It's all about trade-offs. Modules that are one-knob-one-function are much easier to understand in terms of signal flow and learning curve. But they tend to take up more space and are more expensive.

Micro-sized modules (think 2HP) seem to make a lot of sense in being able to pack more functionality into less space. But once you tweak a few 2HP wiggly plastic knobs, you'll just start hating them for anything that requires a bit of fine and careful adjustment. They also tend to be deeper in order to fit into 2HP. A whole bunch of sad comes to town when your brand new module bottoms out in your case and doesn't fit where you want it to or not at all. Also, packing a bunch of 2HP modules together generates a LOT of heat in a small space and you can easily put more modules into a case than your power supply can handle. Over-taxing your power supply can lead to some costly damage.

Modules that are feature packed tend to have a steep learning curve or require A LOT of memorization to be able to use fluidly. Pack a bunch of those into a case and you'll forever be pulling out the instruction manual and reading/rereading things... INSTEAD OF MAKING MUSIC.

Stopping to read a manual is a serious buzz-kill when you've got a hot patch going. Memorizing functionality varies by person. Some are good at it, some are bad. No judgment... but know yourself. I'm bad at it and using modules like those from Mutable Instruments do not work for me. Too many combinations of button presses, LED colors etc. They are fantastic modules. I'm just not good with them.

EDITED Dec 3rd 2021, 17:47

Visit some of the other "first rack" threads. The biggest issue in almost all of those racks is the SIZE of the rack. They are too small. Skiffs should be built by people who really know modular well. To build a GOOD skiff, you have to make trade-offs on your modules considering size and features. My analogy is that it's building a classic Swiss wrist-watch versus a grandfather clock. The wrist-watch is much smaller and the tolerances are a lot tighter. You're going to get into a lot more trouble building the wrist-watch coming into it with no experience.

The first thing that is problematic is the control of your synth. Plaits requires a pitch CV and a gate CV play, so does your BIA. Every Erica drum module requires a gate/trigger to play. Where are all of these triggers, gates, and CVs going to come from? The MIDI module you've dropped in is very basic and can't support that many modules itself.

Speaking of the number of modules, how do you intend to get every sound generating module to your audio outputs? You can use the Maths as a basic mixer. But that's a huge waste of a Maths module. You have two oscillator-type modules, drums, a noise module, put some time into picking out at least one basic mixing module. You might want something basic that can handle audio and CV... and then maybe something a little better that can handle stereo audio.

It's been stated "you can never have too many VCAs." You have too many VCAs... for the size of this build. Plaits and BIA have their own internal envelopes and VCAs as well. You don't have to use them, but most people do.

I have DATA and I have Maths. But they are nice-to-haves in a Eurorack case. For a skiff, they are just too big to justify in most cases. But again... why skiffs aren't a good idea for your first build.

Also, the 2HP stuff should be integrated sparingly. The tiny knobs are tough for big fingers to adjust accurately. Also, if you place them next to each other you will have a really hard time not bumping the settings for an adjacent module. You'll find in Eurorack, that tiny adjustments can be the difference between a sound that's garbage and one that takes your breath away. Ergonomics is a real thing. With 2HP modules you also have to keep careful track of your power consumption as well as the DEPTH of space available in the case. 2HP modules can run pretty deep in order to keep their 2HP width.

I hope this reply was helpful. If you bought this set-up as-is, you'd probably be disappointed.

M3 screws are the ones that should fit. There are others that are very close in size that do not.

I bought Uxcell computer "graphic cards" screws. Apart from a couple of modules that had very narrow clearances, these work great for me. I can tighten modules down by hand with a thin nylon washer underneath to stop rack rash.

I'm not sure if the link will be valid but here is the name of the item:
"uxcell Computer PC Graphics Card M3x6mm Aluminum Alloy Knurled Thumb Screws Black 10pcs"

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01MTN1PNK/ref=ox_sc_act_title_1?smid=A1THAZDOWP300U&psc=1

EDITED Dec 3rd 2021, 16:52

It seems that you put together a collection of popular modules. But how are they to function as a unit? I would consider this a small rack/case... and it's full of big modules.

Chance, Branches, and NanoRand seem to have lots of overlap in functionality. You have a large sequencer (Eloquencer) plus a small analog-style sequencer in the Verbos module. The Verbos module is redundant. I'd look into a micro Ornament & Crime. It has a sequencer mode that replicates a lot of the Verbos functionality in 8HP. Plus there's the benefit of other functionality like a quantizer.

A precision adder and a unity mixer are a bit redundant as well. I'd pick one. But instead of a unity mixer, I'd invest the HP into a small mixer with attenuators built into the inputs.

Why do you want a pulse counter? Again it's a small build (not recommended) so every HP is important. I'd recommend more space.

Have you considered an output module? VCAs? Dedicated envelope generators? Effects? Additional utilities in addition to the dual attenuverter? I think with this build you might be disappointed if you ordered everything as-is.

Small builds are Rolex watches of modular. You really should be experienced before taking on small builds.

Thanks for the input! I will definitely not use the Moog Mother 32 as part of a rack case, I'll use it separately on its own working with the case.
I should've been more clear on what I own.
I own the Prophet Rev2, Op-1, 2 pocket operators, the Moog Mother 32, and the novation mininova.
In terms of types of sounds I want to be able to create, I want to be able to have lots of sources of modulation so that I can create more expressive and flexible sounds. I want to be able to have a live setup that I can modulate on the fly during a performance, and for that to be an easy thing to do in the synth workflow.
-- GavinAnalogSynthsGuy

Expressive, flexible, and easy to use live and on the fly... that's going to be pretty difficult to get from modular. I think you might find that a lot of live playing tries to reduce the complexities where possible. The Plaits and Braids modules, for example, are very popular for live play, because they tend not to need as complex of a set-up having built in quantizing, envelopes, prefabricated sounds, etc.

As Toodee said, there are a lot of utilities that are going to end up in your case to make things work properly. After you're done patching everything up a few times, hunting down problems during a live performance (oops, accidentally knocked that module out of its settings), you'll want to revisit what makes a good live rig versus studio.

$0.02 delivered.

Your first build shouldn't be this small. Small builds add a huge layer of complexity. There isn't any room to expand or fix a problem or modify the build once you've used it for a while.

Small builds that are "good" are much, much easier when you're experienced.

Buy a reasonably sized case like a Mantis, Behringer GO, etc. Try to get your first iteration built using about half of your space. Then as you grow, you can revise your case, push your system in the direction(s) you want to go, and not get stuck with a system that you can't fully utilize.

Of course, you can always buy a second case/rack. But it's a lot cheaper in the long run to just build in a case larger than you need.

You will never record a song in the DAW of that I am sure. You already have problems to operate a simple Eurorack sequencer like Eloquencer, or your pathetic attempts to operate a simple mixer.

-- Next_G

It's pretty sad when this is your first and only post in four years of membership and your only contribution is to try and insult another user. You can do better.

Ah so helpful! I too am getting my head around how envelopes work with VCAs and filters.

-- sacguy71

I'm going to speak in general terms here... NOT the most accurate.

Your sequencer will output CV and gates. The CV can typically control the pitch of your oscillator. The gate needs some more modules to be effective. TYPICALLY, you'll run the oscillator output to the input of a VCA and then take the output of the VCA and plug it into somewhere you can listen to it. Your VCA can be used just like a volume knob. You'll hear the volume knob called your "bias" knob. You turn up the bias and the oscillator gets louder. You turn it all the way down and you hear nothing.

Now, you can plug the gate output directly into the CV INPUT of the VCA. Every time the VCA receives a gate, you hear the oscillator. But you might notice that the sound isn't very musical. Typical musical sounds have an ENVELOPE. They can be simple envelopes or more complex envelopes... but envelopes. So a typical patch will have an envelope generator being triggered by the sequencer's gate output and the output of the envelope connected to the CV IN of the VCA. Once adjusted, you'll notice that the Envelope Generator makes the audio output much more musical.

More modules might be involved in this, like a filter, effects, etc. I left those out for simplicity.

Audio Path:
Oscillator>VCA>AudioOutput

CV Path (pitch)
Sequencer CV Out>Oscillator 1v/Octave In
CV Path (gate)
Sequencer Gate Out>Envelope Generator>VCA CV In

If you want a randomized gate, a logic module would be nice. An accent might come in the form of a random gate rather than a variable voltage.

The Q-Bit NanoRand seems to have a random gate output you can clock to the gate feeding your ostinato. Patch that gate to a separate envelope generator and then that EG to something like your filter cutoff. Now you quickly sweep the filter as your accent.

The other way involves using a logic module... if your S&H doesn't do random gates. I'll lay that out here for anyone else reading:

You can use your Q-Bit NanoRand to generate a random sample and hold signal. Trigger the S&H with the same gate feeding your envelope generator (assuming you're using an EG for amplitude envelope). Then feed that same gate to one input of your logic module and the S&H output to the other logic input.

The S&H module will spit out a gate only when your original gate is present through the logic gate's "AND" output... when the S&H circuit spits out a voltage that is high enough to register as "TRUE".

You can modify the amount of accents by inserting an attenuverter with an offset... like the Befaco Dual Attenuverter. Offsetting the S&H output higher will increase the likelihood of a gate... setting it lower will reduce the chance of a gate.

I had already been eyeing Pam's new workout, would you use Pam's or Euclidean circles v2 if you had to choose?

Euclidean Circles V2 is nice because you have easy to read and modify controls. So Euclidean Circles checks all the boxes for real-time performance adjustments. If you are composing on the fly or jamming, then that module makes a lot of sense.

Of course, Pam's does Euclidean plus a whole lot more (that's not Euclidean). Pam's is one of those modules you can make part of the core of your system for clock, sync, rhythm generation, etc.

My recommendation would be to buy Pam's New Workout and see if you can get away with using the Euclidean features on it. If you find that you MUST have real-time performance controls then purchase EC V2 later. A great strategy is to not purchase your entire system at once but just enough to get you going. Then add modules as you gain more experience and literal hands-on knowledge of your system.

I will definitely research them and add the to the list of considerations.

I'm highlighting this... because doing your own research, reading the manuals (before buying) will really help you select the best modules for your needs.

Big modules and a small case. You might run into issues.

You mentioned Euclidean rhythms. I believe Pam's New Workout has that going for it as well. You can get full-blown sequencers that do Euclidean like the Westlich Performer. That would give you the ability to save your set-up. The Westlich can also be controlled externally via a Novation Launchpad. Which might be something nice as you could mount the LaunchPad within your drum kit for better control.

If space isn't an issue, you may want to check out Tiptop Audio's Trigger Riot. For pitches, you might like Noise Engineerings Mimetic Digitalis. It's compact and can do four channels of CV information. The sequencer steps through 16 positions but is set up via a 4x4 grid that can take triggers to reset, or move the position down or to the right.

You can also add more complexity to your rhythms by incorporating some sort of logic module (a comparator).

If you're on a Mac it's possible to aggregate your audio interfaces together into one big virtual interface. So you could use both the ES-8 and your Focusrite at the same time. Not so much luck with a PC.

Doepfer is great. They have a revised line of modules meant to be smaller. A dual LFO and a dual ADSR envelope from them would be just fine.

The A-140-2 for the EG ($168) at 8HP and an Eowave Zone BF ($111) at 5HP look pretty tasty to me. That's an EG and an LFO in the same HP as the Batumi and Poti... at less than the price $350.

As far as a noise source, check around. Noise generators are often paired with sample & hold circuits as well as slew limiters. The ADDAC215 will do all of this in 6HP... and gives you TWO S&H circuits plus two slew limiters.

When posting your rack, don't post a JPG pic of it, post a link so people can review your set-up. Just copy the URL when viewing your rack. Like this.

Pam's New Workout has an optional MIDI expander. If you're working with MIDI hardware, that might be very useful for sync'ing.

Steppy is a gate sequencer. It doesn't output pitch information. You have a Beatstep Pro that offers gate AND pitch CV. What do you intend on doing with the Steppy?

You have the Intellijel Quad VCA. You also have a Doepfer Dual VCA. For the build, I think you would be safe getting rid of the Doepfer.

I like the Batumi and Poti expander. But this is a small case. Is there a dual LFO module to your like that's a lot smaller?

For your ring modular, I would go with Befaco's A*B+C. It's a dual ring modulator but has pots included for level control. That will be extra handy.

Speaking of pots... look up "attenuverter" You need a couple of those to change the polarity of your CV and attenuate it. Befaco also makes a great dual attenuverter.

Your choice of filters are a low-pass filter and a low-pass/band-pass filter. That's a lot of real estate for a small case. Unless there's a specific style of sound you're looking to get from your filters, I'd find a smaller multimode filter.

Do you have a noise source here?

Where are the envelope generators?

If you get rid of some of the fluff you don't need, you can also go with a Disting EX rather than a Mk4. You'll get much more use out of the EX.

You can also save space by purchasing smaller clones of the Mutable Instruments stuff. Again, in a small build, you might want to sacrifice a little convenience to get squeeze in more modules (more functionality).

The Performer will give you a LOT of options, including modulation similar to the internal sequencer in the classic Native Instrument's Massive VST. There is also a lot in terms of Euclidean patterns, chance, etc.

You're going to get a module a month. Sounds like a plan. Take the time to really learn the Performer and the Assimilator. The Performer has a lot PERFORMANCE options, so learning them will really help you out. The Performer can also drive external MIDI instruments as well. So if you have any hardware MIDI instruments lying about, you can work with them as well.

My thought on your next module to purchase would be the Disting EX. You can link your F8r via I2C. So it would make sense to get the Disting since you have the F8r. The Disting will also give you a nice selection of different functionality that you can try out as you explore your modules.

As you gain more experience, you might change your mind on what modules you'd like. So I'd get the Disting and see how you feel a month or two after.

I'm not going to give specific advice, but advice if I suddenly acquired your system and the things I would check.

My first consideration would be able to stop, start, and reset both the Nerdseq and the Erica Drum sequencer together. If I start playing one sequencer from the beginning, I should be able to slave the other. This might be done through MIDI or CV through clock and reset. I would look through both for Clock-In, Clock-Out, Reset-In, Reset-Out features.

My second consideration would be a mixing. I'd just go Full-Monty and get the beast that Befaco makes. The Techno-System comes with a lot of sub-mixers. But I'd like to be able to take everything to one main performance mixer. Depending on what modules you get for the Befaco mixing system, you might not need the Intellijel VCA.

Third, utilities. How are you doing on sample&hold, logic modules, slew limiters, etc.

Finally, modules like Plaits would be a great addition as they don't need a lot of support... just a gate and pitch CV. I'm assuming that the main focus is the Techno System and your other modules will support it. Add in a nice reverb and I think you're near golden.

I noticed that you now have the FX Aid and Beads. They both have stereo outputs. The matrix mixer was recommended, but it's mono. So that limits you to four mono inputs.

I would go with something that is stereo for your main mixer, like an EMW stereo mixer. 8 stereo inputs, leaving you six stereo inputs for the rest of your rig. Matrix mixers are a nice-to-have item. But not for this build.
https://www.modulargrid.net/e/emw-8-channel-stereo-mixer

Also, there are too many VCAs for the size of the rack. The Happy Nerding or the Intellijel could go and you'd be fine. That space would be better suited for other resources. I like the Intellijel unit. But the Happy Nerding makes more sense for the size of the rack.

Page 7 of the owner's manual gives you everything you need regarding putting samples on to the SD card. The cards are formatted in FAT32, which shouldn't be an issue. I'd buy additional SD cards. It seems Play can only read the first 32 sounds on your card. So if you have sound sets that you regularly want to use, then buying a few small SD cards would be helpful. Oh, and label them or their plastic storage containers.

I really don't think you're ready for modular yet. The modules don't make a lot of sense for a useful system. What are you expecting to get out of this that you can't already do in your DAW?

Since a friend of mine talked about Ornament and Crime, I wondered if it could be an alternative to Pam's, which when I looked >into it, it seemed a more interesting choice, with many more possibilities/uses - Robin Rimbaud called it a Swiss Army knife of >modular.

Yes and no about O_C. It's a great module, but its more about CV than gates/triggers. Temps Utile would be closer to Pam's New Workout. But not a 1:1 comparison. I'd hold out for a Pam's if you can but you can still keep the O_C. Your Pittsburgh has a clock-out. So that should be fine for driving

For a case of this size, why do you have a precision adder and a buffered mult? Also with the Quadrax and Falistri, you can probably ditch the A-145. The Frap Tools 333 summing mixer... that's not needed either. That's 18HP of stuff you probably don't need and a fair bit of money.

Go with a Disting EX at 8HP and you can replace most of that stuff.
That still leaves you with 10HP to play with once you get settled.

I would try a 1010 Music BitBox Mk2 or BitBox Micro. They offer clockable looping. So when you reach a point where you're ready to transition, you can sample a loop of your outgoing mix, crossfade between the two, then set-up your new patch as the loop does its thing.

You may want to do this OUTSIDE of the rack. I'm thinking the 1010 Music Blackbox and a DJ mixer with crossfader. The Blackbox won't take up an HP as its an independent device. It's also clockable and loopable like the Bitbox series. Also, having it independent of your rack will make life a lot easier especially if you're trying to troubleshoot. You could not only loop your outgoing mix but also have something entertaining on standby in case everything all goes to hell and you need 3 minutes to figure things out.

Interesting rack. I'm going off of the version of your rack you modified yesterday, not the one pictured (slight differences). You have the basics covered. The only thing I could really critique is a lack of a dedicated LFO source. Granted the Pam's can generate them and the STO can get down to 8Hz... but 8Hz is kind of fast for an LFO.

I would hold off on the STO, Threshold, and Databender for a second round of purchasing. Always leave yourself some room to change your mind or fix some deficiency you've overlooked. If you populate a rack completely, you have no wiggle room and will either need to buy another rack, or remove/sell off some modules to make space for what's needed.

It's a bit of a broken record, but I would try to work in some sort of multi-function module. A Disting EX is a great choice since it includes a lot of great programs. The Disting Mk4 is okay since it's only 4HP. But the interface can be a little frustrating.

Check out the 1010 Music BitBox Mk2. It's 5HP larger than the Salmple and about $100 more. But it'll offer you twice as many trigger inputs (16) and having a nice big GUI is helpful (for me at least). Additionally it has a 3.5mm MIDI input. You should be able to patch it up via MIDI to your Keystep Pro to save using all of your gate outputs to trigger samples. It can also live loop record if you send it the proper clocks. The Salmple might be your thing. But at least know what else is out there.

The QPAS is a stereo filter. So to get the most out of it, you have to send it a stereo signal. Blades is a dual filter, meaning you get two independent multi-mode filters. You can use one for left and the other for right if you have a stereo signal. Unless you're planning on doing a lot of stereo work, I'd go with Blades.

The Expert Sleeper FH2 offers a lot of functionality as far as a USB MIDI to CV converter. You can use your DAW... OR... any standard MIDI controller. However, you'll find programming it or changing the settings from the front panel to be a real pain. Programming it from your computer using the a web-browser isn't so bad. But to make changes using your computer, you'll probably have to quit the DAW so the web browser can take control of the MIDI device from the DAW.

Braids and Plaits were mentioned. Also almost any wavetable voice would work. By changing the "index" in the wavetable synth you can get very nice timbral changes without doing a lot of work to get them. The same with Braids and Plaits as far as adjusting the timbre.

With an analog VCO (saw, triangle, square, etc.), you'll need a lot more modules to get any deep changes to the timbre. That can be a lot more expensive and an lot more room in your case.

Hi, this is not planned for this version of the module.

-- Ziqal

Major deal breaker. I would really rethink this before pulling the trigger on a production run. Even if you have to offer MIDI inputs on a 2HP expansion board, do it. I would choose a competing product over yours based on this factor.

My $0.02.

If you're comfortable using non-Eurorack effects from pedals, your DAW, rackmount, or any other source... do that. Generally, they are MUCH less expensive. If you can get what you want... cool.

Where Eurorack effects show their strength are in the 3.5mm modulation jacks populating all those good-good effects modules. That's really what makes them worth paying for. If you can get a nice Eurorack delay module, a nice reverb module (or spring reverb set-up), and then a multi-FX unit to cover everything else... I think you're golden. Any specialty effects like Clouds are nice too. But the costs start to stack up. :)

EDITED Oct 27th 2021, 17:21

Here's a list of the gear OP mentioned:
Intellijel Rubicon2
Joranalogue filter8
Intellijel quadvca
Xaoc batumi
Make noise maths
Intellijel dual adsr
Hexinverter mutant brain
Disting EX

I have all of those modules except the Hexinverter and Disting EX. They are very tasty indeed.

Some considerations when you get your NEXT round of funding:

1. Buy the Poti expander for the Batumi. It gives you front panel access to a lot more features and is worth it (3HP)
2. Buy a second VCO (doesn't have to be a Rubicon) for stacking voices, adding subs, audio-rate effects, sync, etc.
3. A noise module would go well. They are often paired with sample & hold circuits... which is also useful.
4. A small DC-coupled mixer module. The Maths can mix... but a dedicated 3:1 or 4:1 mixer will free up the Maths for better functions.
5. A simple sequencer that has at least a clock and reset input. 8 or 16 steps should be fine. Think of something under $200. Sequencers are for more than just playing notes. You might also like something like an Ornaments & Crime (micro) that can handle simple sequencing duties, or quantizing, etc.

I can think of a lot more modules to have fun with. But those would be high up on my list.

I'm not going to tackle all aspects of your post. But I do want to talk about percussion. Having individual modules that play one voice of percussion tends to get expensive in terms of real estate (case HP) and cost ($$).

For example, if you construct a kit out of TipTop percussion modules, you will also need a sub-mixer to to coral them into. You will need as many trigger outputs as you have percussion modules as well... so the sequencer will have to be pretty beefy. 8 voices of percussion means 8 trigger outs.

A sample playback module might be something worth having especially in the beginning. Something like the 1010 Music BitBox mkII might be prudent in the beginning. Each voice can be triggered with a patched trigger OR you can use MIDI (on 3.5mm TRS cables). You can sample in your own sounds or fill the SD card up with whatever else you want.

It can also record loops if you send it a clock or MIDI clock.

It's an additive module. So having a huge range makes it a lot easier to audition the highs and ultra-lows of a sound. Also in additive you can have modulators that are in the extreme ranges as well. Having 20 octaves of range isn't that useful in a VCO. But in a digital additive module... yes... but not necessarily for playing that full range.

1 I'd pull the DFAM out of the rack and put it back in its case. Now you have a TON of room. I'd add the 3HP Poti expander to Batumi for the alternate LFO waveforms and ability to toggle between reset and sync. You'd also be able to hold on to the Verbos a little longer or keep it since you have more space.

I'm not sure if using modular as an effects rack for Ableton Live is the most prudent use. There will always be that latency round-trip between your D-A, effects and then back through the A-D converters. That's not an issue in the studio as you can compensate for latency after-the-fact.

The majority of effects you'll find in Eurorack aren't dependent on sync. You might find yourself better off with a bunch of guitar pedals and an analog mixer when it comes to cost effectiveness, bang-for-buck, and so forth.

Cables are not balanced because it is low impedance, they're balanced because the audio signal and the inverted phase copy sent on the 2 live wires can be recombined in such a way to cancel out any noise that has been picked up on the cable!
-- JimHowell1970

Well, Jim, I'm trying to keep it light rather than making a 40 page treatise on balanced power. I think you have it backwards there. Low impedance cables have to be balanced. Balancing is used to mitigate the inherent short comings of low impedance signals (subjected to noise). The biggest ADVANTAGE of low impedance is minimal loss (relatively) of high frequencies that long runs of high impedance impart on the signal.

The idea is that the braided cable will be equally affected by an interference. The high and low signal are phase inverted. For example if you want to transmit a signal that at that instance is +3volts, a +3 volt signal will be sent on the positive and a -3 volt signal (inverted) will be sent on the negative. The absolute difference is 6V. Divide that by two and you get the original +3 volts.The same for the inverse -3 volts minus +3 volts equals -6 volts divided by 2 equals -3 volts.

When interference hits both the positive and negative leads it doesn't change the results. (+3volts +1 volt (noise)) - (-3volts +1 volt (noise))/2 still equals +3volts if you do the maths... no pun intended.

There are multiple types of filter circuits. But I want to talk about the format of the filters.

Here are some of the major configurations.

Can the filter self-oscillate? By turning up the resonance does the filter begin to generate its own sign wave? Some do and some don't.

Does the filter bass compensate for higher resonance levels. You'll find with a lot of filters, you lose low end as the resonance goes up. This isn't a good or bad thing. But just the nature of the beast. If you want high resonance with a bass sound. This might come into play.

Outputs. When dealing with a multi-mode filter, how are the outputs structures. Some modules put all the filter types on separate output jacks and all filters are simultaneously available. Others use only one output and the user selects (usually on a switch) which filter feeds the output.

Input (levels). Some filters have input level controls. How hard your signal hits the filter can alter the sound significantly. So an input level control might allow you to adjust things to your taste.

Modulation. This can range from simple CV control over the cut-off point or you can get into modules with multiple controls including the afore mentioned FM control (linear and exponential), 1/V Octave tracking, CV over resonance, and even some exotic controls like ping, mix levels, even control over filter type.

Balanced signals always have 3 leads. Balanced signals on XLR cables are pretty simple. XLR cables can carry balanced mic or line level signals. It's "balanced" as it's a low impedance signal that's great for longer distances. But it gets around the additional interference by being able to mathematically subtract out any external interference at the receiving end.

On 1/4" cable, it'll use TIP-RING-SLEEVE cables (three leads). Your typical guitar or unbalanced 1/4" only has two leads (tip-sleeve). You might also know the tip-ring-sleeve set-up as "stereo". But I'm avoiding using that description as it just conflates unbalanced stereo signals with balanced mono signals... even though they are ran over the same connectors. (please double check your cables for impedance if you're running balance signals over them. You don't want to use a high impedance three conductor cable, especially over a longer length of cable.

Most prosumer mixers and other gear will have balanced connections on 1/4" jacks in order to save space and cost.

So yes, to run balanced audio between two devices, you need to start with 3 leads and END with 3 leads at its destination... and of course, both send and receive have to have balanced outputs and inputs. Check the manual.

The FH2 is probably an overkill unless you plan on hooking this system up directly to a computer. You could save a lot by using a simpler interface. The FH2 has some interesting capabilities. But programming it is a pain in the... If you simply want sync, you can get the MIDI expander for Pam's New Workout.

Pam's New Workout and the Mimetic are a good pairing. I'd add a micro Ornament & Crime unit to this (8HP). It has a quad quantizer mode that makes getting really nice, in tune notes out of the Mimetic. O&C has other functions as well, so it'll be very handy.

Your rack has no LFOs, no dedicated envelope generators, no utility mixers, no basic utilities (like attenuverters, noise). You'll find the boring utilities are the glue that really holds your modular system together.

Also a small multi-effects unit can make a real difference. You may want to try an Expert Sleepers Disting EX if there's room. It's a Swiss Army Knife of functionality and will help you explore the possibilities of modular synths.

Hello new person. Welcome to modular. Here are some pointers.

When posting a picture of your rack, don't post a GIF. Post a link to the rack and MG should populate the space with your rack as a clickable link so others can examine your module choices. It's very helpful.

You're putting big modules into a small space. You're more than likely not going to get what you expect from this set-up. You're missing a lot of functional utility modules.

How will this thing play notes? Will you be driving this from an external CV controller or external sequencer? Do you plan on sync'ing anything?

How will you record the output? Modular synths work at a level higher than the "line level".

You stated you've spent a few weeks reading "Patch & Tweak." No offense, but if you understood the material, this wouldn't be your rack. Why did you select two slew limiters AND the Maths module? You have a shift register. But how will it function in this rack and what exactly are you going to feed it with?

If you want playable, you should go with a semi-modular synth and save yourself a bunch of money at this point. A semi-modular like a Behringer Neutron, Moog Mother-32, or a Arturia MicroBrute 2 might give you a better outlet without breaking the bank or pushing you to spend money on modules when you aren't getting the entire concept of the modular environment.

Before you fill a module full of stacked cables, think about how much torque you'd apply if you accidentally bumped that stack with your elbow. I'm thinking of getting some short male to female cables to lesson the worry. I tend to limit my stacks to just one piggy back. Stackables have taps at both ends, so you can split at the output and the input. Anything more than that, I reach for a proper passive splitter (Intellijel makes nice ones with magnetic backs). I'll only split gates and triggers. Anything that's going to note pitch, I put through an active mult.

You can get MIDI on a 3.5mm plug and lookie here... my modules are covered in 3.5mm jacks that aren't labeled MIDI. From what I've been looking up, MIDI transmits at 3.5V to 5V through the port... doesn't it? I'm asking.

I'm thinking it's an audio rate square signal that bursts on note on and note off, if you're sending other data, like CC, or pressure, I'm sure it's continuous. Anyone messed around with this?

The O&C isn't that menu-divey. Once you've selected a mode of operation, everything for that mode is on one page. The length of the menu might expand if you select certain features (like using a ADSR envelope rathe than a gate). But it's fairly simple to use.

neither are turing machines or distings

turing machine is pretty simple generate a string of random stepped voltages that are loopable - you almost always want a quantizer after it if you want 'musical'

disting is also quite simple - there's just a lot of it - it's just select algorithm and the knobs and i/o change but nto that much and it's pretty easy to get your head around especially if you set up favourites (a text file on an sd card) so that you are not trying every mode and having to read the manual all the time

As far as the turing machine, having a module that can send control voltage (like a Befaco Attenuverter or an Intellijel Quadratt) are nice for having better real time control of the Turing settings.

-- Ronin1973

@Ronin1973 hnmm - something wrong here did you mean scale and not send?

-- JimHowell1970

No. Check out this Voltage Control Lab tutorial... around the 2:15 mark explaining what I mean. In the video, they use Maths channels 2 and 3 as real time controls. Of course you can use any CV source, automated or manual.

@Ronin1973 that's a good suggestion. I've stayed away from Turing Machine type models mainly because I don't understand them, either as a module, or in terms of potential musical use cases.

O&C comes up very recommended over and over. I've stayed away from that one and Distings because multi-use, menu-divey, extremely deep modules with big manuals are not my "cup of tea" right now. Having gotten into Eurorack in the last 12 months and bought a lot of gear, I still have much to wrap my mind and ears around with the more "basic" modules I own.

I'll need to flag the Turing types, along with O&C and Distings as "maybe future" modules for me to consider going forward, maybe for deep winter here in Minnesota, when an afternoon spent with a manual and a single module is a more agreeable idea.
-- nickgreenberg

The O&C isn't that menu-divey. Once you've selected a mode of operation, everything for that mode is on one page. The length of the menu might expand if you select certain features (like using a ADSR envelope rathe than a gate). But it's fairly simple to use.

As far as the turing machine, having a module that can send control voltage (like a Befaco Attenuverter or an Intellijel Quadratt) are nice for having better real time control of the Turing settings.

Skimmed again... have you thought of using a Turing Machine? There are a few dedicated Turing modules as well as modules with this mode like Ornament & Crimes. I believe O&C can also quantize outputs making the randomness more musical.

is there a particular module of the above that I should make sure to get first, or early in the process?
-- HGsynth

All of them.

But I would start with Pamela's New Workout and Ornaments and Crime. You're at about the $500 mark with purchasing those two. I would get them to familiarize myself with their operations. You should be able to use them with your MiniBrute and Model D. Those two modules can do quite a bit even though they aren't on the "sexy" list.

Here are my thoughts. I didn't read any others so there may be overlap.

Here are the different solutions.
1. Remove one ES Disting Mk4.

2. Remove the precision adder.

3. Buy a cloned version of Plaits that is 4HP smaller.

Superstacking isn't an effect but a design.

A superstack doesn't start with one oscillator. You are stacking MANY oscillators. So you'd have to buy that many physical oscillators, mix them in a stereo spread, filter them in stereo, and modulate them with stereo VCAs (two mono VCAs).

The greatest advantage of modern digital computing the shear amount of DSP that can be generated to create crazy stacks of voices that would be prohibitively expensive in the analog world.

EDITED Sep 30th 2021, 16:39

but you're still consciously giving Uli your money... which is up to you - I try not to - although it can't really be helped as they make a huge number of ICs that are in a wide variety of modules anyway...
-- JimHowell1970

The frequency shifter... Uli gets it right once in a while.

VIEW THE RACK BEGINNINGS

(Eventually will be moving the Model D as the rack fills up)

Ronin1973
Appreciate your feedback! Linking with ableton and my computer is an eventual goal but having a hard time pulling the trigger on those modules (Es-9 & midi cv expansion) right now. Again I want the eurorack to also function as standalone as much as possible and dont want too much of a headache as I already have a major learning curve as it is. But want to move that direction sooner than later.
On the synth level to line converters, do you have any recommendations?

JimHowell1970
Hey See you pretty active on here, this is my first post, so forgive me as I'm learning how to use this! I posted a link to the rack above that I have with my current modules, and a few from my wish list off to the side.

As far as utilities go, thats exactly the kind of feedback and recommendations im looking for! Again looking for the order of what would be most useful with what I currently have and recommendations as to what my next purchases should be considering whats on my list and what I want to accomplish.

Thanks again for your help!
-- amindy

Well, the Intellijel uJacks is exactly what I'm talking about. There are two line-level outputs on it. So that's good. As far as keeping it simple, almost any MIDI to CV converter will work. I have the FH2, which is probably a bit of overkill after reading your follow-up. The Intellijel uMIDI looks pretty tasty to fit in your Brute Rack.

Have you tried an envelope generator? It seems that you need a couple of attack-decay envelope generators. You can use ADSR if you set the sustain and release to zero. As long as the EG is fast enough, you should be fine.

As far as stand-alone, you have your Arturia Keystep that can handle basic sequencing. Depending on your needs, you can always add Eurorack sequencers. There are so many types and styles, that's an entirely different conversation.

As far as integrating your Eurorack into your set-up, I would have two things purchased: 1. A MIDI to CV converter that can transform MIDI messages into gates and CV. There are quite a few of these as well. There are full programmable USB MIDI to CV converters like the Expert Sleepers FH2. Then there are simpler 5-pin MIDI to CV that many companies make.
2. Synth-level to line level converter. Eurorack levels are a lot hotter than the output of your DeepMind or DrumBrute. A dedicated converter is great for a no-muss/no-fuss dealing with this. A stereo unit is usually enough unless you're trying to isolate sounds in a large set-up.

There are other methods, like generating CV and gates directly from your DAW as well buying an audio interface that works at Eurorack levels (like the Expert Sleeper ES9)... but depending on your set-up and if you already have a regular audio interface, this can get a little tricky, especially with a PC.

can someone explain to me have a patch this up to work???from my Synth tech E352 through the Doepfer clock divider?
-- Broken-Form

A square wave from your oscillator will work well. Though some oscillators only allow one waveform to output at a time, so if you're using a triangle wave or something else... you might have issues. As far as mixing it in, there are two ways:
A) You mix both oscillators together at the output and then continue down your patching chain.
B) Your sub gets its own independent envelope generator, VCA and then is mixed in to the original signal at the very end of the signal chain.

My opinion is that it would be easier to patch in a second, independent oscillator tuned an octave or two down and just patch the same pitch CV and gate CV to it.

I own the 1010 Music BitBox. I dig it for sampling modular... since it is modular. It's pretty simple to use and can record pre-specified lengths (when properly clocked).

The BitBox is also compatible with Ableton Live. You can load a 4x4 grid of samples into Ableton as a drum rack. This is nice for processing samples afterwards.

The language is also edible in a text editor, so swapping out samples or building new kits off-line is pretty easy.