limiter than a waveshaper i think. Looking into getting a dedicated delay module like the Xoac Sarawejo, but get some interesting delay/reverbs from the Desmodus Versio. The Xaoc phaser module looks pretty interesting too.
Everything is being sequenced by a Squarp Pyramid going into the Befaco Midi-CV module. That covers note sequencing, but with the Saich some kind of shift register device might be super helpful so looking at the Intellijel Shifty. I feel like I have the room to get a Quad VCA for cv mixing, but would like something more interesting to play with if possible, especially if the 1u VCAs would cover most/all of my VCA needs. The audio mixing isn't quite there either, I haven't been able to find the Cosmix mixer, which means that I have no aux sends at the moment. I'm considering getting multiple small reverbs/delays/fx units to use as inserts with different voices rather than a global send, but not sure if I have the room for this.
Would love to hear any thoughts on the build, how you see it growing, any interesting things that I may be missing (always interested in unique sequencing and stuff you can only do in modular (ie sequential switches) but I already have sequencing covered and not enough room to get it done as efficiently in the rack. As said, interested in sound processors as well as another oscillator that might add something new/interesting to this.
Also, since sequencing is done out, I don’t have a great way of creating chords for the Straich. Harmonaig is too big as are most of the alternatives I’ve seen. The Quantimor by Topobrillo looks to be the closest to what I want but it’s discontinued. Intellijel Shifty might be the move?
Lastly, I’ve got an Apollo Interface with a bunch of inputs, so potentially could only submit in the rack and have a second stereo output. Is this common at all? Any good modules for this?
Really appreciate that insight Lugia. That’s good shit, thank you. The BIA just seems so easy to make it sound reallllly nice. But that’s cool, thanks for pushing me towards experimentation rather than ease of use.
I still found a good deal on the Milky Way so I think I’ll keep that as an send fx instead of the spring em.. so I’m really into the fat sound of the Mangrove but I can’t find one for sale.. and moving that spring for the Milky Way gives me some hp. Any suggestions for a good (phat) (weird) oscillator (analog) to replace the mangrove with (and pair with the e350)?
(I also can’t find that mixer for sale, but it looks really sick so I’m willing to wait)
Other than that, super excited. And even with what I’ve got confirmed (in my mind) super happy with and know I can build from there. So really appreciate your help mate.
Cheers.
Two Plaits is much more necessary than you think. True, there's plenty of synths that only have one VCO...but then, when you have TWO, you can then detune one ever so slightly and get a much fatter, beefier result. When I put those together, my intention was to aim things toward a VERY big, massive bass sound there. That's physics at work...the detuning causes all sorts of extra sonic phenomena due to the two oscillators phasing against each other. When the phasing is nice and slow, then you get phase reinforcement...sort of the sonic equivalent of 2 + 2 = 5 Or, with some of the Plaits waveforms, that's more like 2 + 2 = 17.6! Trust me on this one...I've left a nice "body count" of damaged subs, broken windows and such, and even some minor structural damage over many years in the wake of some of my bass patches.
-- Lugia
Two Plaits is much more necessary than you think. True, there's plenty of synths that only have one VCO...but then, when you have TWO, you can then detune one ever so slightly and get a much fatter, beefier result. When I put those together, my intention was to aim things toward a VERY big, massive bass sound there. That's physics at work...the detuning causes all sorts of extra sonic phenomena due to the two oscillators phasing against each other. When the phasing is nice and slow, then you get phase reinforcement...sort of the sonic equivalent of 2 + 2 = 5 Or, with some of the Plaits waveforms, that's more like 2 + 2 = 17.6! Trust me on this one...I've left a nice "body count" of damaged subs, broken windows and such, and even some minor structural damage over many years in the wake of some of my bass patches.
-- Lugia
Two Plaits is much more necessary than you think. True, there's plenty of synths that only have one VCO...but then, when you have TWO, you can then detune one ever so slightly and get a much fatter, beefier result. When I put those together, my intention was to aim things toward a VERY big, massive bass sound there. That's physics at work...the detuning causes all sorts of extra sonic phenomena due to the two oscillators phasing against each other. When the phasing is nice and slow, then you get phase reinforcement...sort of the sonic equivalent of 2 + 2 = 5 Or, with some of the Plaits waveforms, that's more like 2 + 2 = 17.6! Trust me on this one...I've left a nice "body count" of damaged subs, broken windows and such, and even some minor structural damage over many years in the wake of some of my bass patches.
-- Lugia
I very much appreciate you taking a shot at the rack. It makes so much sense. I've got something to work towards. Thanks a lot!!!!
Wasnt sure if 2 plaits would be necessary so fit in the Basimilus and a Milky Way FX instead of the Spring (I know I said I didn't want that lol)
This was getting close, so I opted to throw down on it. Vide:
The layout is still the same, although I put the audio out on the bottom row so that all cables to/from the rig will be on the lower tier. Otherwise, this retains the "audio up/mod down" layout.
I reworked the audio row considerably. The Morphing Terrarium and Mangroves now are set to submix (or not) through the Optomix LPGs, and I replaced the Plaits with two 3rd-party builds of it. But these now are set to feed through the Samara, and the LPGs can ALSO go through this for various mixing + waveshaping transformations. Filters next, then I tossed in one of Doepfer's new micro series dual VCAs (one per VCF) before the stereo performance mixer. And "spring" reverb got added, with the Purrtronics Purrvrrb spring emulator; you'll likely feed this through the mixer's AUX out and then return it to one of the non-AUXed stereo channels. Once the audio mix is set, this then feeds down to the transformer-isolated stereo out.
Modulation row starts with a little 1 hp sliver...that's a Konstant Labs PWR Checker, gives you visual feedback on your power rail status. VERY useful as an early warning if something might be going awry with your P/S. Then starting with the Poti (the expander for the Batumi), things get entertaining. I put the Roti next to this so that you have it handy as an inverting mixer for the Batumi specifically, and anything else in general that you might mix with it. This allows fast programming of weird, nonrepeating LFO curves. I then paired the Maths and Quadrax by putting the Qx between them so that they can actually play off of each other if desired. A dual ADSR follows for your audio VCF/VCA purposes, and there's one of Mutable's new 10 hp Veils revisions there so that if you need any of it for audio, it's perfectly situated...and if you need them for modulation level control, they're convenient for that, too.
What's nice about this is that it's turned out that you have a solid audio path and a solid modulation complement...but in both of those paths, you can get VERY complicated with your patching and turn each row into its own gigantic "composite module" if you felt like it. In the end, this now seems to be a solid instrument...in a very real sense!
-- Lugia
I've changed things up a bit with this rack, but I think its starting to come together, also will be getting the Mantis case to get some more HP.
Would appreciate any input on if it makes sense on first glance and if there might be some other important things to add in there.
The Plaits is in there because it'll be the first module I get, but when the case gets to this point it is very possible that it won't make it in there, though the extra full synth voice could be nice to have. Was thinking of maybe adding a small Doepfer spring reverb to make the Plaits shine a bit more.
Other than that, the idea I'm going for is something like this:
- E350 can be used as a growly wavetable, or an LFO for the Mangrove
- Could potentially try to add another filter in there to make the E350 and the Mangrove their own separate voices (though the Dual Borg might be enough)
- Bottom row is obviously the modulation and envelopes, I wanted to add some random in there as well as just a solid amount of modulation for my sound sources
- Something that I'm excited by is taking these sound sources a step further in the processing direction, but need something more focused/special than a 2hp DSP effects module... though I'm sure they're great... I just want to have as much control over the processing as possible... Filters are a great example, which reminds me that a waveshaping module might be a good addition. Mimeophon, Clouds, etc could be interesting additions as well, but not totally sold just yet.
- Admittedly, I kind of threw in the Optomix and Quad VCA just because I know I'll need them but haven't had the chance to fully think it through to see if they might be repetitive, or if some other utility modules would be a better option.
Again - sequencing from my Squarp Pyramid, and drums are handled from 2 external drum machines. All going into my Apollo audio interface.
That's what I was thinking! Your rig looks really interesting. Your rig really makes me think about 1) how much modulation is necessary (I think I might move some things around because PNW, Maths, Batumi, Stages, and Quadra seems very unnecessary), and 2) how many oscillators is a good amount.
Your rack seems like the opposite of mine.. a lot of oscillators and very little (?) modulation?
The Hexmix VCA + Quadrax/Kermit seems really interesting... Quad VCA + Quadrax might be enough for me.
Do you think Links/Kinks could help save some space and replace some functionality of the modulation sources I've got? (PNW, Maths, Batumi, Stages) I'm thinking that even without more, I'd like to get rid of the stages..
May I ask what you're using the Sequential Switch for most of the time?
This is what I'm playing with now:
Got a little bit of space, so could try to add some of the things Lugia suggested (logic, attenuverters, more VCAs), I could bring the Stages back, I could add some effects..
So...how would you send an inverted envelope to your Sisters VCF?
Oh, snap! No attenuverters! C'mon guys...also, I would suggest some more VCAs be added, since this thing's got ample modulation sources but there's only four VCAs in evidence that can be used for either the audio OR the modulation/CV level control.
Now, while it might be possible to take this to a two-voice paraphonic system in a space of 2 x 84, this would work loads better in a 2 x 104. Something like a Mantis might be a better pick here. With the extra space, also, you can easily add some attenuverters, a bit of logic to screw with your timing, and make two PROPER voices with two VCOs each, their own VCFs and VCAs, summing down to a proper stereo mixer. And if you were to go with an Intellijel 7U x 104, you'd then have the tile row for some of your basic functions, such as audio I/O, MIDI interfacing, etc. That's what I would recommend, tbh.
-- Lugia
Hi Lugia - Thank you for the insight! Interesting to hear your thoughts on the next steps of this rack, and on the bigger case. I wish I could find the Intellijel 7u for sales somewhere!
I'm kind of on the fence about getting a 208hp case vs the 168hp.. Since this is just the beginning, there's definitely a lot of room for things. I actually also, once this 2 voice system is complete, I'd want to make a rack for percussion/drums, so starting with this 168hp case might work down the road and just swap it for my percussion case at some point... haven't decided yet.
What I am most confused about though, is how you see the evolution of this system as a proper 2 paraphonic voice system... I can't decide if I'm just lusting for cool oscillators because they're fun, or if I really need 4 oscillators in this system. I'm confused on how you would suggest going about this, especially with the Plaits and the BIA in the case, I feel like those are 2 sound sources that might be hard to complement... of course I could be wrong.... do you see it as simply playing the Plaits and an analog osc with the same sequence, going to the same filter and becoming 1 sound? (a simplification)
I kind of like the idea of just 2 voices and then processing and making them powerful (phat) and interesting on their own... and then I just feel lame because they are 2 of the most common digital oscillators, which hurts my analog lust, but these 2 might be totally the best bang for my buck.
So as far as the case now, with Lugia's great comments, I am not a couple of steps back, which is no problem at all! I am curious how to combine another oscillator with the Plaits and BIA in a system like this.
Thanks a lot for your comments! I will be thinking/working on this and hopefully come back here for some more comment.
Yes you may! Very cool oscillator. Thanks for the suggestion, that might be perfect.
Here's the link to the updated rig. This is what I've put together as of now. It will be a gradual process to completion to I'm sure there will be changes along the way. Will start with a core and build out, but a roadmap is always helpful.
Thanks for the info on the /W. I knew it was probably not the best call. Mannequins seems like a lot of fun though as a company.
I'm not sure you need a Samara and an MVP both, so I dropped the MVP.
In my personal experience, I wouldn't say Rings is actually a great techno voice, so I swapped it for a Manis Iteritas.
I'm not familiar with the Stereo Dipole, but it's a lot of HP. I swapped it with a Viol Ruina and a Ripples 2020 both of which work for techno in different ways, and give you different filter characters to play around with.
I added an Intellijel Quad VCA as I'm not sure you'll always want to use an LPG, and you could use a submixer in here anyway.
You need some effects imo so I added a Happy Nerding FX Aid XL, I have an FX Aid and it's a nice module with a ton of range.
Put in a Disting Mk4 because in a rig this size you can always use a Disting to fill different holes.
Add a Peaks clone, opening up a bunch more functions in a small-ish package, including the ability to run drums in the rack if you want to.
@troux, thanks a lot for the feedback. Helped me think about this a little bit more completely. I've updated what I think a more complete rack would look like:
Switched things up as far as modules and layout, but not too much different from your recommendations. I'm most unsure about the 3rd voice. Your NE suggestion is great, I think that Basimilus will add a lot to this. For some reason I'm really excited about Plaits as well. The 3rd voice, I think ideally I want a nice analog osc. Not too much space in the rig but I think I can make something happen. Also I really like the 2 filter suggestion, not committed to these two but theyre a great start. I have 9hp left so could throw the disting and some other things to make the dixie work. I'm not really sold on the disting, I'd rather, philosophically, get something with a more defined purpose. But still open to it. I'm not really sure if the wavefolder is necessary, but I think it could be fun. Same with the SCLPL.
Very interested in sound processing modules if you have any suggestions.
It feels like the top row is a lot of modulation, but I think it fits with the bottom row being a lot of mod receivers.
Thanks a lot for the feedback. Helped out a lot.
Cheers
**Update: I think this looks pretty good after some additional thought. Let me know what you think.
Hi everyone, very recently started my modular journey. Still in the planning stages, but I would really appreciate some advice as I’m sure I’m missing something...
This is what I’ve started putting together. The bottom row is a bit more thought out, and closer to what I’d like to start with. Sequencing to Plaits is from my Squarp Pyramid, which is also master clock to Pamela. Drums are done outside of the rack.
I started working on the top row as well, which would be a second voice, etc. I think I might need a sequencer when I get to the top row because the squarp only has enough for sequencing one CV (or I could get an ES FH to turn the midi to cv).
I would appreciate any comments, thoughts, or suggestions.
