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Thanks all - helpful and given me some good points to think about. I think I am going to start small with a few modules and really try and understand them

Hi Garfield Modular,

Thanks for listening and for your comment, I'm glad that you found it enjoyable :)

I wasn't. When I started this release I already had a small system but it was insufficient, even for multitracking on a DAW. I'm relatively new to modular synths, I started my rack around 2017 and I learned how important it is to plan in advance the hard way. I bought six or seven modules I liked but had a hard time deciding in which direction I wanted to go. At the beginning I was looking for oscillators and sequencers and it didn't fit my way of working. I need modules that add some creative features or that can process samples on an interesting way. This is why now I'm using my rack mainly to achieve certain textures instead of a sound generator. I'm also using Ableton Live and the CV Tools pack makes the connection very straightforward.

I have been trying to create a drone/ambient "lab" in conjunction with other machines I have, but it is work in progress at the moment. I'm really looking forward to expand my rack and detach from the computer screen every now and then when needed.

One common theme when looking at starter systems is the need for more utilities, and for a better balance. As a newcomer myself I can say though that it's a bit challenging at times as there's a handful that always come up (Links, Kinks, Maths) but I feel like a nice comprehensive list would really help people to better understand the importance of these, the proper weight they should have in a rack, and how you as a newcomer will benefit from them. So I thought I'd throw this question out there: what would your top utility suggestion be in a new system, excluding the tried and true favorites above. I can even start it off by saying the secret Utility MVP in my racks so far has been the Intellijel Quad VCA (thank you @farkas again!), the cascading functions in particular are just sooooooo useful.

Anyway, curious what other people might think or have to share about this topic!

Wow...hm, a lot of this needs to be a lot smaller. As in, your VCF and modulation source take up 42 hp in a 104 hp row, which means that two basic functions require over 1/3rd of that row. This makes no sense.

If you've got a Doepfer Monster Case, then yes, I could see justifying that sort of attitude toward panel space. But this is a build in a small cab, where you simply DO NOT have the luxury of spreading out like that if you're trying to make a very capable modular. Plus, some of this might not be the right sort of gear for what you want, which includes "Atmospheric sounds, experimentation"; the Fusion Modulator's trapezoid gens actually are fairly FAST for the sort of very slowly developing sounds that work as drifty, atmospheric bits. And with all of the tube circuitry...did you check your current draws? Do these work with a Mantis? While that cab has a 3A +12V rail, note that this is broken up into three 1A "zones", and those tubes are sucking up a lot of current.

And here's another "warning flag": "any you would recommend that aesthetically look nice". OK...go look at a saxophone for a hot minute. While we all know the shape and such, because it's easy to use as an iconic form...the network of keys, levers, pads, cams, shafts, etc etc all over this form isn't exactly very "aesthetically nice", no matter how the builder tries to nice it up. It still looks like some mechanical engineer's worst fever dream. But all of that IS what makes the sax work.

In short, don't worry about what the build LOOKS like. In all likelihood, that front panel will be smothered in multicolored patchcord wirebarf anyway. Focus on FUNCTION. Sure, an all-black modular might look snazzy...but when you record it, does the blackness of that front panel influence the sound? No? Then don't bother with that aspect. Optimize the sonic capabilities while, at the same time, reducing the cost. F'rinstance, the Fusion VCO2s...OK, fine, they're black, they have tubes. But they take up 28 hp between them, plus tubes in the VCO...ah...really, you want to introduce those nonlinearities further down the signal chain, and have rather precise waveforms at generation. And together, they're $672 for just two VCOs. But at the same time, you could drop $15 more and get three Pittsburgh Lifeforms Primarys...which are more capable in terms of waveform manipulation, modulation capabilities, etc. No, they're NOT black. No, they DON'T look like any of the other modules. But none of that really should matter; you're making a musical instrument, not a movie prop, and visual aspects really should NEVER be a prime concern in that process, especially if they force you into a poorer functionality choice. This is just one example here; there are others, if you start looking.

Honestly, I'd tear this down and chalk it up as a learning experience. Some useful things to remember with MG, btw...

1) Your initial builds will NEVER work. Nobody does one-shots and nails the result. Nobody. Creating a modular build you'll want to use and live with for years takes time and a significant refinement process; fast results only yield crap that we'll be seeing chopped up and put on Reverb/eBay in several months' time.

2) Don't define the case FIRST. Instead, start with a much larger cab. Either you'll...a: find that the case WASN'T "too big", or b: you'll be paring the build down to eventually arrive at your desired build size, with ample space in which to do that.

3) MG isn't a video game. There's no score here. It's not a timed exercise. Get used to the notion of exploring the site in deeper ways, studying modules, existing builds by knowledgeable users, and the concepts behind modular synthesis. Trying to rush this is a good recipe for wasting money.

4) Understand that a good result WILL involve certain amounts of technical compromises. You simply won't be able to cram in every single function you want, so it's important that you sort out how to arrive at those compromises within the "box" of how you work on your music.

5) The amount of f**ks given about what a build looks like should be precisely concomitant with the page count of that storied tome "Famous Antarctic Television Personalities of the 16th Century" (ie: zero). And...

6) The boring-looking stuff is what makes the sexy-looking stuff WORK. Add unlimited snazzy modules at your peril!

Got an SQ-1, also. However, the best cheap external sequencer I can think of (and which I have two of, plus a Keystep and Keystep Pro) would be the Beatstep Pro. Very ample control, especially in live situations. Plus, you get two analog sequencer channels plus the trigger sequencer and its individual outputs.

"I also added in another VCO"
I would do the opposite

well I'd want multiple delays - but maybe that's just me
other things i'd want -
some sort of expression pedal adapter - Bastl Clutch, addac expression pedal adapter, 7 dials cv express etc
and an fx pedal adapter for adding n pedals
maybe something to do pitch to cv - disting does this and a few others

Nice one @mowse, really dug the voice intro at 4:50 or so, well done and very artful!

Working up pieces for another album. These both still need some tweaks, but I like them so far.

The background sound in Ridden is from my C-L Cocoquantus playing back and processing some Tetrax and a shaken half-full jar of water. The rhythm track on Invocation is my tongue drum sampled by Morphagene and then modulated by either a Nonlinear Circuits Triple Sloths running as fast as possible or a Hypster running slow. I can't remember. [edited] It was definitely the Triple Sloths, because that's also modulating Plaits in chord mode.

EDITED Jul 24th 2020, 12:56

Nice to know, thanks!

The database is utf8mb4 that means you can just copy/paste all the 🐶 🐱 🐭 🐨 🐯 🦁 🐷 🐽 😂😭🥺🤣❤️✨😍🙏from the web

They are nice, but we need more

@GarfieldModular, I actually meant to tell you, I was thinking of this as a "Garfield Patch" in my head since there's a lot of tonal and dynamic variation going on, and I'm basically just responding to that and tweaking a few knobs, "no notes into the system" as you say! Somehow it did get somewhere though, I'm glad you enjoyed it and thank you as always for giving it a listen!

The SQ1 is fun. I actually just sold mine though. It was definitely a very cost effective solution as I was starting out. I found that I wanted a lot more sequencing power very quickly, but everyone has different approaches.

The Varigate 4+ is a cool sequencer for a small rack because it has options for 4 gates, 4 CVs, or 2 gates/2 CVs, and you could always add a Voltage Block later for 8 16-step CV sequences.
-- farkas

another sequencing option could be a korg sq-1.but dont know if that would limit me

for some reason i cant see the reply?
-- Broken-Form

The post was auto flagged as spam for whatever reason. Changed that.

That's the whole request, would be a nice addition. Thank you!
-- troux

What's with those troll faces we have ?

The Varigate 4+ is a cool sequencer for a small rack because it has options for 4 gates, 4 CVs, or 2 gates/2 CVs, and you could always add a Voltage Block later for 8 16-step CV sequences.

for some reason i cant see the reply?

Hi Troux,

Oh yes, I did enjoy it :-) Thank you very much for sharing!

It's nice relaxing, I just came back from a weekend away from home and just before going to sleep listening at your track. relaxes me and with kind of spacious dreams I will look forward to my bed/space ship ;-)

With your previous track you took me to Alpha Centauri, now with this track no idea where I will end up but for sure even more further away :-)

I can't wait for more space-adventures from you and I am sure you will have a few more nice surprise for us :-) Kind regards, Garfield.

Hi Mowse,

Yes, I saw your picture of your EP-420, looks great indeed. It's a bit difficult to get here (Germany) Pittsburgh casing or modules at all, so I hope that will change in the future and will keep in mind the Pittsburgh casings, they certainly have a nice touch!

I look forward to hearing more nice stuff from you :-) Kind regards, Garfield.

Hi Farkas,

Ah, I am so happy you are still around :-) Yes, nice one indeed. Very recognisable that's you :-)

Keep it coming, I wouldn't mind it, thanks a lot for sharing and kind regards, Garfield.

Hi Marc Oller,

Oh this is nice music, what a long track :-) I enjoyed every minute of it and the nice video is a good added value!

Have you managed to do all the music by modular synths?

Thanks a lot for sharing and kind regards, Garfield Modular.

regarding sequencing,would something like the varigate 4 work?

After one year I have now filled the last hole in my rack. It happends to be with the Monsoon from Michigan Synth Works.
I just want to thank all of you that have helped me chosing the right modules by your comments to my posts.
A special thanks to GarfieldModular, Lugia and Ronin1974!

I have also learned a lot from the Youtube channels:
DivKid:
https://tinyurl.com/y3ddkxcj

Loopop:
https://tinyurl.com/y3j5gxqb

MylarMelodies:
https://tinyurl.com/yy8c9o6k

3 Modules:
https://tinyurl.com/y3mzmx5a

My own choice for just three module are Marbles, Plaits and Maths.
I think you can create incredible patches with just theese 3 modules plus the standard utilities.
Kind regards,
Rookie

thanks for all the suggestions guys,got alot to research

just noticing that i have two delays in there-- the Lyra and the Sound of Shadows. I'd rather keep the SoS, especially given its VCA. So I'm looking to fill up that last bit, if there's any ideas.

hi all, I'm developing a second rack specifically for processing guitar (and other electrical inputs), and this is what I've got so far: . I'm not worried about LFOs, since I have 6+ on my main rack that I can patch in, and I already have an output module there as well. What should I add for the final 7HP, and what seems unnecessary / redundant? Thanks!

Thanks for the reply - I have updated the rack based on your suggestions. I also added in another VCO of the Tabo Mirror as like the drone it puts it out - but not sure if overloading or if the space could have been used for something else?

Another thing I was considering but I don't know if a better idea or not, is to just get a pre built system like the Erica Synths Fusion 2 and just add things to it in a separate rack?

EDITED Jul 19th 2020, 04:54

Just treat the rack as a plan - and plans are great until you start to execute them - at which point they usually change

I think aesthetics are personal - I have a mix of red, black, aluminium and clear paneled modules - i'm more interested in what the modules do than what they look like to be honest

If I were to add modules I would add the following (you will need the bigger case!):

mutable links and kinks - an excellent utility starter set
a quad cascading vca - I like veils it is simple to use and has enough gain (20db) to act as an external input - you can also use it as a voltage controlled mixer (hence cascading)
a disting - either the ex or a mk4 - always there when you need it - if you keep using it for the same thing - buy a module that does that and use the disting for something else
a matrix mixer - there are a number to choose from - I'd probably go for either the AISynthesis one or the Doepfer

the usual advice is to just buy a few modules to start with - learn them and how they work together and then add other modules slowly - if you are in any way worried about being overwhelmed - this is definitely the way to go

maybe you should just get one vco, the filter, the modulator and the vca waveshaper ringmod - and seriously think about adding a few of the utilities above (links and kinks, maybe veils, maybe a disting) learn how to patch those together and then try to work out what you are missing - it might even be from your planned rack - who knows?

Nice rig and really well structured, kudos.

Just finished the new studio desk, modular case, and wiring. Such a change from the haphazard stack of 104HP skiffs and uZeus flying bus cables. Everything is now right where I want it to be.

"And my tears in league
With the wires and energy
And my machine
This is my beautiful dream"

http://www.climbhigher.net/images/EP-420-Build.jpg

Made a new one:

https://stevehand.bandcamp.com/track/akemies-drone

Definitely my favorite so far with my new rigs, long again (as always), ochd => Akemie => Zadar + VCA => Polaris => Mimeophon => Rings => Clouds, fairly simple patch-wise but with some nice variation going on (imho!). Sadly the second take was the best but it didn't record. That said I'm happy with it anyway, hope you all enjoy!

Thank you, for the kind words. I really appreciate it.

I've just finished the new studio setup. The Pittsburgh Modular Structure EP-420 is larger than life and beautifully made. Fire away at the sliding nuts, but I don't mind. It's simply gorgeous.

Looking forward to getting right to work on some new tracks.

Thanks for the feedback and some helpful food for thought

I guess one of the other things I am aware of is that as I am still new to this I don't want to overwhelm myself with things - would you think it may be better to simplify this rack idea - and what would you take out/put in? I could lose the FR Transient Plus and although the Morphagene looks fun, it isn't necessary.

As I say I started with the Erica Synths System 2 as a starting point but wanted to add some additional bits to go with it. I thought the Make Noise B&G system looked good but for some reason the demos didn't really do much for me in terms of the sounds coming out.

For the utility modules, is there any you would recommend that aesthetically look nice but are also relatively simple for a beginner?

EDITED Jul 18th 2020, 17:15

I see enough sound sources, modulation sources and sound modifiers for this size rack

I would keep links - not only does it have a buffered mult - which you should use for v/oct - you can then send a single v/oct to the 3 potential sound sources (odessa, e352 and clouds) but it also contains 2 basic mixers - which you will almost definitely be glad of - I do not see a dedicated sequencer!

the deficits in this rack are the same as in most newbie racks - although, yours is reasonably balanced - links and kinks are a great utility starter set imho - the lack of utility modules to support the shiny expensive ones - clouds (if it is an og or a 'faithful' clone) benefits greatly from some attenuators (I have a 2hp trim module either side of mine) - yes I know you have attenutaors in Maths, but why waste them like that - check the maths illustrated manual for why you shouldn't just see maths as a collection of utilities - but as a self contained analog computer for self-patching interesting functions

you have too many big feature modules and not enough support modules

In my racks I have about 30% of the space dedicated to utilities - this feels about right to me - whereas you have under 10% (the only thing I would class as a utility module that you have is a mixer and a single vca) - I might not use every single module in every patch - but quite often I do

spend some time thinking about how you would patch this - try arranging something similar in vcvrack and see just how many mixers, mults, vcas etc you really need to get the most out of that number of modules - play with a number of different types of utility module to understand how you would use them in your workflow - for example how you really need a sub-mixer to mix the vcos before hitting the filter etc etc

if you are 'married' to the modules you have chosen go for a bigger case (6u / 104hp or 9u /84hpfor example) - add in a quad cascading vca, some logic modules, sample and hold, rectification, utility mixers, mults, switches, matrix mixers

some people describe these modules as boring and whine about not wanting to spend money on modules that don't produce or effect sound - but these are generally people who have not learnt to patch modular synthesizers, yet - these functions are easily ignored if moving from a fixed architecture synth (or soft synths) to modular as most of them are almost always hidden or obscured in some way

but utility modules are the (relatively inexpensive) dull polish that make the expensive, shiny modules, shine brighter and prevent tarnishing

This is my rack idea and hoping for feedback or advice as this will be my first delve into full modular after a Doepfer Dark Energy and Moog Grandmother. Is there anything obviois missing or seems out of place?

[Edit: Idea Updated]

Also I was looking at a Tiptop Audio Mantis Blue to house which has 2 x 104 HP and 6U. Would you think this would be OK for this rig?

A bit about my purpose - I love lots of different types of sound and music and already have my rig for music production (including a TR8s, OB6, Blofeld, Minitaur, Future Retro Revolution, Grandmother and Dark Energy) so this really would be about having fun and exploration with sound, but could be great to incorporate into my other work possibly - particularly as I would like to use this opportunity to focus more on creating dark ambient, deep vibes as well as on the flipside harder techno/hardcore (but don't necessarily need a system that can do all of that in one).

I have also been listening to a lot of eastern music recently and interested in exploring different rythms.

Although I know it should not be the driving force of decision making I am a very visual person so the look of the modules is almost as important to me as the function - I am immediately attracted to modules such as the Euclidean Circles as well as other interesting designs and colours. I'm not too fussed about getting things that everyone else has (although understand many modules are popular for a reason) but at the same time wouldnt want unecessary or poor value modules.

I was initially thinking of starting with an all in one unit such as the Make Noise B&G system plus which looks great and there are a lot of modules in there which seem strong but I don't think all of them would suit my style. I have however, been very impressed with the videos I have seen of Erica Synths and was particularly interested in their Fusion System 2.

Therefore my rack idea borrows a lot from this system but swapped their delay/flanger with the Folktek as it looks cool. I added the FR transient for drum/loops (althouh I have also been thinking of Plaits and maybe a 3hp Pico Erica Synths drum module instead along with the Euclidian Cicles to help with rhythm. I added a mixer as would like to connect to my external mixing desk to plug into speakers/Daw

It would be great to sync with my external gear but I do have a Beatstep Pro so assume can do via this to sync with extermal drum machine/synths etc. Its not essential but would be fun.

EDITED Jul 19th 2020, 04:53

(dont know how i get the rack picture updated:))
-- Broken-Form

Go back to the rack's page, refresh it, then check in View: Screenshot to see if the screenshot pic matches what you see in the layout. If not, refresh again and check again. If it works, it should be possible to refresh this thread and see the new version.

Yes you should be able to connet the Outputs from your module into the Ins on your mixer just like any other instrument. I have not used Reaper but assume you just set up the soundcard connections and select the audio channel with the module on it - at least that's how I would do it in Cubase.

Just do a couple of test records to make sure audio is coming though on the correct channel before getting too involved (I have done this before and wasted a whole session by not having the correct line selected).

EDITED Jul 20th 2020, 10:19

Thank you @yari! Great seller! Happy dealing with you!

Thanks for checking it out. I keep getting sucked into having fun with the lo-fi minimal thing. :)
I'm actually getting ready to start a different kind of project in a few minutes.
Take care!

Good one @farkas, everything's feeling super integrated, it's pretty impressive.

Hi! I'd like to share with you my new release, it's called Recel. I used my eurorack mainly as an effects processor for some sounds, but also Clouds for some textures.

I have some Brazilian roots and have been researching Brazilian music and culture for some years now. Lately I've been focusing on the Indians and I've discovered that they have a very happy musical style. I also had the opportunity to visit some communities. Unfortunately, our so-called progress is putting a lot of pressure on them and they are forced to abandon their lands or let go of their traditions. In my opinion this has to change.

I am part of a collective called Amatori. We are just a few friends who like to create and play music together in our free time. This is our second release and this time we decided to do a limited run of 50 cassettes.

Please feel free to share the music if you like it or show it to someone who might like it. You can also buy the cassette, download the digital version for free or name your price on our Bandcamp page;

amatori.bandcamp.com

I hope you like it!

have updated the rack abit,going home from holiday today so will update it more when i get home.

i actually have the newest version of maths arriving on monday

(dont know how i get the rack picture updated:))

EDITED Jul 17th 2020, 09:36

Felt like doing a cover, so here's my take on Suicide's 1977 minimal synth punk beast, "Ghost Rider." Might not be everyone's cup of tea, but I can't stop experimenting with the post-punk sound through modular.
Eloquencer sequencing AJH Minimod, Rings (in Easter egg mode), Blck_Noir, and vocals through a harmonica mic into Milky Way. Glitch visuals from The Outsiders.

Thanks, as always, for your time!

Hi Mowse,

This is serious stuff! You are blowing my head clean off with this track ;-) The way you take your time and slowly build up the tension in the track and let the listener relax, sit back, and yet very exciting listening experience.

I can put a lot more prose here but this is just fantastic, so good, so enjoyable! No further words needed other than that I want your list of concert data! The only bugger at the moment is Covid but straight after that I hope you will consider a few concerts in Germany :-)

I look forward in seeing you performing live and kind regards, Garfield.

Not too shabby. Although, there's some areas that could be whupped on a bit more...

First up, you might find that a Wasp VCF is a bit too aggressive for ambient. It's also kinda simplistic, which (given ambient's reliance on shifting timbres) could be a drawback. Instead, look at some more complex filters such as Doepfer's A-106-1 (has an insert in the feedback path, allowing you to majorly screw with this via delays, reverbs, etc etc), Limaflo's Motomouth (morphing formant filter), a Rossum Linnaeus (stereo SVF with thru-zero capability), or Intellijel's Morgasmatron (complex dual state-variable, pretty much a "Swiss Army Knife" filter).

As for the VCO situation, I disagree with the above poster. You should look into a VCO setup that has a lot of capability for strange modulation methods, like Intellijel's Rubicon3 or Xaoc's Odessa, plus also consider a simple VCO or two (like Noise Reap's interestingly screwy Bermuda or uBermuda) for AF modulation of either the Cloud Terrarium or whatever second source oscillator you choose. But you DO need more than just the Cloud Terrarium for the sake of sonic complexity/density.

Modulation sources...first of all, that version of Maths is long-discontinued. The 2019 one should be in here unless you have one of these early ones on hand. Batumi + Poti = good. No envelopes (I don't consider the Maths to be just an EG) = bad. A good choice there would be Intellijel's Quadrax, which sort of condenses their Quadra and the Quadra Expander into a single quad function generator. And yes, a Sloths would fit very well here, as might a VERY long EG such as 4ms's PEG.

Things to lose: Links (don't use a mult module in a small build...use inline mults instead), Kinks, and the Ladik mixer. As for the latter two, you need a more comprehensive random source module, with the pinnacle being something like the Verbos Random Sampling (offers many Buchla 265 SoU functions, plus has a shift register for canonic polyphony)...and you need a better mixer that can offer CV over functions such as panning, level, AUX send; the Qu-bit Mixology would be a better fit, and also allow the Erbeverb to be used in a proper AUX send/return fashion.

Now, as for the sequencing...this is where the definition of "ambient" comes into play. Are you trying to do something more determinate and/or "Berlin School"-ish, or do you need something more random or generative and stochastic-based? Or does this need to be more akin to a controller/sequencer, such as a Make Noise Rene/Tempi combo? And whichever one is needed will ALSO determine what ancillary modules are needed to go with it, so it's a bit of a "hole" until/unless you can define how you want that to work compositionally.

Lastly...make the cab bigger. Not that you'll actually wind up with a huge cab, but it helps to be able to create a fully overblown version of what you have in mind first, then pare this back down to something more workable...unless, of course, big is OK.

Hi Gabor,

Oh this is nice and interesting! Again nice usage of the Planar and your OP-1 just complements the setup here.

I love the effects in this track, with some nice stereo effects in there too. I also appreciate the video, it's nice and interesting to see you at work here, well done!

The perhaps nicest thing to notice here is your "dark forest of cables", massive and impressive to look at it while enjoying to listen at your music :-)

Keep up the good stuff, I enjoyed every second of it and kind regards, Garfield.

Been really busy this past week and also preparing to move "all the things" into a Structure EP-420 and onto a new studio desk. Managed to sneak in a quick little jam last night. Started with Marbles and Rene into DPO and Trident and let things evolve. Should be settled in by the weekend for some sit down time with the new setup.

Thanks for listening!