@nickgreenberg That touches on what I liked about the Nerdseq demo I watched -- you can punch in exact CV voltages and program specific numbers for a lot of different parameters. Here's the start of their tutorial series. I'm not sure if it does everything the USTA does, but it's a mite bit less expensive. I like patching so I don't want to get too many "mini-computers" for my system, but this one's def on my list to try at some point.
Hey @9xpad, I'm pretty new to modular too but, -- what @Greenfly said, I'd second. I have the Doepfer A-135-2 Quad VCA and was also confused at first. You need to feed an audio signal to the IN, feed the OUT into your mixer that sends the audio out to whatever speakers or external sound source you have. Set the mixer level to something audible, but set both VCA knobs to zero. Plug an ADSR envelope or LFO output into the "CV" jack on the VCA module, then slowly dial up the "CV" knob until you start to hear something. Whatever envelope you're feeding in should now be modulating the audio signal -- so if it is an oscillator drone, say, with a cycling sawtooth LFO applied, it will start chopping itself up into the sawtooth shape accordingly.
If you're getting clicking, whatever you're feeding into the CV probably has zero attack/decay slope (like a rectangle wave). Use a softer wave or slew or ADSR type envelope generator to eliminate those. You might also have something dialed in too high.
It took me a while to get used to, because I was so used to audio sources that had triggers/gates built into them fundamentally -- you trigger the sound, and it already has some kind of envelope controlling the audio applied. With a lot of modular it's just the opposite. The sound is always "on" and you have to engineer backwards to mute and control it. It's super fun but takes a little getting used to, and I still have plenty more to absorb/learn, bc like Lugia mentions there's other uses for VCAs as well.
the 'by far the best' manufacturer of mutable instruments is - mutable - ergonomically sound and great support, plus the original designer gets the money not some guy(s) who took a github plan for a module and shrunk it - mi also have great support!
I'm not sure I follow ... does Mutable Instruments oppose or have an issue with the clone builds? I'd assume that me buying one of those isn't any different than me getting a DIY and paying someone with more experience to build it, and many of the clones seem to have additional features not including in the MI version and/or attempt to improve the aesthetics or UI. Does this practice negatively impact MI in some way? It seems so prevalent that I guess I just assumed MI made these designs open source by choice and had no problem with the existing market for its designs.
Beyond that, thanks for the recommendations so far, though I am curious for more answers regarding those who have used the clone-brands and the originals -- is there really a negative difference w/ the clones? Senior-bling mentions that the clones are less "fun," -- but what's that mean to you? Do you mean the smaller sizes just make the knobs harder to navigate and work with? You mention 3 clones you've used that were superior to the MI versions -- have you used others that are inferior? If so, why?
I'm not trying to nit-pick here, I tend to prefer to go "original manufacturer" myself when possible -- I'm just trying to understand the rationale, when the clone brands would seem, at a glance, to generally offer the same or better functionality for a lower price. (Good technical support is great and all, but not a big selling point for me personally). If those brands are ripping MI off in some way, or people have found they don't replicate the MI modules very well or work as good or flake out or something like that, that's one thing. But is that really the case? More input welcome.
Been looking into getting Rings, Clouds, Tides, Beads, Grids, and Marbles, and a few of the others look interesting too. The clones obviously tend to be a lot cheaper (and fit my color scheme better) -- any recommended clone "brands" (CalSynth, Michigan Synth Works, etc.) or recommendations/favorites/disappointments, in this line? Anyone used the recent Blue Lantern Grids?
Thanks.
I love Instruo Ceis . Its a vc-ASDR but also has trigger outputs for every stage of the envelope. 🤯
For ambient slow motion things i love XAOC ZADAR
-- mamonu
I was looking at that one very recently, bc I'm thinking about picking up another ADSR. Definitely appealing ... all of the Instruo stuff looks really cool, but they're so pricey, I worry it just won't be worth the extra $ for what it does.
I remember having that same issue w/ the SQ64. Wasn't a huge fan of that sequencer.
Aw, man ... I just did this big write-up with my thoughts on about 10 different sequencing modules I've owned or do own, and the cookie timed out while I was writing it and when I went to post, it evaporated. :(
The short version: I'm also new to modular, and yeah, having multiple sequencers is fun and useful. My favorite so far, especially in terms of bang-for-the-buck, is the Sequence 8 by Synthrotek. I got mine for $150 and it has per-step CV outputs, 3 independent CV sequence outputs with individual limiters/attenuators, random mode, trigger or gate, reset button & CV trigger ... it's great for its price. It also feels really solidly made and in my opinion looks cool, though it does take up a little space.
I've had a few small form factor sequencers, like 2HP and Erica Synths, and they're fine, but I find with sequencers I like having a little more visual feedback. I love my external Rucci 16-step sequencer. It's just a big brick with some sliders and a single CV output, not a ton to it, but I always enjoy using it. There's one on Reverb right now but it's a little overpriced in my opinion, I guess bc I got mine for like $120 or so straight from Rucci.
Also have a DFAM which is great, and had a Subharmonicon, but didn't care for that one.
Getting some multipliers, dividers, and/or sequential switches is also great, and maybe some S&H modules for random voltages.
Here's a recent rec of select portions of a recent patch session, just me playing around with some new modules. The Rucci is that little guy running on the bottom right. Had a Korg SQ64 which actually did a lot more, but I just didn't like it.
Thinking about getting a Nerdseq as a sort of master utility once I can afford one, anyone have experience with one of those?
No idea what any of that means to be honest ... I ended up getting a 4MS Row Power and a pair of Synthrotek noise filtering busboards. Wasn't the cheapest solution, but everything's working like a charm now. Now I just need to replace that mixer......
So in my first month or two noodling with modular, there have been some ups and down and a learning curve, but the majority of my modules I've learned how to use effectively.
The exception is my Doepfer BBD. I cannot for the life of me get it to do ... anything, really.
I do have the manual, though I kind of glaze over when trying to read it, it's pretty dry. What I have done is tried the example patches they include at the end of the manual, and every time, the best result I can get it just an audio pass-thru ... no delay, no chorus, no noticeable effect at all, as far as I can tell.
I've resisted thinking there's something wrong with the module, since 99% of the time such thoughts are just due to me misunderstanding something, but at this point I'm beginning to wonder.
If someone has this module and had any similar trouble with it or has some pointers or there is something about it that's easy to misunderstand, please let me know. I got it used and I don't think I can return it, so if I can't get it to do something, it's probably destined to be a paperweight.
I have:
I'm fairly new to modular, but so far, I like both in different ways.
So far, I use the Doepfer more so for applying ADSR to audio signals, and it seems fairly versatile with separate CV inputs for A/D/S/R, variable CV triggering levels for each, End of Attack / End of Rise triggers, Inverted output, and a couple other potentially handy options. Be aware that like many Doepfers it is a sort of obnoxiously deep module though, won't fit in a shallow skiff.
The 4MS PEG was frustrating at first (as was the Befaco Rampage) because I expected it to work sort of like an ADSR (or an AD anyway) and was trying to apply it mainly to audio signals. That can work -- sort of -- but not very well. I got the impression it was really intended more to manipulate CV levels as opposed to directly effecting audio signals, and once I started applying it that way, it came into its own a lot more so. It's way less predictable and a lot more finicky than a digital equivalent would be in a DAW, but I guess that's true for pretty much all modular, and now that I've gotten the hang of it I like it quite a bit. It's very versatile and can add a lot of complexity to a patch. The Befaco Rampage was pretty much the same thing, I only had room for one at the time and chose the 4MS because I've generally liked the modules of theirs that I have.
I'm looking into more ADSR options myself, so interesting reading through this thread to get some ideas.
Sorry to sound stupid here, but I'm not sure what you mean by "inspect the buzzy bus header" or what to look for. There are a set of screws that both flying bus cables were manually wired to. Beyond that I'm not exactly sure what I'm looking for? This is the PSU:
I like Reaper, myself, but in fairness I haven't tried anything else in years.
Eh ... I spoke too soon.
I'm really stumped now. So after that last post, I replaced the 2nd flying bus with a fresh spare one I had, thinking I had it in the bag now -- but when I added my 2nd row of modules back in ... once again, I got the buzzing.
This leads me back to wondering if it's the PSU somehow, and related to a certain amount of power draw. But if so, why on earth does it have no issue running the same exactly modules on one flying busboard, but not another? Unless I have the bad luck of the spare one also being bad somehow? I might have one other, maybe I'll have to try that. It just makes no sense to me.
Well, there are two flying busboards attached to the Meanwell. But thank you for directing my attention thataway, because this morning I finally made some progress towards isolating the problem and solving it.
I attached a row of relatively power-hungry modules to just the top busboard and tested it out. Def a bit more ground noise than I'd like, leading me to think a PSU and overall busboard upgrade/reconfiguration may be a priority regardless, but -- no buzzing/interference sound, and generally work-with-able.
When I attached the same set of modules to just the bottom busboard, I did get the interference sound. Strangely it didn't sound quite the same as what I recorded, but was still hugely noticeable in contrast to the first busboard.
So, my thought is to find I fresh flying bus (I think I have one somewhere) and replace that flying bus. Hopefully that will work and if so this setup will be usable enough until I can afford a more complete overhaul.
Also as a general update -- still no solution. The connections all seem to yield the appropriate power via multimeter, (I have no oscilloscope). The guy who made the case suggested removing the 5V connection from the PSU and taping it off -- none of my modules use it anyway, and the only way he was able to replicate similar interference on his end with same PSU, was with a slight negative power draw on the 5V rail. So I tried that, but it made no difference. Trying to isolate it to a particular module hasn't been fruitful either -- the sound becomes present regardless of which modules I put in, just once there is "enough" of them to (I presume) create a certain power draw level at which point this buzzing noise starts up. I got a recording of the sound today. It's amplified a bit of course, it's subtle at normal listening levels, but problematic if you try to build patches over it.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/gu3fjwnf91vlgfj/modular_sound.mp3?dl=0
Using the same modules in my Synthrotek case creates no such sound, though it is a smaller case with only 1 row (it's the case this new one was intended to replace).
What makes you say that the Kungber doesn't have those features "despite the panel markings"? It says it's a linear PSU in the description. Just curious.
Anything available via Amazon PSU-wise that you'd recommend? Or Sweetwater or wherever? I mean the lead time on the one you linked is 38 weeks (!).
Thanks!
Sounds cool. Though yeah, I'm in the camp that just takes a pass on anything Behringer. There are so many synths I want to buy that there's no reason for the B not to stay at the bottom of my list. But maybe they'll turn their rep around with time, I heard the Neutron is pretty good too, and not a copy/ripoff of anything specific.
Out of curiosity, is it possible to repurpose something like this as a PSU for modular?
https://www.amazon.com/Kungber-Adjustable-Switching-Regulated-Adjustments/dp/B08DHZ2X2Q/
Yeah, just to confirm -- after further testing it seems very much to me that it isn't linked to a specific module. At one point I thought I'd isolated it to the 4MS PEG, because when I turned off the "cycle" buttons, the buzzing stopped. But further experimenting and swapping of modules made it clear that the reason it stopped was simply because the power draw of having the LED buttons in the "lit up" state on that module were pushing the overall load above whatever exact threshold it is where the buzzing starts. I was able to take out a module or two and then operate those buttons w/ no noise issue, or remove that module and still replicate the buzzing if enough other modules were added. But again the issue is that the power draw of my modules is nowhere near the specs of what the PSU should be supplying, I'm below 25% load on both +12 and -12.
Going thru some of these steps after checking the flying busboard connectors themselves ... all the ones I checked seemed to register +12, -12, and +5 appropriately. Now checking independent modules but bear in mind that the buzzing noise would become present regardless of which modules I chose. It seems to be more related to whenever more than about 10% power is being drawn on the 12v rail or 20-ish% on the negative rail, so far I’ve been unable to link to it a particular module but been able to replicate the buzzing w a variety of different modules, once there are enough of them. Nothing is drawing on 5 at all which someone suggested to me could be part of the issue since it’s a Meanwell psu and they have some issues if nothing is drawing on 5 i guess. But i dunno what i’d do about that —- I have no plans for any modules that would draw on the 5 at present.
Thanks again for taking the time to walk thru this... it’ll take me a minute to absorb and try any of this. But the mindset I’m taking is as you say — it’s frustrating, but a part of the decision to get into modular to begin with was to learn more about this stuff and not be intimidated by working w electrical components directly. So it’ll be edifying in that respect if nothing else. I have a couple multimeters, but no oscilloscope. Any you recommend? Also, do you have a link to a commercially available PSU you’d recommend for modular? Can’t afford either at the moment, but even if things work out w the Meanwell, once I move into my new house, I plan to get some woodworking tools and build my own custom case later in the year.
So in terms of further general testing I put the modular through my Yamaha AX-497 Stereo Receiver and directly out to headphones from there ... I don't know if this is "professional" level equipment, but it's the only other real output I have for the mix besides the MG10Xu and my impression is it's a generally HQ receiver. Certainly cost way more than the MG10xu anyway! But anyway this in and of itself made a difference in terms of how easily noticeable the sound was, it was basically inaudible until about the 3 o'clock point on the rotary volume knob, whereas audio levels generally are about as loud as you can comfortably listen to by the 12 o'clock mark. However, the sound was still there, and as I was trying some patches and such, it seemed like it became an interference after a bit, like suddenly there was this faint background hum to the patch that wasn't there in the beginning just out of the blue.
So I began changing some modules in and out, double-checking my connections and whatnot, and eventually found a configuration in which the sawtooth-like noise was not there, and at the 9 0'clock and above level all I would get was a bit of white-noise/hiss from the receiver itself (which I'd expect with the volume at that level). Then I started experimentally adding modules back in ... and eventually would hit a point where the sawtooth-like noise came back. I switched a few things out wondering if it was possible a particular module could be causing it, and if so trying to pinpoint which -- but it seemed to vary and right now my impression is that it's once the power draw is past a certain threshold, that the sound becomes present.
I have quite a few modules, but I have an excel sheet calculating the power draw of everything against the specs of the PSU, and in theory none of the rails should be at more than 50% of what that PSU can supply power for even with every single module installed, soo ... in a way I'm back to square one, but until I learn a bit more about how to check or correct the PSU itself, at least now I have a way to mitigate the issue temporarily (which is basically to only use about half of my case's available space).
That’s a lot of great information, thanks very much for taking the time. That’s very good to know about the mixer to mixer levels especially. I don’t really understand grounding very well, or what a groud lift adapter is or what star-grounding would mean. Before I left for work I removed a couple modules — a Doepfer BBD and a couple 2HP modules — and the noise was no longer present when I briefly tested it. But I didn’t have much time so, I’m going to test it out a bit more later tonight. ( It was a custom build, though the guy who built it just got an electrical engineering degree... )
I've been piecing together a system and finally got a two-tier case today with a Mean Well RT-125B PSU that can supply more than enough power for the modules connected. I've quickly noticed that I'm getting a low-volume continuous sawtooth-like base noise coming through the Doepfer output mixer at all times, even if the levels are zeroed out on all modules. It quickly amplifies to interfere whenever I start patching things together. The out is a Doepfer Mini Stereo Mixer A-138s. This feeds into a Yamaha MG10x external mixer, which goes from there to both a stereo receiver and a PC/headphones. I didn't have this issue before when I was working in a 1-tier Synthrotek case, so ... I don't know, I'm too new to know where to start in terms of how to resolve it. I tried removing a couple modules; tried outputting to different lines on the external mixer; tried different cables to mix out with ... it seems that horrible low-volume sawtooth always seems to be faintly there, coming from within the modular build itself somehow. Is it some kind of feedback from the PSU? And if so what would I do about that? Other possibilities?
Thanks for any help anybody here can provide. Happy to provide any info if anyone has ideas but need to know more about the exact setup.
Hey all, really excited to be getting into analog and modular after many years working in largely in DAWs as an experimental music hobbyist, because like many, all my initial experiences fiddling around with music and noise-making were analog. Feels great to get back to manipulating sound so directly. I finally have my first skiff set up, but I figured this might also be a place to share my compilation "Sorceress" of my past work, which has been free for a while in both truncated and extended versions on my website. Over the past year I compiled about 235 tracks I had laying around -- some on old cassettes, some on various PC hard-drives, some on CDRs -- for personal archival. Then I put together I think 50 of them for the purposes of a compilation called Sorceress and made it available on my website's blog, with a roughly 20 track version you can stream directly from the site. Been meaning to upload it to one of my Soundcloud accounts, where I have other unrelated material from recent years, but I don't think I ever got around to that.
Tucked up 19 track version here:
https://www.edwardewald.com/sorceress
Full 50 track version is a free download here:
https://www.edwardewald.com/blog/sorceress
(updated dl links)-
https://www.solidfiles.com/v/kX3xRDvqv3MPy
https://www.solidfiles.com/v/kX3xRK6AP3Qnn
The content is a pretty wide gamut, with tracks recorded in 1996 all the way up to 2020. Here's the original blurb about it from the blogpost:
Edward Ewald . Sorceress
(Selected Tracks, 1996-2020)
In 1996, when I was 17, I began fiddling around with a Radio Shack 4-channel mixer, a boombox stereo, a Sony dual cassette deck, a microphone, and a cheap Yamaha keyboard. I had no idea what I was doing and no real musical ability, but I was getting into experimental and electronic music of various kinds, and the desire to do something creative with sound was absolutely overwhelming. So I patched together the little equipment I had on a large table in my family's basement, and set to making a variety of music and noise. The first real "track" I recorded (retroactively titled "FM/AM" and appearing as track #47 on this comp) was basically just a meditative blend of FM and AM radio noise I'd taped, layered with some gentle keyboard drones. I received some positive feedback on the effort from a friend who was into ambient music, and I pressed on with more ambition.
By '97 I was listening to a lot of Aphex Twin and Squarepusher, and I wanted to make something with the rapid, chaotic percussion they tended to employ. I had no idea how to use computers to make music yet, no drum machine, no FX machines -- nothing that would be of any real use to emulating their style of music. So I improvised by simply recording very, very slowly played layers of percussion, and layering them atop each other (via cassette) piece by piece, with layers of melody woven in every other pass or so. I liked things to sound a bit strange, so I did a lot of ... creative EQ-ing, let's say ... and when I felt I had enough, I would dub the resulting, intentionally super-slow mix from one cassette to another at double-speed on the dual cassette deck, while recording the output to a third cassette. This double-speed recording would either become the final mix, or a pre-final mix that I would then mix together with another layer or two of non-sped-up material.
The results were certainly not what I would call objectively good -- I wasn't even using a metronome, and I have a terrible sense of rhythm -- but they were certainly interesting, and I still enjoy some of these wonky little homespun efforts to this day. There is a 2x album on Bandcamp called "Mother's Basement," somewhere, and that is the most comprehensive collection of this specific early period of music-making that I have organized. But a few tracks from that initial era appear here also -- primarily "Falcons" (track 33), and "The Mack" (track 24). "Pac-Man," "Energy Theme," "My Ghetto Bitch, Yo," "Bryan Was a Warm Sun," and of course "FM/AM" are also from this same general very early period. ("Keyboard Music Demo Track 1," while created much later, was also recorded using the same lo-fi, cassette-based mixing method I'd used in '96, as well as the same keyboard -- it was part of a nostalgic attempt to revisit that early process).
In 1998 I'd finally transition to making music on a computer, using a very cheap off-brand DAW called Digital Orchestrator. It crashed often, my grasp of MIDI and mixing principles were poor, and it was years before I realized something as simple as the fact that I could set the sample rate to something higher than 22,500. Many tracks from this era are rather tedious; some have been lost, some I keep ambivalently shelved; but, there are nevertheless more than a few tracks from this era that I still enjoy, too. Of this compilation, tracks from that period would include "Nighthawk," "Leap Frog," "Gloomy Firecracker," "In the Beginning," "Ghost of Memory," "Ghost of Hydrogen," and a personal favorite, "Your Heart is Also Here," which for me subjectively captures the emotional atmosphere of my early twenties in a very personal way. The rest of the tracks range from the mid-aughts all the way up to 2019. I think the most recent track in this compilation is probably "Water Spirit (2nd movement)" from an abandoned ambient EP I was working on a little in 2019. The songs featuring the slightly sped-up/pitch-shifted vocals -- "Princess," "Bill & Sue," "Phantoms," "Pitchforks" and "Magic Trick" -- were supposed to be tracks for a demo album I was putting together called "Suicide Songs," sometime around 2015. "Shortcuts," "Like Magic," "Slice of Night," and the partial "Lady in Red" cover are also from this general period. I know I have a lousy singing voice -- for some reason speeding it up makes it slightly more palatable for me. It gives me permission to not take it very seriously, I suppose, and I've always just enjoyed the slightly weird effect of it (cf. the much, much older "Bryan Was a Warm Sun," which was made with a microcassette recorder microphone only).
Anyway -- recently I set to organizing and revisiting some of my large, disheveled archive, and managed to compile 235 tracks. This was by no means an exhaustive count, just the ones I was able to easily identify and catalog with the time I had. Of those 235, I've winnowed it down to a selection of 50 for the purposes of this 3 hour compilation.
EE
2020
Yeah, as I look into it more (and now that I have my actual skiff today) I'm realizing I'm overworrying a bit. I know I'm a little out of my depth with the technical side of electronics, so I'm being super cautious in making sure I'm not overlooking something. Thanks for the link, I will indeed be bookmarking that.
I too wonder if this is a UK/US thing. I've never known anyone to take particular offense to the word 'rube' (in the US). Well ... at least not in any sense relating to xenophobia. And Lugia didn't even use it as an insult ... he used it to mean someone not educated or cultured enough to see through the marketing buzz and snakeoil. Which is what the word means. What would be a better word to use in this context?
My first skiff should arrive tomorrow, and while I've been doing the math to ensure I won't be overdrawing from my available onboard power, one thing I hadn't given much thought to were my surge protectors and keeping the PSU itself powered properly. I've seen uninterruptible power supplies online; is that worth considering, or are there other surge protector related tips/advice people have? I'm just getting into learning this stuff and don't have an especially technical background, so my knowledge of household electrical is pretty limited. I'll be moving into my own house soon, but currently I've got a near-always-running window AC, a high-end windows PC w 1000w psu, 3 external HD hubs (connecting 6 extra hard drives), two 2k monitors, a large Yamaha stereo receiver, a Yamaha MG10xu mixer, a Moog DFAM, Moog Werkstatt, and a few other miscellaneous 9V devices all going in the same small room, not to mention a space heater that occasionally is running (from its own outlet), and obviously a few lamps. Besides the AC/space heater, all this is pretty much connected via a trio of surge protectors across two or three outlets, I think they are pretty decent models and I've had them for years, but I don't know the specs on them offhand.
Is this something I should be thinking about more? I have an 84 hp Synthrotek 3u skiff coming tomorrow, and a double 3u in a couple weeks (though I'll be moving around then), so that's at least 2 modular PSUs added into what already feels like quite a bit of equipment for my little apartment room. Haven't had any problems thus far, I vaguely remember my landlord telling me the electrical for our place (shared multi-unit with his place) was pretty robust, but, trying to make sure I'm covering all my bases here.
As for the $5k QMMG...clearly, this derp hasn't quite picked up on the fact that Make Noise's MMG is NOT discontinued
-- Lugia
Ah yes, but the CURRENTLY available ones don't have the ugly color scheme or the "good" vactrols.
Thanks for the tips, I hadn't yet heard about keeping to < 75% draw, I'd been planning to ramp it closer to full. I'll avoid that.
What do you do when you run out of connections for a skiff (you have power to spare but more modules than connectors)? Is it simple to add or daisy chain on extras? Those 2hps save a lot of space but seem to add up quick where # modules-to-connectors go.
I agree with that in theory, but I think degree and seller intent are important. (And again I'd stress I'm not talking about legality here, just personal ethics).
Say I bought a Moog DFAM new from Moog for $650, which is about the price brand new through a typical retailer. I decide I don't want it and I sell it as an open-box item for $750 and someone buys it. Fair enough. I'd say that the buyer got kind of a poor deal, as it's not too hard to find a used DFAM in near-mint condition for $500-600 (I paid $480 for mine); but hey, it's certainly no seller's responsibility to offer the lowest or fairest possible price imaginable every time they sell something. People offer to sell things above their average market value all the time, and I don't think they're all doing something bad or unreasonable.
But in terms of personal ethics, to me, there's a range that's conscionable, and that range is based on the seller's knowledge of the generally conceded value of the item he/she is selling. If I take my Moog DFAM and price it at $2500, purely staking my hopes to sell it on the notion that someone will buy it simply not knowing any better ... to me, that's really slimy. If someone does that and can just murmur "buyer beware, buyer beware" to themselves and sleep okay at night, so be it. Personally, I couldn't.
That being said, in all transparency and fairness, I took another closer look at the listing I originally mentioned at the start of the thread as I got to thinking more about this, and it appears to be for a version of the module that's now discontinued, which I didn't initially realize. Combine that with the fact that Make Noise seems to be a hot manufacturer in modular right now, and that puts the listing in a different and much more understandable context, where they're pricing it for hardcore collectors who want something no longer available through the normal channels. I still think it's a greedy mark-up, but since it's an "out of print" unit, so to speak, I've actually no issue w/ it.
(Shrug) ... it sounds like you're trying to convince yourself. I'm not saying it should be illegal, but there are many things that I don't think are a good thing to do that I don't necessarily think should be illegal. This is one of them. To me Reverb is a place to buy/sell used gear at a bit of a discount, because it's used and being passed on. Let's just say it's not something I would do, and that I hope you find other ways to improve your situation (and maybe even be able to keep your gear) than knowingly selling it for an inflated price. Look at it this way: you yourself say "sorry you got ripped off," which implies you agree that I was ripped off. The guy was just doing what you're describing doing, basically.
Like I say, I don't think it's morally the worst thing in the universe, and the buyer does have some responsibility to look out for themselves here. With my example, I feel I was kind of ripped off (or would have been -- I was able to back out of the sale, as it happened, at the cost of a "restocking fee") ... but I also accept that it was partly on me for not shopping with more care. But personally I'd just prefer to be able to trust that sellers are offering me a reasonably fair price. What is reasonably fair is admittedly going to be a little subjective. But, I'm only just getting into modular, and I can already tell it's a very addictive hobby, and it's certainly easy to get a little carried away clicking the "buy" button on sites like Reverb -- even with non-inflated prices.
I do get that I have way more sound sources than I need, there were a couple things I happened to get a good deal on and just wanted to have them. I'll probably just work with one of the sound sources to start until I learn more.
OP: please post a link to the actual public rack - so we get click-through and infomatics - jpgs are next to useless - for helping us help you!
my basic thoughts echo @LYFoulidis
I would strongly suggest doing a lot more research before starting buying anything!!!!
at the very minimum: read through some other newbie threads - see what others have been advised in similar situations (there are thousands and thousands of these - you may be special, but you are not unique!)
-- JimHowell1970
Do I just copy/paste the URL? Guess we'll see if that works:
(Hmm... I can't get it to show the right one. It keeps showing an old version. I'll try again later.)
Actually the .jpg in the initial post is of an old version of it too, but ... I guess that's still the gist of it.
I don’t think you should see the Doepfer BBD as a normal BBD delay. If I’m right there is no filter for the BBD clock noise, which is an awfully harsh sound that lowers in frequency as you lengthen the delay time. So if you’re using it as a normal delay, make sure to add an extra lowpass filter just for the feedback path of the delay. It’s an amazing creative module for time-based fx and karplus strong synthesis, though - and if you decide to get the extra filter, it’ll be an extremely flexible delay!
I heard something about this, but ... we'll see how it goes I guess. I'm more interested in experimental and interesting sounds than standard FX, so it should be fine. I've actually tried to sort of order more than I may need in some respects while I have the opportunity to do so, figuring some will be traded or sold off depending on what kind of workflow I find myself falling into and which units I enjoy the character of the most. Polished certainly isn't always my pref. I had a Korg SQ-1 sequencer, and a Rucci 16 step sequencer, and recently had to trade one off ... I opted to part with the SQ-1. It does way more than the Rucci, which is purely CV and a little wonky, but I just enjoy working with the Rucci, it does what I want and has character and charm.
Apart from that, the usual stuff people forget: attenuators, mixers, VCAs. There are quite a few sound sources in this rack, you’ll need ways to control them. I have only 3 monophonic sources in my current rack, and about 10 VCAs, 4 mixers and 3 attenuators. But if you start with purchasing the voice that interests you the most, you’ll find out on the way! Just don’t buy too quick and take the time to get to know your modules :)
-- LYFoulidis
Hmm, thanks for the tip. Those are startling numbers to be sure. I've heard people tend to underestimate the VCAs they need, but I thought between the Quad VCA, ADDAC unit, and the Mixer I might actually be overdoing it. I might have to reprioritize a bit.
I'm just getting into modular for the first time and have been fishing around in regards to this topic myself. It's kind of pleasant how little negativity there is towards the variety of modular brands out there, probably because many of them are relatively small operations who genuinely love what they're doing/making. I've made a personal decision to avoid Behringer modules, because I've had pretty mediocre experiences with their products, their reputation where craftsmanship is concerned isn't the highest, and their company seems to be ethically pretty sketchy. Their units are dirt cheap for what you get, but I'd rather get that money into the hands of a smaller more dedicated outfit like Instruo or 4MS or Folktek or whatever, where they're not making a billion of the units and seem to really care about what they make.
Well, I certainly don't wish any ill on you Kel, but I guess I'm just coming from having been on the other end of that transaction. In fact it happened not that long ago when I first joined Reverb and I was just super excited and discovering how much weird, varied analog gear was out there for sale. I got a little excited and in the excitement committed to purchase an FX unit for which the seller was charging about 3x the cost you could easily get it elsewhere.
Now I get "buyer beware" and all that, it was somewhat my own fault for not doing my research more carefully. But if you are selling an item with a hugely inflated cost and you are hoping for/counting on the ignorance of potential buyers in regards to its fair value to score extra money, then yeah, I think that is a really slimy thing to do. I hope things turn around for you, but not at the expense of ripping off some excited young kid who doesn't know better.
Advice? Feedback?
I've done patching in software programs and some semi-modular with a Moog DFAM and Werkstatt, but that's about it. I'm familiar enough to find my way around with a little elbow grease and googling, have learned a bit about how CVs work vs audio, gates and triggers, etc. -- but def. still amateur enough to expect some weird hiccups and things I didn't consider.
https://cdn.modulargrid.net/img/racks/modulargrid_1532287.jpg
I figure I'll work mostly with the Doepfer modules initially and probably the 2hps, as I get a better feel for how to patch everything effectively, along with the the 3 VCA/mixing and attenuator type units. Once I feel confident with my understanding of those, I'll start to pepper in the fancy lads one at a time, like the MS Ensemble VCO, Mind Phaser, Rampage, and Typhoon.
Anything you feel is missing or will be problematic or that I might prioritize? My goal, long term, is to explore pretty experimental meandering noise-meets-IDM type stuff. Like Autechre but more fun, say. Structured, playful, a little dramatic. Old material can be found in my blog at https://www.edwardewald.com/blog/
Thanks for taking a peek. Components broken out below. I'd love some on board sequencing and logic, that will probably come in the coming months, but I do have a DFAM, Werkstatt, an EM Clockworks, and a Rucci 16 step sequencer to work with externally, not to mention my PC, and an old Yamaha keyboard that has a MIDI sequencer, so I figured that'd be plenty to start in terms of just getting some things happening. I'd also like a dedicated white/colored noise source, but I figure I can snatch one pretty cheap on Reverb at some point. Beyond that I'll definitely be gravitating towards things like Pachinko and Chance (Qu-Bit), things that facilitate randomness and chaos, but in a controllable way.
If the Doepfer VCO and the MS VCO prove repetitive -- especially with the Mini Shimmery and Mind Phaser in there -- I might sell off one or two of those. I might also pawn off the BBD delay if the Typhoon covers everything for me, though I'm not amiss to the idea of playing with multiple delays, so... have to see.....
Anyway, all thoughts welcome thanks for looking/reading.
Mazzatron Testy Mazzatron Testy
Patch Cable Tester 1 2 HP 21 mm 1 mA 0 mA 0 mA
Mutable instruments Ears Mutable instruments Ears
Contact Microphone 1 4 HP 25 mm 5 mA 5 mA 0 mA
Doepfer A-111-2v Doepfer A-111-2v
High end VCO (Vintage edition) 1 14 HP 55 mm 70 mA 50 mA ?
4ms Company Ensemble Oscillator (Black Panel) 4ms Company Ensemble Oscillator (Black Panel)
Black panel for the Ensemble Oscillator 1 16 HP 25 mm 114 mA 45 mA 0 mA
2hp Brst (Black Panel) 2hp Brst (Black Panel)
Voltage Controlled Burst Generator and Trigger Delay 1 2 HP 42 mm 26 mA 7 mA 0 mA
Doepfer A-121-2v Doepfer A-121-2v
12dB Multimode Filter (Vintage edition) 1 8 HP 50 mm 40 mA 40 mA 0 mA
Doepfer A-141-2v Doepfer A-141-2v
Vintage edition panel version of the A-141-2 ADSR/LFO 1 14 HP 70 mm 40 mA 30 mA ?
Doepfer A-188-1v Doepfer A-188-1v
Bucket Brigade Delay Module (Vintage edition) 1 14 HP 60 mm 80 mA 50 mA 0 mA
ADDAC System ADDAC216 ADDAC System ADDAC216
Sum & Difference 1 8 HP ? ? ? ?
Blue Lantern Modules Mini Shimmery MK2 Blue Lantern Modules Mini Shimmery MK2
Percussive Metallic Generator 2 10 HP 64 mm ? ? ?
Hexinverter Électronique Mindphaser Hexinverter Électronique Mindphaser
next-gen analog complex oscillator || thru-zero phase modulation in the analog realm 2 30 HP 24 mm 110 mA 100 mA 0 mA
2hp S+H (Black Panel) 2hp S+H (Black Panel)
Dual Analog Sample and Hold 2 2 HP 42 mm 5 mA 5 mA ?
Befaco Rampage Befaco Rampage
Dual Sergesque Slope Generator with Logical Crossfading 2 18 HP 30 mm 110 mA 90 mA 0 mA
CalSynth Typhoon - Black aluminum CalSynth Typhoon - Black aluminum
Expanded Clouds with sliders 2 16 HP 25 mm 160 mA 35 mA 0 mA
Doepfer A-135-2v Doepfer A-135-2v
Quad VCA / VC Mixer (Vintage Edition) 2 8 HP 45 mm 40 mA 40 mA 0 mA
Doepfer A-138sV Doepfer A-138sV
Mini Stereo Mixer 3 8 HP 30 mm 10 mA 10 mA 0 mA
Guy listed it for $5000, now down to $3500. Sold "as is." How do these people sleep at night?
I upgraded to Unicorn and was kind of hoping there would be a way to "save" my arrangement of modules. I like to sort of space out various modules that I'm plugging/swapping around on the outside of and all around the rack itself, so I can drag them in and out while seeing everything I've made available to myself, trying different arrangements, etc. ... so the feature where they "auto-arrange" along the bottom anytime you do anything involving a screen refresh (stacked on top of each other in an orderly but completely indecipherable and hard-to-navigate way) is actually pretty annoying.
Since this is all in a browser, I can understand why it'd be hard to implement saving the user's arrangement of modules outside the gridded space, but that said, if by chance I've overlooked something and there IS a way to do it ... please please please let me know!
I'd still like a way to disable the cat for real tbh.
