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some thoughts:

don't skimp on case or power, especially if you find modules to be expensive - the case protects them and the power gives them life!

1 it's extremely well priced for a 6u/8xhp case to be honest - personally I prefer the find the modules you want and the modules that you need to support them and then find the case to fit them in approach rather than buy a random tiny case and try to cram functionality in by using micro versions of modules etc

the psu looks to be a standard meanwell power supply - great if you are only using low powered modules - but not so good if you want to use something high powered - the fact that the builder states the number of power headers, but no the available power may or may not be a cause for concern - I would at least ask before buying

2 I was looking at cases on musicstore the other day - the intellijel palletes are very expensive - iirc the 62hp is almost the same price as a tiptop mantis... the 104 is 90€ more - and it reduces your choice of other modules - want midi - get the intellijel midi interface because it works with the case, want a mixer - get an intellijel one etc etc etc - now there's nothing wrong with these modules - but it does reduce your choice - and as modular is to some extent about having unlimited freedom of choice - it seems counter-intuitive to limit yourself in this way

if you substitute 1 hp 3 u for 3hp of 1 u (which is probably about right in terms of functionality) you can roughly work out how a 1u row compares to a 3u row in terms of what you can put in it - I mostly build my own cases (this is actually a decent option if you are on a budget and can use a saw, a drill and a screwdriver) and have never contemplated a 1u row - the hardware costs the same as a 3u row - but only get 1/3rd at best the functionality in it - and there are almost no modules in 1u that are not available somehow in 3u

personally I prefer the mantis over either of these cases - but that may just be me, partly because the mantis power supply is clean enough for video (less ripple up to much higher frequencies) whereas by all reports the intellijel supplies are not so quiet - you would have to wait a bit though as they are out of stock everywhere - deliveries appear to be next month, but... - and again it does not have any built in utility - which I personally see as a good thing!

you have to weigh up the price of the included utilities - check you don't have to add 1u modules to use them (and if you do midi and outputs - I'm looking at you, here - decide if you actually need them!!) midi yes if you want to use midi, but outs really depends on where you are as to do you need to have this module - in europe probably not, in US almost definitely, other countries may vary

3 not many people can afford to go out and fill a case with modules on day 1 - and it's not often recommended either - whilst most modules are relatively simple to understand, lots of them all at once is not - and those that do need a bit more time generally fail to get it when purchased in huge batches - so starting with a few modules and learning them in depth before expanding is a great idea

some stackcables might be a good idea - or a few headphone splitter type passive multiples

the often recommended starting set of:

a sound source, a sound modifier, a modulation, a way to play and a way to listen are mostly covered with that combination of modules

modulation is a bit on the light side - but will be fine to start - both the other modules have atttenuators on most if not all their modulation inputs and plaits has an on board lfo

how to play = outs of beads into audio interface via 1/4"->1/8" cables

if it clips buy some cheap passive attenuators - 2hp Trim for example - and try to reduce the level that way - if that still clips then you may need an output module - attenuators are always useful to have anyway

veils is a good choice of vca - quad cascading etc etc

if it was me I would next want a better modulation source (I like Maths as a first modulation source*) and some basic utilities next (links, kinks, shades or similar functionality in different modules - wmd/ssf toolbox for example goes a long way to covering a lot of basic utilities) and then possibly a stereo mixer - before adding any more sound sources or modifiers

• see the illustrated manual for more information - 32 self-patching ideas - a brilliant primer for modular synthesis in general

I think I have to go and watch a video on the Lion to check it out further...

I hope instruo sell replacement cables for the pin matrix - if I bought one I'm sure I'd loose them!

whenever someone recommends a shiny new expensive module - remember to look around and see what else there is that will do the same thing (or almost the same thing) for less money!
-- JimHowell1970

Sure, you might be right with that, but there is a huge difference between the lion and the doepfer 138m. The lion isn't more expensive without a reason. And for his use case the lion is suitable. The doepfer is not (or almost not).

-- MillionJT

@MillionJT - you may be right - I'm just a little skeptical - so I took a look at the spec for the lion (just the description here) and apart from the 'expensive pin matrix' (which is one of the 2 obvious reasons why lion is more expensive, the other being that it's built in Scotland and not China) and the black panel - I really don't see a lot of difference between the 2 - they're both matrix mixers at the end of the day...

it could be that the lion can add a lot of gain, but I don't see that in the specs - and if that's the case you could easily patch say +20db of gain in via Veils or something

so could you please explain why the lion is more suitable as a matrix mixer than the doepfer for no input mixing? or is it just differently suitable (ie the lion has this extra function that you would need another module for)

my guess is that if you are asking if you need more utilities, it is because you suspect you do

you seem to have a decent selection of utility modules already - what do you run out of? or wish you had more of?

what do you think you would use most?

what are you reaching for when you are patching, that isn't there?

what can you not do that you want to do with the modules you have?

here you go

the instruo lion is a very expensive version of a matrix mixer - there are others that will do the same (less the pegs - that in my case I would loose) for less money - Doepfer do a good one (one of the most ergonomic) and so do AISynthesis

whenever someone recommends a shiny new expensive module - remember to look around and see what else there is that will do the same thing (or almost the same thing) for less money!

well I was coming here to basically say the same as Lugia!

Thanks for the insights on case widths. I'll keep that in mind when I build my next cabinet. (I'm trying to stick to my self-imposed moratorium on buying/building any more shiny toys until I accomplish something musically useful with all the stuff I have already bought/built :) Well, maybe one or two shiny toys if I've been a good lad...)

that system is great - but easily circumvented

any sound is musically useful - you just have too find the right context

you could set the bar so low for good that it is almost impossible to be so bad as to warrant not being good enough so get a new module - I forgot to take the trash out - I'm not good enough to deserve a module - I emptied the moldy cheese from the fridge - I am good enough to get the module I want/need etc etc etc

obviously cash flow plays a part too

I tend to look at it as I could get knocked over by a bus tomorrow if I want it and can afford it and can find it - I buy it or build it

I like the looks of this tidy bundle from Konstant Lab: https://www.konstantlab.audio/shop/zdroj-set-high-end-linear-power-supply-bundle/ although I'd need twice as much +12V power to run my 400hp rig. Maybe they'll offer a beefier version in the months ahead.

Thanks again for your advice! And apologies to the OP for hijacking this thread :)

-- oldandintheway

I have no problems running multiple power supplies (befaco and frequency central) in the same case or patching between cases - nor any need for output modules - but I do live in northern europe where there is a balanced power supply

frap tools make one - but I think it works out quite pricey by the time you add everything up

I can make a DIY 84hp/9u case for just over 200€ - including power so I don't really look at cases that much

EDITED Mar 13th 2021, 01:21

maybe metalwork is the answer

get someone to build a bracket in steel that will angle 3 mantises like the doepfer stands

ok probably a prohibitively expensive solution - although you never know!

I know what you mean though - I need to move soon - so I have more space for cases (amongst other things!)

I understand - I'm kind of pulling yer leg a bit - but quite frankly I don't even see modules unless it's un-patched and even it won't be long before I patch it again

I'd tend to see it as a rookie problem to a large extent - form over function

a beginner guitarist may want a factory fresh red strat for example - but as a guitarist I'd want the one that I liked playing the most out of a huge range of them and not care about the condition of the paintwork or which model it is - although saying that I do like the sustainer on the EOB and it would go well with my white jag - thankfully I am not in the market for another guitar!

but as I said is it an instrument or a fetish totem?

will you play with it?

or will you stand around looking at it - maybe chatting with your friends about how black and shiny and sexy it is, over cocktails??

EDITED Mar 12th 2021, 20:56

If you really need a black panel version for the aesthetics
-- farkas

haha no-one needs anything for aesthetics, they might want it though!

Saying that I've always liked a slightly "bohemian" aesthetic - my modular is patchwork of black and silver and white and red and blue - maybe some fluorescent orange or green soon! and of course it's all bathed in the pulsing psychadelic light of the tv screen

but is it primarily an instrument or a fetish totem???

ok so you know there are 2 kinds of mults - passive and buffered

and you know that buffered mults are more accurate

good start...

in almost all cases other than for v/oct it really doesn't matter if your signal is slightly off - you will not notice at all

unless you have tuned your modules, even with v/oct it won't matter

in very rare cases - some of my video modules, for instance, don't like maths unless there is a buffer between them - which shows up by maths not cycling and a buffer solves this - in which case get a buffer

if after all that you still want a buffered mult - take a look at mi links - you get a buffered mult and 2 mixers (one of which can be used as a precision adder - so can also be used as a 2 output mult)

yeah no plan survives past the first encounter with the enemy!

why a buffered mult? what are you going to use it for?

I'd go Maths, Batumi (and poti) and a doepfer matrix mixer - maybe add a passive mult - and then add kinks and shades (or wmd/ssf toolbox) before anything else - it'll give you a good foundation of building blocks to complement the moogs - then think about another voice - I wouldn't try to be over ambitious on voices until you take the moogs out

my modular is on the floor I sit cross-legged in front of it - I too need a much bigger desk!

Haha. Man, I've had so many different iterations including a matrix mixer. Doepfer, AI, Future Sound Systems, Instruo... I can get a little of that from the Happy Nerding 3xMIA and I've considered adding another of those when they become available again. I think there is a shortage in the dual concentric pots.

well you did say roast!

shortages of everything - I swear I spent hours last night trying to find a electronics componenet dealer that had c0g capacitors and both lm6172 and cd4053 ics!!!

But, yeah... I'm sort of avoiding too many utilities, logic modules, and such that discourage a hands on approach. That's why I've got a few mixers without VCAs. I like to pretend I'm Lee "Scratch" Perry mixing an incredible dub session. hahaha
-- farkas

so you know that when they used to have to mix everything by hand - because they only had 2 hands - they had to get other people in to help move faders etc - get more utilities now I tell ya, might spare you from the corona!!! and there's a lot to be said for being able to be both a hands on and a hands off synthesist - and everything in between - with utilities, logic, vcas etc etc - you can choose to use them or not! without you don't get a choice

and you could play matrix mixers and vcas with your hands - just get the right ones - big chunky things with big knobs!!! - go on get a Doepfer Matrix Mixer, you know it makes sense!!!

at your stage of filled case - I'd be looking for the next case!

... and what does that say about capitalism?

nice size case - very expensive housing for the moogs, though!

maths is brilliant buy it now - download the 'maths illustrated manual' and work your way through it a few times

needs way more utilities to improve the functionality though - imagine an exponential increase in patching possibilities!

If it was me, I'd take one (or 2) of the moogs out and put a load more utilities and maybe another modulation source, replace the mi clones with originals and consider replacing the lofi junky with a couple of fx aid xls

doesn't disting have a cv recorder in it these days

NOT ENOUGH UTILITIES!!!!

mantises 5 & 6 should be just utilities

408hp of matrix mixers, dc-coupled wavefolders and logic modules!

just kidding - but seriously what are you going to throw out to get a matrix mixer in there, farkas, huh, huh??

hahaha!!!!!

No Problem!!!

bargains can be had - but they usually involve transporting things long ways - I don't have a car so it's a pain to arrange so generally skip - and the ones I see on the street often don't have the right inputs - and are mostly battered and wet!

something that may really work for you is camera feedback - especially if you can find a cheap video camera (that's compatible with the v4 - you may already have one!) and another cheap crt - use one for feedback and one for filming

some ways to explore this:
move the camera

move the tv - more difficult - but doable - easier using a projector and screen - i wouldn't advise using a wall for this technique!

put things between the camera and the tv and move those about

put glitch boxes between camera and v4

if I remember correctly (read some where) you can probably use the v4 for no input feedback and put the glitch modules in the feedback path

are you/were you doing any of these!!!

I'll take a look at your instagram!!

these https://www.modulargrid.net/e/addac-system-addac200s-size-matter are format jumblers - things that take i/o in 1 format and 'jumble' it to another!

keep the utilities and the output modules

I bet you could get something as complex/interesting if not more so from (a) different manufacturer(s) in fewer hp - might be more modules though!!! - but I was really meaning the random sampling!

Hi @farkas

visual cortex component out -> old sony lcd 40" TV (TV handles upscaling)

iPhone about 15u (haha) from the screen on a tripod (horrible shitty joby gorilla knock off)

regular iphone camera app on phone - no effects just a straight upload to instagram - after selecting letter box instead of square - so the sides aren't cut off!

best results are at night with lights off as much as possible

I keep meaning to look for a decent CRT and a video mixer - but the ones I see are often more than I'm willing to pay - bloody hipster gamers!! - so I just end up buying more modules / DIY

do you have instagram? so I can check your glitch recordings out!

you take care too, mate!!!

Jim

@jasper_t I saw the name check accidentally (try @ before the name and notifications kick in)

guidelines/rules of thumb - if they work for you great - but whatever may work for you!!! :-D

I'm sure there's a lot of people out there with modulars that are made up of a bunch of vcos and filters and a mixer - everything controlled by hand - and they're probably happy wiht it - but in general this

sound sources < sound modifiers < modulation sources < utilities

will give most newbies a better modular experience - the point of it is to try to stop people thinking that they need a lot of voices to create interesting music with a modular - you don't!

start with a vco, mult it a few times and process differently - different filters, frequency shifters, etc through different vcas and modulated differently will produce more interesting tones overall than a lot of sound sources with some sound modifiers, little in the way of modulation and almost no utility modules - which are in my opinion the most important modules you can get as they mult, modify and merge the really important stuff (CV) that makes the shiny expensive modules (vcos, filters, effects etc) actually shine and not tarnish after a short time

which is what newbies generally come up with unless they have spent a lot of time (and I mean a lot of time - months/years not minutes) researching and thinking about the subject

bu there are utilities and there are utilities - I don't see much point in format jumbler modules, that I see in your rack - just buy the correct cable!!!

if outside North America or Japan - chances are you don't need an output module - but if you are in those territories then you probably do!

isn't the rompler a voice too ?- I would consider it such!!! so 5 not 4!!

as for the modules that you are looking at -

MISO - yeah or shades or a host of other modules that do effectively the same thing - they are all good!

Doepfer Matrix mixer - again brilliant choice - but in this size modular you may find you want something smaller - you already have a lot of big modules - but if ergonomics are important to you this is the one to get!!!

Verbos Random Sampling - no idea - it looks great, but I think I'd rather have the functionality parted out over different modules

even after a few months!!!

missed the Harmonaig - not familiar with Instruo to be honest

I agree not much point in a case this size - especially with the marbles and VB - unless it will allow you to generate chords - but then you really need at least 4 voices

but saying that in a bigger case with more voices it might make sense - I have a sinfonion, which I use as master quantizer and chord pattern sequencer - but I do have a lot more voices - see the "pretty big re-arrangement" thread if you want to check out my racks!!

@Lugia

voltage is 0-1v in lzx ecosystem - and it's just electricity - above or below will clip, so no damage, but maybe not as expected - saying that I do it all the time!

what you do have to pay attention to a bit is frequency - goes up to multiple MHz... so if for example the 'audio' module has slow op amps, you can get smearing - although layering the smearing and blending can be quite nice

I've tried running video through most things in the rack!

for examples see instagram - #lzxveurorack - where I post examples of 'audio' modules being feed video signals - and check out my feed too if you like (same user name)

iirc most if not all the passive mults I have are normalised like those seismic industries ones - to a greater or lesser extent

do you have a tv in your studio? most seem to like crts (if you can find one with component in jump on it) but I use lcds - a different 'vibe' but looks great to me (all my instagram footage is lcd filmed on an iPhone - hence the crappy audio!)

if the answer to the tv question is yes - then look out for the chromagnon videos when they come out - maybe time to jump on the pre-order then as they will undoubtedly go up in price - that'll be one of the best starting points for video synthesis for the next few years at least - and can be used standalone or racked (yes, yes I know, racked = expensive case) - or go digital with hypno or structure - I like the analog much better than digital to be honest

another option would be to get something like lumen if you have a mac (Windoze version is on it's way but might be years) and connect that via cv-> midi for modular control

anyway - anytime you want to chat/ask questions - you know how to find me!!!

cheers

Jim

looks fine

starting with a decent sized case is always a good move

if you are thinking about beads - then I wouldn't bother with the monsoon - just pre-order a beads from the second batch

plans change over time - it's easy to get sidetracked by shiny new(ly discovered) modules and important to get the modules you actually need! (only your experience will shape this) - but it looks reasonably good as a goal - save that rack now and compare what you have in the actual case when it's full with what you thought you wanted...

well especially for performance I think I'd want function per module rather than a super disting!

and more utilities would work better for me - some switches and a matrix mixer - great ways of altering what modulation goes where for example

but if you are happy with it that's what counts

Thank you all so much for such great advice. I will pause on getting any newer modules and focus on a more balanced ratio. I can't express how grateful I am for the help!
-- marcomixtle

NP... glad we could help!

If I may applaud from the cheap seats, as someone still working my way through the newbie stage, Jim and Lugia's wisdom is mighty welcome. That priority/ratio model is a helpful guide.

It's good to feel appreciated - thanks!!!

I quickly discovered that the Synthesis Technology E370 needs a veritable army of modulation signals to live up to its full potential). I can't claim any intelligent foresight for this, but as a pleasant change, my ill-guided bumbling through life worked out rather nicely in this instance.

-- oldandintheway

there are a lot of modules out there (mostly shiny expensive ones) that really need a lot of modulation to get them to work best - often needing attenuation on the way in (clouds is a good example)

I don't think any of us can claim any form of intelligent foresight - it's just what we've picked up along the way - often from making those mistakes ourselves in the process

start with too small case - check
not enough modulation - check
not enough utilities - check

4, maybe 5 years later - experience in how to build modular synths that are worthwhile and usable - in my case both audio and video - and pretty much any size

mostly looks good

you could drop either the sto or plaits - at least initially, although a simple analog vco and a digital vco are both nice to have

how are you going to play this? sequence from the minibruute?

how are you going to listen to it? via external mixer - NB if you are in an area of the world with unbalanced

I would replace the pico dsp with a fx aid xl - same chip - more options - more modulation inputs

be careful not to overdo it with sound sources and modifiers - I'd try to limit it to 2/3 voices in a case this size

I think:

sound sources < sound modifiers < modulation (about 20% of case/number of modules) < utilities (30% of case)

as I think it allows the most variety in patching

so maybe another modulation source would be a good addition - have a play with envelope generators and lfos and coombiiniing them with maths to make more complex modulation - remember to check out the maths illustrated manual - and work your way through it a few times - and keep going back to it every so often - it's a great primer for patching modular synths!

good start all round though!

well bigger case, fewer modules always seems to make more sense to me, but each to their own!

enjoy the VCA and Mult!

Hi Jim,

Wow, nice rack! I agree here a bit with Farkas, if you reach a certain size as well as complexity, and your rack size and complexity has reached that I would say, though Lugia took the fantastic effort to still give it a try :-) , then it becomes rather a personal taste how you like to (re-) arrange your modules. It looks fantastic though!

Thanks!

I also agree with Farkas!

I'd already made a start on re-arranging... moving the video modules (and the doepfer modules I run them through!!!) into 2 cases instead of being spread around 4... and the mixer into a better spot etc! and then I hit re-arranging the cases to be more practical... video will be in the middle and the 2 84hp cases will be side by side.. definitely not ideal - so I just hit a wall for a bit and thought someone might give me a bit of a push in a direction - thanks again @Lugia - I think the re-arrangements should be done over the weekend and the final case parts will be here within a couple of weeks

Can't we make your rack stickied on top of this rack forum for beginners? Saying, look, if you consider to start into modular synthesizers, this is about the minimum size to grow towards to otherwise it makes more sense to buy a ready synthesizer instead ;-)

hahaha.... not that bad an idea - maybe remove the video racks, though... don't want to scare them!

Thanks a lot for sharing this, very interesting and kind regards, Garfield.
-- GarfieldModular

a pleasure!

Thanks - I try to help!

a good place to start:

mutable links, kinks, shades (or any other modules that cover their functionality) - multiples of this (or parts of it) are extremely useful - either as identical modules or different ones

a matrix mixer - one of the most powerful tools in the modular synthesist's toolbox - use them for combining modulation sources, setting up feedback loops, adding send return functionality to mixers without it etc etc etc

looks like a fun rack to play with - but not a long term solution, at least for me...

too many voices/big shiny, expensive feature modules - not enough modulation or especially utilities (more variety of these needed to imo) more vcas is a good start - as is anything that can be used too mulltiply, modify and merge modulation

I prefer

sound sources < sound modifiers < modulation (20%+ of the rack) < utilities (at least 30% of the rack)

because you can get much more variation that way

utilities are the inexpensive, dull polish that stop the expensive, shiny modules from tarnishing and makes them shine

personally I'd postpone the modules you think you want - until the next case - and get the modules you need to support the ones you've already got

EDITED Mar 11th 2021, 20:38

so is this a single case or is it 1 of 2 - in which case - where's 2 of 2 - probably better to put them into a single case for planning!

definitely getting there though!!

one thing to watch with vcas - are they amplifiers or attenuators? check the max gain - if it is 1 then they are attenuators - a lot of them are like this - I prefer actual voltage controlled amplifiers, myself - useful for more things than attenuators - I would dump the intellijel buffered mult and get veils instead if it was me! I think you'll probably be fine with 4 vcas in this size case

yes - make your rack bigger than it actually is (an extra row at the bottom when editing) and never leave modules outside the rack

but you could have done that without being an unicorn!

great - thanks for the suggestions, guys!!!

@Lugia - HAHAHA Funny title!!! I'm going to take a copy - remove all the modules you added - and put my modules back in!!!

the Portland has a mixer already - but it's mono - and normally goes to through one of the lollipops before hitting the mixer - if I need panning of the individual drum sounds I can record them separately and do that in the DAW - output is effectively mono at the moment anyway - my studio monitors are in a different country - long story!!!

for more panning and mixing I'd be most likely just to add more channels of the tex-mix - they are inexpensive and have panning - I though about auto panning - but I can patch it if I want it!

as for the doepfer modules - they get video signals sent through constantly -

I don't think I need another scaler - adding the 1st 5:1 will take me up to 14 scalers - I think that's enough (at least for the foreseeable future) and there are quite a few attenuators through out the system (one of the switched is actually a bank of attenuators (pusherman is not up to date on modulargrid)

mults are a good idea - although I do have quite a few stackcables - but I'd always go for 2hp DIY ones - such as the frequency central mumu - they are inexpensive and can be built in 10-15 minutes or so

the 2 right hand side cases are looking very good though - as little movement as possible will happen there - going to swap the joystick to the far right though, as I'm right handed!

as I said I'll take a copy of Lugia's (excellent) attempt and try to cram the modules I actually own back in - will re-post in this thread once it's done! fingers crossed the power & screws (and also some of the new modules and components for the diy builds) for the last case get here before next weekend, so I can build it and then I can actually start moving modules about

once again thanks very much for your input!!! greatly appreciated!!

yeah but at 50c/year it's not that much of a hassle is it?

just buy a bag of ics when you buy the module!!

I'm considering one and that would be my plan!

Yeah, JakoJako probably has this figured out already. :)
-- farkas

probably - had no idea - most racks I see like this are newbies!!!

Seeing as how I'm in love with the Basimilus Iteritas Alter, I just had to have it in my rack. So I revised what I'm after and tried to make smart useful choices.

I have a Moog 104hp skiff, and that's not very much room, however, I knew that I wanted something not too overwhelming, and something that wasn't going to take up much room on my desk. I felt that if I got a powered Mantis case, I would be overwhelmed with the question, "How the hell am I gonna fill this thing up?" I felt better knowing I could come back to that question at a later date after I've had some practice with the simple basics, not to mention I was just trying to be cheap(ish).

so you have one case - not 2 - you have multiple threads in the latest posts section - all with similar name - it is a bit confusing!!!

That raises the real question; Just what am I after in my rack?
I come from making and listening to progressive house, trance, industrial, idm, just all sorts of electronic music. So I knew I wanted variety. I knew I wanted something to engineer my own kick drums piece by piece. I wanted to make some melodic plucky moog-ish synths like Deadmau5. I knew I wanted some grungy crunchy percussive sounds like Nine Inch Nails. But I also want to practice more experimental things I could record to expand my productions and style. One other thing I thought about is this all has to go into my computer for editing, but I also want the option to externally sequence things with midi coming from my computer as well.

good that you are asking yourself that - good long term goals

you are not going to achieve all you want to, to any level where it is worthwhile, with a single row, nor probably 2 for that matter!

decide on one thing that you want to do and focus on that - you may find that you manage to do it!

So, in summary, here's what I chose to achieve just that:

uMidi - This is going to mainly be for external sequencing melodies, arps, kick drums, all from Ableton Live

Pamela's New Workout - I want to use this with the Sequencer I chose but also for the inputs of Basimilus, the trigger for Maths, and possibly to clock the uMidi. I alos love that i have 8 different outputs I can change with Euclidean rhythms and clock deviders/multipliers.

PNW will not clock the uMidi - read the spec clock is out not in!

Disting MK4 - I was recommended this module specifically for having more options in functionality. I like all the randomness it holds, as well as the amount of control and modulation it offers. Perfect swiss army knife with MANY options. I don't even know what ill use it for but I'm sure ill find something. What's important is having and learning about my options and unlocking functionality. And Disting is PERFECT for that.

Varigat 4+ - I knew I wanted a pretty standard sequencer with a cool balance between CV and Gate triggering, but I also found it useful that it comes with some scale shifting, quantization, different sequencing modes, and much more. I know I can also quantize it with Disting MK4 as a plus.

don't waste disting re-quantizing an already quantized note from the varigate - remember that whilst disting can do a shit load of things - iut can only do 1 at a time!!!!

BIA - Basimilus is just bad ass sounding. That's it.

uBraids II - I like the original Braids by Mutable Instruments. I had the option of playing with the digital version in VCV rack. I like that it has some preset sounds that I can use to my advantage in making my house tracks, with the option of slightly modulating their sound.

ONA - I wanted a standard oscillator with a few more wave forms, but what really drew me to this module is that it has an LFO setting, and octave shifts.

ONE - MAYBE 2 voices at most per row

3 is too many - you will not be able to fit the support modules you need in order to get the most out of them - sub mixers would be useful!!! maybe levit8 can manage to be a

if you want mulitple different tones use a single vco and multiple filters for variation

Maths - because who doesn't need a Maths? Ill primarily be using it for an envelope generator, but I'm sure ill use its other functions somewhere along my experimentation sessions.

download the illustrated manual - work your way through it multiple times

Polaris - I wanted this module because of its options. I wanted a filter that was useful in making some good plucky synths out of its frequency modulation, and some good drones with the bandpass setting. Seems like a good choice.

FX Aid - its got 32 different effects. sounds good to me. I also have the option to change the firmware to my wants.

go xl if you can - much better ergonomics and more modulation inputs - one of the joys of modular!!!

Levit8 - I chose this for the sake of having a mixer with many inputs and outputs. It seems like a great utility, and fairly simple with lots of functionality. Something useful.

So there you have it. Something simple, efficient, and wonderful to behold. It will be great for practice, and hopefully give me an idea for my next case.

-- Nabroc

& WTF - NO VCAs!!!!?????!?!?!?!?!?!

if you specifically want an adsr - get a doepfer one - they are inexpensive and will do the job perfectly well

otherwise the quadrax seems like a good deal - envelopes and lfos - which you also have in maths (but this is a good thing)

I'd get a matrix mixer next to experiment with combining different modulation sources (and some stackcables so you can use the original modulation source too)

external sequencing?
external mixing?
mostly 'popular' feature modules!
too many voices for this size case
no utilities?
consider swapping echophon for an fx aid xl - more versatile and a lot smaller!

if the case is one of the palette 104s, I'd seriously consider swapping it for a mantis - if you can find one - cheaper and more space - yeah I know 1u tiles are cute and all, but an extra 3u row is way more useful - and it's still portable - unless GF is very small and weak!

it's the patch cables - I think people associate analog and patch cables to some extent

replace the oscilloscope with a matrix mixer

if you feel you need an oscilloscope - just get a dso150 and work out how to connect it to the modular without taking up rack space!

@Traxy

all great reasons to go for a tiny case in you situation - although I am with troux on 62 hp probably being a better fit

tbh based on what you have said - I would not bother with the pod at all - I would just take stuff out of the nifty case make or buy some blind panels (cereal box cardboard is fine) and see if that helps - add the modules that you need to do your minimal generative setup and put the case money to one side - either towards a smaller case or a mantis in the future

this way you could just buy a quad cascading vca (if you don't already have one) I like veils for a multitude of reasons - and use that as a mono output module - that way you can explore what you can do with the O & C - with a bit more space - which may make it a bit more playable

I think it really depends on why you find it unplayable now? uncontrollable or un-ergonomic or too complicated

maybe share the nifty?

@troux - couldn't agree more regarding small focussed cases - especially when they're pulled out of larger cases - but as starter modulars I'm not convinced they are a great idea at all

EDITED Mar 9th 2021, 23:07

I checked the other half too before posting!
your hopes are unfounded Lugia!

hi all,

this is my actual physical rack - 5 cases - plus a case I need to build - to hold the DIY backlog and some other modules I want - really only needs power before I build it - I'm ordering the power this week!

over time modules have more or less been added wherever was free or where they got the best power (video modules) and it's a bit of a mess so as I add the 6th case, it feels like time to rearrange it

I'm not looking to add any more modules or swap out anything at all at the moment - although I can always see applications for more utilities, envelope generators and video modules, maybe even a couple more filters (I can fill the next case too) - so whilst suggestions are welcome this thread is primarily about re-arrangement

If any one who can is up for the challenge, please have a go at rearranging

a bit of further explanation (it might help)

the black blind panels and big gaps etc are meant to divide it into the 5 soon to be 6 actual physical racks that I have

upside down modules are either DIY backlog (mutable, blue lantern, synthonie) or to be purchased over the next few months (magneto, chromagnon, crossfader, deckard's voice, optomix, doepfer matrix mixer) - but for the purposes of this can be taken as in the case

the left 2 racks are 9u/104hp DIY case and a mantis - they are primarily video modules with a few analog utilities

the middle 2 racks are a 9u/104hp DIY case and a 6u/72hp bastl case - the bastl case will serve as an audio pull out - so this could be built as a separate instrument - hence the tm/tune/mixer with headphones etc

the right 2 racks are both 9u/84hp DIY - one of these rack is not built yet - but will be soon!

actual case arrangement is similar although the 2 84hp cases will be side by side, instead of on top of one another

the 84hp racks are in front of the tv and the other racks are to the left, the top 2 are on guitar stands

there is some scope to move the cases about a bit - I'm thinking of swapping the left and middle cases around - but then it would be mean that patching the audio modules over the video case - I could try to move the video modules to the 84hp cases but I've not looked into that for power reasons - I don't think there are any easy/optimum solutions:

for example a lot of the issues could be solved easily by having the 2 of the 9u case horizontally in front of the other 9u (where the 6u are now), but then I think it would be difficult to reach the ones on the guitar stands - and I would probably have to kneel - these cases are on the floor - but it would mean that a lot of the video modules would be straight in front of the TV

all the DIY cases have a befaco excalibus 1.2A +/-ve 12v (not sure what 5V is but overall 5v is negligible) the 104hp also have a frequency central psu in them, which is a further 500mA on +/-ve 12v rails

mantis is 3A +ve, 1.1A(?) -ve and something on the 5v

the bastl is 1.5A +ve, 0,5A -ve and I think it also has some 5v

modules that are in the video path are constrained to the mantis and the befaco power supplies (which seem clean enough)

chromagnon is to be powered externally and may get moved outside the case in the future (as it has it's own case - like a mom32) but it is better in the rack if possible

TL/DR

here is my audio/video modular - it is messy and needs re-arranging - please re-arrange, offer suggestions etc as you see fit - I think I need more envelope generators, utilities and video modules - but that is for sometime in the future

way way too many sound generators not enough of anything and everything else

imo

sound sources < sound modifiers < modulation sources < utilities

with at least 20% of the case for modulation and 30% for utilities

is always going to get better and more interesting results than anything else

in smaller cases probably even more utilities are actually needed (and are almost never there)

there are reasons why we usually suggest 1 voice per row, not 5!!!

please read the first post of this thread (on muffwiggler) https://www.muffwiggler.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=245154

EDITED Mar 9th 2021, 19:22

fill the case with utilities and maybe a bit more modulation (but not a lot)

specifically utilities for multiplying, modifying and merging modulation sources to create more complex ones

imo

sound sources < sound modifiers < modulation sources < utilities

with at least 20% of the case for modulation and 30% for utilities

is always going to get better and more interesting results than anything else