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If you're a guitarist with lots of pedals, maybe consider something like the Bastl Hendrikson (there are other brands/models) which lets you use a pedal within your modular setup. I have one and just bought the Empress Effects EchoSystem...lots of fun
-- jb61264

I think that's something like what the OP has been doing - and doesn't like - adding a pedal interface isn't going to make any difference - the Hendrikson seems to be a good module, but wasn't it discontinued a couple of years ago?

Personally I like both approaches - as no OCD when it comes to cables or to having everything spread out - 8 cases means cables all over the place - the more the merrier in my book!

now I really must do some hoovering and relocate my digital piano to the living room!
-- JimHowell1970

My bad, I should have read OP a little closer :) I do believe Hendrikson was discontinued but I was able to find one last year. Just picked up the Echosystem as the first true pedal to interface with it. I only have three cases with cables laying across my Minibrute 2 and Hydrasynth desktop, I can't imagine what the cable spread would be with 8 cases...lol

If you're a guitarist with lots of pedals, maybe consider something like the Bastl Hendrikson (there are other brands/models) which lets you use a pedal within your modular setup. I have one and just bought the Empress Effects EchoSystem...lots of fun

Essentially looking for something that would have both 1/4" outs (that could be used to route to my audio interface and also has 3.5 mm outs that I could route to my Cosmix mixer if I wanted. I suppose I could be making this more complicated than necessary...maybe there is a cable I could use with the 4MS Listen Four 1/4 that goes from 1/4" to 3.5mm that could be run to my Cosmix....just not sure if audio quality degrades doing something like that or not.

I have Cosmix and Ciao! in one of my Rackbrute 6Us as seen below. These two Rackbrutes actually site side by side with the top one sitting to the left so Cosmix and Ciao! are in the middle. This works pretty good for me, but I also now have a Rackbrute 3U which below also which I currently have 18HP of space left (will eventually get the Euroburo desktop enclosure so that will free up more HP but for now this is how its set up.

Thinking I need to add another mix module and wondering what suggestions you might have. Currently looking at the 4MS Listen Four 1/4 as it has 1/4" out that I could use once my new MOTU Ultralite MK5 shows up. Ideally however, I would like the flexibility to route out from a mixer in the 3U to the Cosmix if I wanted to. I like the Ciao! but it is odd HP...anybody know of something that might work better?

Here are the two 6Us

Here is the 3U

EDITED Apr 13th 2022, 14:59

I think my only gripe about the Rackbrutes is that they didn't really incorporate 'airflow' through it and have seen a couple modifications that use the 'laws of physics' for some natural airflow.

-- jb61264

Which comes back around to why I keep insisting that the width is, as Arturia notes, 88 hp. Simply because it's possible to jam 89 hp worth of panel space into these is NOT a good reason for doing so. With 88 hp and its slider nuts, you can add a little bit of space across the panel by slipping each module a TINY bit, and then this should help with the internal heat issues.

I think I made this argument a couple of times, that Arturia states the width is 88 hp and there's a definite reason for it...this problem being exactly that.

-- Lugia

Is 1 HP distributed along 88HP really doing much at all in terms of cooling tho? Did Arturia really 'engineer' that 1HP as a solution for cooling purposes?

Did you try to take the pole off and see if it was the source of imperfection as @Vow3II suggested? I purposely bought the Rackbrutes because I knew from seeing a couple that the quality of the build was very good. I didn't want to mess around with powering something or having a 'flying bus cable' to mess with. I think my only gripe about the Rackbrutes is that they didn't really incorporate 'airflow' through it and have seen a couple modifications that use the 'laws of physics' for some natural airflow.

I would verify if the pole is the cause...if it is, its an easy fix to get a different one. Also as @Vow3II suggested, contact Arturia...they actually have decent support and respond pretty quickly to help requests.

Ornament and Crime might be a good add for this setup...lots of functionality/HP.

Definitely not normal...I have two 6Us and a 3U....what Vow3II said for troubleshooting

To be honest, when I first saw the setup my though was Hermod, PAMS... then bring down an FXaid, the Cosmotronic and Caio.
One case for most of your inputs, sequencing and for your final FX and outputs to whatever.
I do think you'll have no problem sequencing all the things regardless what you decide for the drums (all good choices of course).
Cheers!
-- Dub007

Thanks for the feedback...Still struggling a bit on what the best 'extension' use of the 3U might be but appreciate the response!

Looks like you're having a good time with what you have and would continue to with what you're proposing.
What's your thought on a sequencing / final mix rack? Kind of a beginning and end of chain type of thing?
With the addition of BitBox you also add 8 potential additional outputs and having a clean space to bring that all together could be cool.
If you go with the Hermod (no exp. but read/see good things) does that impact how, when, how often you use other modules that can clock, control, etc... and is that their best use or could a dedicated or just something else work better?
Maybe some/all of this also depends if you're using a DAW or MIDI in someway?

-- Dub007

Hmm...great points of thought for sure. Do you have any ideas for a module fulfilling that mix rack idea? In my studio setup, I have everything receiving start/stop from Ableton, but can also 'drive' from my Beatstep Pro to my modular setup (which has PAMs), but wondering if I can switch that 'drive' control from BSP to Hermod and then use BSP to sequence other things as well but maybe I'm overextending the sequencing capabilities by doing that? Was thinking if I added Queen of Pentacles I could use the drum outs from BSP to 'dedicate' to that module (or the three substitute modules I call out above).

I am in the DAW most of the time now when I'm in the studio but would like to possibly perform at some point without having to taking a laptop (which I currently don't even have because I'm on a desktop in my studio).

Definitely open to suggestions all the way around :)

EDITED Mar 22nd 2022, 21:08

So, what started out as one Rackbrute 6U, grew to add a 3U as well and of course I have filled up both and now have bought another Rackbrute 6U. The images below include what I have so far. I'm considering adding Queen of Pentacles to the second Rackbrute (which will fill the 30 HP remaining nicely) OR the combination of SSF Entity Percussion/BIA/Befaco Kickall (opinions on those options...or a better one?)

I am trying to conceive of a use for the Rackbrute 3U and thinking of some sort of sequencing/modulation unit that sits in front of my two Rackbrute 6Us. Note I also have a Beatstep Pro. I moved the Quadrax + Expander from the 6U above to the 3U and replaced it with the BitBox Micro (on first 6U)...also already had PAMs with the mmMIDI and moved it as well to the 3U

Would appreciate any guidance or suggestions on what to fill up my Rackbrute 3U with. Here is what I had in mind below:

Would love to hear feedback on any and all of the above...

EDITED Mar 22nd 2022, 12:15

I tried to go that small, the fact is it's just not workable or possible. For me, the magic size was (2) 6U Rackbrutes, which I've since modded with intellijel tps80's, ventilation. PM-DB25 connections, USB port for Flux, and so on. The 89hp per row just works for layout and module sizes, and the 76mm depth meant that I could run whatever I needed or wanted.
-- Vow3ll

Hey Vow3ll...i would be really interested in the mods you did to your Rackbrute 6Us. I have a 6U and a 3U currently filled up and will be buying another 6U soon to run 6Us side by side...with the 3U complimentary to my Minibrute 2

I think this is a very short term solution - so I'd still get the bigger case - yes it's going to cost a bit more - BUT - if you are like most people you will want more as soon as you can afford it - and this way you are prepared...
-- JimHowell1970

I can attest to this statement :) after swearing I would only get one Rackbrute 6U, I now have a Rackbrute 3U also filled in with plans to get another 6U to have two 6Us side by side and to better use my 3U as a complimentary piece to my Minibrute 2 :)

I always suggest Ornament and Crime...so many different functions to explore...when you find one you like, buy a module for it and change what you use O_C for...even better to add the Hemisphere firmware

I've found Ornament and Crime to be a good multi-purpose module that actually helps many figure out what they really need going forward...they find a function that they really like and use a lot, then buy a dedicated module for it and then use O_C for other functions.

Great video! I've subscribed...was a particular video that you watched on Beads that inspired you for doing this in Morphagene? Would you share if it was one in particular? What is the module sandwiched between Maths and Plaits? Also learned a new technique to try out with my Maths (looping envelopes to create a drone) :)

wmd/ssf tool-box?
-- JimHowell1970

I have considered that but wondered if it would be overkill since I have the OSD? or maybe utility modules can never be 'overkill' :)

Having a blast with my Rackbrute 3U set up with my Minibrute 2. Would be interested in recommendations for filling in the last 6HP remaining considering what I already have in place. What am I missing? What would be cool to add to this setup knowing that I'm using it with the Minibrute 2 (also cross Rackbrute with my 6U as well, but mostly used with the Minibrute 2).

One note...I have all the effects that I think I'll ever need...plan to do some external stompbox with the Hendrikson....looking at the Hologram Microcosm as a possibility.

Here's the current state:

EDITED Jan 21st 2022, 21:44

I would get rid of the Mordax in favor of using the 16HP for other utility type modules. You already have two oscillators in the build (which is probably too much in a small build like this) and you have two other large modules in Maths and Morphagene. You could probably benefit from FX Aid XL (or just the regular FX Aid), Frap Tools 321, and maybe a small mix module as well. I would also recommend you consider a multifunctional module like ornament and crime and/or Disting EX...yes, you have to do some menu diving with those modules but in smaller setups like this its almost one of those 'trade-offs' that you have to consider to get as much functionality/HP as you can.

There are other awesome people on the forum who will be able to probably do better exact recommendations but as someone who has a couple smaller builds myself, those are things I would consider.

Since you have the space, maybe consider a Doepfer A-143-9 instead of the A-145-4...

I would agree with everyone that you shouldn't necessarily plan everything out. I have a Rackbrute 6U filled out and now a 3U. I think in time I will get another 6U to combine with my existing 6U...I like what I'm building with the 3U accompanying my Minibrute2 keyboard synth...lots of effects/modulation in my 3U that really compliment/extend the Minibrute2.

Very cool...love the setup! I have a Rackbrute 6U with a Minibrute2 (not 2S like you)...have a link to your Rackbrute setup?

Morphagene and Data Bender are getting most of my attention for this at the moment.

That looked like fun...some cool sounds in there...do you record to a DAW at all and then reuse stuff?

At some point when I feel I can afford it I'll probably get Make Noise Morphagene, you can record stuff into it and mangle.

The Freeze Button on Clouds lets you scroll through the position of the grains its playing.

Make Noise Mimeophon lets you lock (Hold) a loop and move through the Delay knob settings which if Clocked you can use fragments of loops for interesting parts.

I quite fancy a 2hp Loop Sound On Sound Looper, or 2! They look interesting for recording stuff in and even 2x of them for sorta fake stereo is waaaay cheaper than a Morphagene. But obviously lots different

Part of me is thinking about getting an iPad and a Looper App too as overall cost is better than modules when you think what else you can do with an iPad.

I'm sure someone will know more about the Data bender.
-- wishbonebrewery

@wishbonebrewery I have been looking at Morphogene too...20HP is the biggest size I could go for and its right at 20HP. The iPad idea is interesting...do you know of any apps offhand? I have an iPad which I was going to initially try to use for drums...using Arturia Beatstep Pro and their iPad app iSpark...I couldn't get it to work right then I think my Korg interface went bad so I haven't tried further.

I heard some crazy things about Assimil8or but never seen nor touched one in real life ;)
https://www.modulargrid.net/e/rossum-electro-music-assimil8or

-- zuggamasta

Looks really sweet, thanks for the reference...its too big for what I can use in my setup but an interesting feature read for sure!

I've found Data Bender to be more of an effect or "happy accident" machine. You can freeze the buffer and sort of navigate around it, but it's a little imprecise for honing in on specific parts of the buffer in real-time. When I've tried this, my input is already so mangled and stuttering that I wouldn't classify it as a looper, but I'm sure others have been able to use that feature more effectively. I use the 4ms Dual Looping Delay for the real-time sampling/looping thing. It's pretty much perfect for that. I'm sure there are other options that require less hp for looping, but the interface and ergonomics of the DLD are great.
-- farkas

With DLD, could I say for example, have one of the inputs be say from a radio and I could capture 4 or 5 seconds of a broadcast and then loop that? then I would want to 'mangle' that looping sample in certain ways...and then eventually maybe go back to the original once or twice...I probably need a different module to do the 'mangling' I'm assuming?

I'd like to be able to record/sample something that I'm playing from my modular and then mangle it up...I'm not quite sure if I understand the scope of Data Bender but I'm guessing I probably need a separate sample module from Data Bender to do the actual record/sample and then that would play through Data Bender? or can Data Bender actually record a bit of audio and subsequently mangle it up?

I have a Disting MK4 which I know can "hold" samples to play but I'm not sure about the real time recording aspect. So if I'm messing around and have a really cool patch going, I'd like to be able to record/sample that and then mangle it up with something like Data Bender in real time...

Maybe there is an all in one module that can do something like this? or different modules to consider all together?

To get things back on track, I'm going to shout out to U-he CVilization again...its a matrix mixer AND wait there's more...haven't delved into all aspects of it but the matrix mixer and sequential switch capabilities are A LOT of fun so far.

It’s a free country dude and you sir have the right to my opinion!

-- sacguy71

Agree everyone has the right to an opinion...to me, its sad that in this case, as you stated, your opinion was formed by something you 'heard' and not something you yourself saw and then formed an opinion on...but you let someone else influence you...to me that is a scary thing in todays society...we let the media (left or right) and others form our opinions for us instead of hearing all sides to the story and then forming an opinion. Haven't seen the new Matrix movie but I honestly did not see anything 'woke' in what I was watching on Wheel of Time and anybody who is seeing that has some deep seeded issues they need to work out...don't let them screw with your head like that.

EDITED Jan 2nd 2022, 07:12

Merzbow (and all of the harsh noise stuff) is an acquired taste. Tread carefully. Haha
Here's an Oren Ambarchi track that I've had on repeat recently:
-- farkas

Ok, well I'll just have to consider Merzbow my scotch of music because thats not a taste I'll ever acquire...lol
A couple Oren Ambarchi's things I found were ok...what I really liked of the artists I've not heard of were Drexciya and Prefuse 73.

Merzbow (and all of the harsh noise stuff) is an acquired taste. Tread carefully. Haha
Here's an Oren Ambarchi track that I've had on repeat recently:

-- farkas

Interesting...is it my headphones or is it just part of the music that I hear lots of clicks/pops whenever a sound seems to be triggered?

EDITED Jan 1st 2022, 19:34

Happy New year.
I'm very sure the first thing I made was really simple and would have been a 2hp Pluck going through some Reverb and I was sending it Triggers from a Roland Boutique Sh-01, that made me happy though and look at the rack mess I'm in 2 years or so later :)
-- wishbonebrewery

Wait, does this mean brewing my own beer is the next step in modular? ;) Looks like a really nice mess that you have setup there. Interesting you're triggering from your SH-01...I'm sort of in a similar learning curve with sending and receiving stuff from modular to my Hydrasynth desktop

-- jb61264

I just realised, The TR-09 for Triggers, used to be hooked up via Midi to the SH-01 for Pitches and gates. I don't do that now but thats how I started out.

Cool...I have a TR-8S that I'm using as my main source for drums...it in itself is quite the rabbit hole of learning and integrating into Ableton Live

EDITED Jan 1st 2022, 18:01

I think this is a great community of diverse opinions. I appreciate the 'rigid' opinions and advice for what they are....some I've taken to heart, some I've taken with a grain of salt and tried something different than what was recommended. In the end though I believe you are right that its a personal journey. For me, I had a vision of what I wanted my system to look like and after nearly a year, I have pretty much arrived at what I wanted...complimentary modular to a couple of synths and a drum machine separate from modular and everything interfacing with Ableton Live with the ability to use the CV capabilities built into Live...all the while asking questions, appreciating the diverse responses and opinions and making a decision based on that and the research/reading I do outside of MG. I only have a Rackbrute 6U and Rackbrute 3U for modular and honestly, I'm feeling ok with that for now. I have so much to learn and experiment with. I can see myself getting another Rackbrute 6U at some point to attach to my Minibrute2 instead of the 3U and using the 3U as an 'experimental' box of sorts. I like the construction of the Rackbrutes and the flexibility they offer for transporting and mixing/matching with the other devices I have. I only bring that up because its probably one of the areas of modular where I've taken more of a fork in the road from the advice of getting a big rack but I appreciate where that advice comes from for sure. we have some similar musical tastes but thanks for shouting out a couple I've never heard of (Merzbow, Drexciya, Oren Ambarchi...will be taking a listen to these in the coming weeks). Much of what I want to evolve my music to is heavily influenced by a lot of the sounds/songs The Crystal Method produces...but I have quite a wide scope of genre's I see myself getting into along the journey.

Yea I heard that the new Matrix movie was a wokefest of bad fan fiction. Same with the Amazon Wheel of Time show that was a hot mess of woke race swapping and far left man hating LGBTQ agenda that disgraced the awesome Robert Jordan novels. Oh hell, guess it’s old movies, books and modular synths for me til this bad agenda ends.
-- sacguy71

I read all of the Wheel of Time books, they are third only to my favorite...Tolkien and my second favorite Sword of Shannara (which I would definitely call a butcher job when they adapted it to a tv series...and why it only lasted two seasons no doubt...i couldn't watch it past the second episode it was so bad). However, I would have to say while WoT strays a bit from the books, I'm ok with it...IMO, the production is done really well and I'm thoroughly enjoying it for what it is. My wife and 15yr old son have not read the books and are really into it. I'm not a Matrix 'purist' so I will probably just enjoy the movie :)

Is anyone else finding that some settings fail to survive a power cycle? I have one specific setting that resets on channel 5 every time. The wave form always returns to random instead of the default. Despite the fact I reset the channel every time I power it up. Reported to ALM, but no answer after a couple of weeks.
-- mntbighker

I just ordered PNW...I'll definitely be on the watch for this when I get it installed and running.

Holy crap there is a lot of good stuff on this thread...I have a long ways to go before I submit anything this good, but I have an entire year to get better before 2022's thread :)

Very nice way to close out 2021! Happy New Year!
Was the Moog setup where you began? My son has the DFAM and Mother-32 and wants to eventually have the trifecta setup with Subharmonican....what is the fourth device in there?

EDITED Jan 1st 2022, 17:31

I want to wish you all the very best for 2022!

throws some save fireworks
-- M01C

Same to you in 2022...very clever modular fireworks there! :)

Happy New year.
I'm very sure the first thing I made was really simple and would have been a 2hp Pluck going through some Reverb and I was sending it Triggers from a Roland Boutique Sh-01, that made me happy though and look at the rack mess I'm in 2 years or so later :)
-- wishbonebrewery

Wait, does this mean brewing my own beer is the next step in modular? ;) Looks like a really nice mess that you have setup there. Interesting you're triggering from your SH-01...I'm sort of in a similar learning curve with sending and receiving stuff from modular to my Hydrasynth desktop

EDITED Jan 1st 2022, 17:28

Happy new year to you @jb61264. I'm glad you are here. Looking forward to hearing your music in 2022!
-- farkas

Thanks Farkas! Looking forward to getting over my fear of sharing something I've created

So, I'm only 9 months into this journey and just want to reach out to everyone to say thank you. This really is a great community of diverse opinions that are always willing to listen and provide useful information in the sometimes difficult daunting space of modular. I haven't yet shared anything because for the most part anything I've really done really kind of sucks compared to all the other great music I hear by users on the forum...but I am starting to get the hang of putting things together and making progress...promise to come out of my 'sharing shell' in 2022 :)

I wish everyone health and happiness in the new year...may this next trip around the sun be everyone's best yet ahead.

Happy New Year!

Instruo Ts-L might a contender for the smaller VCO as well...also, I have CVilization (which I love) it can be a matrix mixer, sequential switch, or mucoder. Lots of functionality/flexibility for a smaller build like yours (and mine)...worth a look

If you have guitar effects pedals/stompboxes, there are modules that allow you to use those in your modular setup as well. I don't play guitar but since one of my builds is a Rackbrute 3U (small footprint), I got the Bastl Hendrikson which will allow me to use external stompbox (plural when I get a Electro-Harmonix Tri Parallel Mixer, which will let me connect up to 3 external pedals).

Hendrikson is discontinued but ALM also makes one called ALM006 - S.B.G...just something to consider since you play guitar and may have some effect pedals...or this would give you another reason to buy one :)

I always chuckle when I see someone say they want to receive payment by Venmo. I would never do anything except PayPal with 3% because it protects both the seller and buyer. Do those that want to be paid using Venmo send the item first and then receive payment after the buyer receives and is ok with item? I'm guessing not

Noticed in the 'function' menu when I was looking up envelope generators that there is also an 'envelope follower'...what is an envelope follower and why would I need one? I'm assuming I should have an envelope 'generator' before I consider buying an envelope 'follower'?

I have everything to the right of the 8HP blank space. The Pams, Logica XT, and Doepfer A-130-2 are reserved HP...leaving me 8 HP of unreserved space. It was recommended I consider an envelope follower to the build...any recommendations for something that would occupy 6 or 8HP? Really loving everything that I've added so far, really fun combining the Minibrute2 with external sounds modified by Warps, Ultrafold, and Beads

I edited and removed what I was writing as I don't want to hijack the OP's post

EDITED Dec 28th 2021, 05:31

with an external drum machine you might want to go with pedals for the distortion/fuzz/overdrive and the compression (to free more space in the rack) and a continuously variable filter - so that you can go from low-pass to high pass and all places in between
-- JimHowell1970

Can you expand on this a little? I am using the TR-8S for drums...will eventually go down the stomp box 'path' as I purchased Bastl Hendrikson a few weeks ago for my Minibrute2/Rackbrute3U setup...but it sounds like using them in line with the TR-8S can also add some flavor to the drums?

Not sure what the purpose of your post is.
If you are interested wait for them and buy them when available and if you have the money.
And be prepared to invest about 3 or 4 K for the beginning for a case like shown in those videos.
-- znort101

The purpose of his post was to inform everyone of the email that TipTop sent out about the status of their new modules if it isn't that apparent? Also, why would I have to prepare to invest 3 or 4K for a new case? I'm going to get the Buchla 257t and incorporate it into my Rackbrute 3U build that is attached to my Minibrute2. What is the purpose of your post?

So after years of being on the fence I’ve decided to dive into eurorack. I have an idea that I feel like is mostly fleshed out but I’m worried I might be over looking Something basic yet crucial. So far I have purchased a niftycase, maths and rings from mi. I want to add plaits, ripples, shades, veils, and tides to fill up the rack. My goal is to have something that is versatile that I can explore sound with. Any opinions and advice would be great!
-- Eros222

You're not going be able to be very 'versatile' with only 84HP and especially if you already have over 1/4 of that occupied with Maths and Rings...both great modules but with only 84HP you will need to consider using much smaller modules that pack in a lot of flexibility...for example Disting EX, Ornament & Crime, FX Aid,

I think the first big recommendation you'll get from most will be to consider a bigger rack. I have the Rackbrute 6U and a Rackbrute 3U...but I use them in conjunction with other synths (6U with my Hydrasynth Desktop and the 3U with my Minibrute 2)...I can also use the 3U and 6U together (which is the swap/mix and match flexibility I wanted and planned for).

What are planning to output to? DAW, speakers directly? That will have some influence on what you add to your build as well and others on the forum will be much better at providing recommendations overall than I can...just be prepared for the "you're gonna need a bigger rack" discussion. Also, if you haven't already...you should build the rack and post it here in your thread.