Yup! Lugia is spot on. Not only that when you consider the layout: wires up top, knob down bottom: input on the left, outputs on the right, you simply have far less chance of dropping leads. and like Lugia said the pin sockets and the new wires make it even better. It's a well thought out design.
The forums will time out. This was done in order to deal with some issues with spamming some time ago, and while it's an inconvenience, eventually you learn to copy your post before dropping it just in case.
Again, why do this with a modular? You could go nuts on eBay if the objective is effects processing; the same amount that would get you a modular system could ALSO allow you to fully populate a 12U rack with amazing processing gear and a small desktop mixer to control the whole mess, with beer money left over at the end. And while Eurorack modules go for no-joke money, studio-grade processors are getting blown out on the used market for dimes on the dollar.
Modular synths ARE NOT a necessary device. NOT. NECESSARY. They exist these days because 1) there are some of us out here who need them to get into sonic territory that's very uncharted or 2) a sizable contingent of people have become convinced that they ARE necessary...until they get hold of one, and then you lose about 2/3rds+ of that crowd when they discover that a modular is neither a "magic box" nor "easy". Naturally, this'll make for a very interesting used synth market in a decade or so...but I'm pretty sure that wasn't an intended outcome.
A good 75% of prospective modular synth buyers would probably be far better off, more productive, and less frustrated by something other than a modular synth. Trust me on this. I know they look cool and all that, but unless you're VERY certain about both the direction of your music AND your hardware capabilities, you're apt to find yourself in the deep end of the pool very quickly, to say nothing of the smoking hole in your Magic Plastic.
OK...a couple of things jump right out. First up, aside of the Dual FX, you don't have anything in here that's stereo. Yes, I know the Mixup seems to be stereo...but look closely: there's no panning on that. It's more of a "summing mixer", not something that can actually allow you to spatially-locate sound. Then, by extension, the Audio IO becomes pointless as well. Taken together, that's $350-ish, and it doesn't quite accomplish what it needs to. So...look instead at Doepfer's A-138s, which IS a four-in stereo mixer, and then at Happy Nerding's OUT, which gives you transformer isolation, a parallel stereo bus input, and master level controls...plus a headphone pre, 1/4" outs, and metering. Total: $270. Every bit counts, after all...
Then, I'd remove the drums. Seriously...you're probably better off with a dedicated drum machine, as this rig here doesn't really have the sequencing needed to support drum programming. And also, since there's no sequencing here, why is there a quantizer in there? Certainly not for the MIDI CVs...that's already quantized.
Filters...sort of redundant, really. The Forbidden Planet and the uVCF are rather similar designs. If you're going to have two VCFs in here, make them pretty divergent in sound...that way, you can put one out front as a "lead" voice and the rest of the sound can go thru the other.
Envelopes...the Quadra is decent as a two-stage EG, three if you use the ASR mode. But there's nothing here that can really make the filter(s) shine; for that, you'll probably need a couple of proper ADSRs...something like Doepfer's A-140-2. And then, with that in place, you can scale your AR envelopes back a bit.
TBH, the best way to reduce the budget here might be to make the build larger. That might sound counterintuitive, but the fact is that smaller modules tend to cost more in the long run than ones that take up more space, mainly because you can cram loads of them in. By moving up to a 2 x 104 hp cab, you can then put in a larger module that can cost the same (or less) that also gives you more functionality. For instance, let's say you were able to swap that 2hp LFO for a Noise Reap uLoaf. Same price. BUT...the uLoaf gives you a second LFO, more functions, some random capabilities in only 4 hp more space. But wait, there's more!...
Let's look at the cost of the spaces each module takes up! Now, $99 / 2 = $49.50 per space covered. But the Noise Reap comes in at $16.50 for each. So what's going on here? Simple...as you build up a row, make note of each module's cost per hp like that, then average this out when the row is populated so that you can see what a row costs per hp. This is a good indicator of your build costs; the lower that cost per hp number goes, the more cost-effective the build is. Filling a row out that comes in at an average of $17/hp is better than $21/hp, cost-wise...and by using that little formula, you can account for a single module that jacks up the row cost across the entire row's cost profile.
One last warning: this isn't a video game. You don't have a "win" here, there's no timer, no score. Don't EVEN try and get things right on your first build on MG; at this point, you're just sorting out that there's this many modules. It's NOT necessary to get the first build right...basically, NO ONE gets the first build right. Ever. Period. Even if you have decades of experience. Instead, whittle at this for a while...several weeks, maybe a few months...while researching what will get you a sound that's your sound. Proceed at a pace that works for designing something you'll live with for literally YEARS and which costs a sizable chunk of money. Speed, basically, is NOT of the essence here.
Dupont leads really aren't all that problematic. One colleague of mine is using a Starter 2 extensively for live work, and he reports that the new pin sockets on the modules are considerably more stable than typical protoboard connectors. It's also possible that Korg skimped on those and got ones that're very shallow to better fit the Volca form factor; the deeper connectors I have on my Mescaline and my Bastl devices don't drop leads.
They come out easily when I need them to. I've never had a wire come out while I was recording for even noodling around. Being a saxophone player in a former life, I'm used the needed dexterity. It simply isn't a problems for me. Honestly, Moogs have the only truly secure cables. Everyone else's connections are, well . . .
The latest version of the AE Modular wires are designed and made specifically for the AE Modular system, so they are much more secure than the original.
I bought the Starter 2 synth from Noisebug. Pretty sure I bought the very last one they had in stock! Then I ordered the following from Robert: 2 sequencers, two extra VCOs, an extra LFO, strings(Solina), slew limiter, MS20 filter, an extra 2x16U case & flying buses, and few other utility modules like headphone amps, stereo out and etc. The good thing is every module has a multiple, so no need for dedicated multiples. (NOTE: To clarify the AE Modular system uses Us instead of HP. Each module is 1U wide, and that serves as the standard measurement instead of HP.)
So this little rig will have 5 oscillators, three LFOs, three filters. noise, 2 samples & holds, 2 EG, 2 VCAs lots of utilities with plenty of room to grow. I'm really waiting on the quantizer. That's the one module this system sorely needs. The quantizer being geared fro production as we speak, so I'll just wait until the next round to get them. I was going to wait, but I figure go ahead and get my main order in to flesh out the lion's share of the system, then come back later with another order once the quantizers have been released.
It's a pretty good deal, and the sound is amazing. I'm happy with it. I will probably build a road case for it so I can take it with me and have it survive, lol!
Still seeing some flaky behavior with screenshot functions
-- LugiaThanks for reporting, it should work again for now with help from the wonder called "server reboot". I try to find out what the reason for all the trouble is ...
-- modulargrid
It looks like it's down again. None of the screenshot functions work and you get an error after it attempts to load.
Nice. Do you find that the wire easily pull out? That was an issue with the volca.
What modules do you have in AE format?
It's certainly affordable and has some cool modules, but given my time with a Korg Volca Modular, I wouldn't enjoy using patch wires instead of actual cables...
You should look for an Intellijel Atlantis. It's inspired by and sounds like the Roland SH-101, which BOC used extensively for their basslines and melodies.
around 1 min here:
and here:
But for effects, a Mimeophon does nice warm delays and pseudo verb, I'd recommend a Mutable rings to run audio into. I've created some really BOC-esque sounds by running drums into it and modulating the pitch/shape. Mutable's Clouds is no longer made, but I'd say get that or one of the newer clones like a Monsoon for granular processing/pitch shifting/general chaos.
Hello everyone,
New to eurorack, just planning my first synth. Please tell me everything wrong with this setup (which definitively would cost me a fortune).
I would keep Maths and Marbles (yes they are expensive but I want them in the rack).
What am I missing? Are there cheaper (and/or better) alternatives to modules I have selected?
Not sure how to post the preview of the rack... here is the link:
Rack
Thank you!
Ciao.
I also have this issue in Firefox... I came to the forums this morning to voice a complaint.
Mine seems like the cookie times out though. Like the next day I have to login again. The cookie keeps until I sleep my computer. The keep me logged in does nothing. Win10 Enterprise latest FF. I do run some extensions so I am going to do some testing disabling one at a time.
Ok guys, that certainly makes sense. I guess I asked the wrong questions then because yeah... I dont think I would want to completelyyyy create a polysynth from the whole way up for sure.
I like the idea of having something to run my hardware stuff into (or even coming out of my comp if need be), basically I guess what I was trying to ask/get some advice on IS and FX rack. Whenever I have fucked around on here doing some designs it seems that is actually more along the lines of what I have researched out a bit, seemingly mostly modulation/effects based modules as opposed to oscillators themselves from the ground up. I definitely dont have a laundry stash of cash kicking around... but I do want to slowly start dipping my feet into the eurowater here \m/
OK... soo... since you guys still know wayyyy more about actual modules that could be good id love to hear some ideas here... most of my guitar work and pedal preferences have always been based around reverb, chorus and delay pedals... ive messed around with Zvex's Lo-Fi Junky module a few times at a buddies, which is sort of the kind of tape/warble type situation i guess im looking for sound design wise in certain ways... And certainly I guess I would be running some samples through this beast. I am looking for something that I can use to make drone-y environments with those IDM sounds basically being the product in certain respects.
EDIT: I guess I should say, a very big thing that im inspired by across all synths and FX is the idea/ability to create sounds from randomness... so I guess thats something to consider as well for what Im thinking. I know there are a lot of wacky Mutable Instruments modules that may kind of help me out there that could be built into this FX rack?
You could do an FX rack and process one of your hardware/software synths through it. There's lots of really capable effects in eurorack and you can get creative with custom feedback loops and modulation without having to hook up a million different pedals. Like everyone else has said, eurorack is an expensive way to create a polysynth that's probably disadvantaged compared to regular polysynths, but sticking to FX, samples or monophony might scratch your itch for sound design.
Is it possible to create a polyphonic synth in Eurorack. Yes. But you're reinventing the wheel in the most expensive manner possible. When you stated "pads" and by listening to your examples... I heard polyphonic sounds. Each voice has its own filter, VCA, and other elements. You'd have to reconstruct that in Eurorack, piece for piece with addition modules to handle things like routing pitch and gate to available oscillators, VCAs (possibly filters) etc.
You can definitely use Eurorack modules as part of an effects chain that you plug your hardware synths into. That's not any major issue between converting line level (hardware synth output) to Eurorack level (a lot hotter than your hardware synth). There are ways to sync your hardware synth to Eurorack and then modulate things in relation to the sequence as well.
My big point is to see if you can get where you want to go out of what you have rather than trying to make it work in Eurorack... which isn't a good fit for what you're wanting to do... as far as I can tell. There are lots of reasons to get into Eurorack. But it's a MONEY PIT... a sweet money pit... but still a money pit.
Nope, Ronin's quite right here. Eurorack isn't the right thing for basic pads and the like. First of all, pads get you into the polyphonic end of the pool, and that's one area where Eurorack (or any other modular system) gets VERY spendy. You would need...
1) at least two VCOs per voice
2) a VCF per voice
3) a VCA per voice
4) a mixer module that can handle this properly
5) a polyphonic MIDI controller and a Eurorack MIDI interface that supports your needed voice count
6) all of the other stuff you'd need in the cab to support this.
Potentially, a few thousand dollars AT BEST for a very simple modular poly. Compare this with something like a Modal Argon 8, which comes in at $750 street and which is a far more capable polysynth than anything you could concoct in Eurorack without spending close to $10k or worse. Unless you have this sort of cash laying around in a collection of laundry hampers and bushel baskets, this isn't your best solution. Oh...and the space for this honker, too. Can't forget that...
A better solution for you, since you're clearly more accustomed to the software environment, would be VCV Rack. In it, you can actually assemble a modular polysynth (IF you have enough speed and processor capability!) and see what I'm talking about here. And ultimately, you're probably best tinkering with this QUITE a bit before pulling the trigger on any hardware; know your problem before trying to solve it!
But it is possible is it not? Ive messed around with my buddies rack which is mostly Make Noise modules and ive certainly found it to be capable of some cool sounds... obviously lots of wacky weird stuff like most racks, but I found that it was very interesting at the same time.
Yeah for sure ive got tons and tons of guitar pedals and a few decent hardware synths... I am just very intrigued by perpetually modifying and refining things until ive narrowed in on the ideal canvas of noise.
Eurorack isn't for you based on what you're describing. I would look for older, retro polysynths and guitar pedals. You're not going to do well creating pads in Eurorack on-the-cheap.
Hey guys and gals... so, im an in-the-box kind of guy for all my synths currently. I have tons and tons of experience using virtual synths and have a fairly specific style that I am after and would certainly love some advice/help in designing something to achieve the sounds im looking for with relative ease in a rack synth.
Ive designed a few racks on here before, many in my list but I am certainly unexperienced with actual physical modular gear.
Ostensibly I am looking for that Boards of Canada type sound, very 70's/80's sounding old VHS warbley atmospheric pads and leads... Sort of like these synths that I use heavily:
Amongst many others in my collection, but I think that comes across sound wise that I am looking to build. Mostly almost a midi controllable pad synth in a lot of ways. I am looking for it to be fairly simple for sure, (not horrendously expensive if I can manage it haha, I know modular gets ridiculously expensive from the couple I have mapped out) yet something that I can achieve a ton of different sounds along those lines.
Id love some help, and build ideas. Thanks a bunch.
This is my current rack. It's driven by an Analog 4. With four CV/ Gate/ Clocks via 2 Doepfer Buff mults in the low left side.
I see it as 2-4 voices. But I tend to us 1 or 2 at a time.
Out from the Doepfer Mini Stereo Mixer goes to the Analog 4 inputs usualy as 2 mono channels hard panned or sometimes direct to my Octatrack for looping.
Usual style is techno or more downtempo electronica.
Thanks Garfield for a nice comment!
And thank you Lugia for (as always) very interesting tips. I think these kind of modules are the stuff that I need but not are aware of. I will check Ladiks logic manuals and see how they can help me. I know my patches are very basic, but I learn along the way.
A few other points, also...first up, you don't have enough sources that require stabilized CV for pitch, so the buffered mult is pretty useless here. Rule of thumb is that once you get beyond feeding three sources with the same CV, you'll want to buffer that to avoid CV sag and resulting tuning problems...but with what you have here, you won't need this. Just mult things out with inline mults or stackcables, and you'll be golden.
Now, having removed the buffered mult, you now have an 8 hp hole. So...try this: remove one of the Quad VCAs altogether. Then into the hole, put a Happy Nerding 3xVCA, and use this in THAT position for your CV/mod level control, and the remaining Quad VCA for your audio + mix to mono. This leaves a free 2 hp there in the second row (2hp DC-coupled mixer for CV/mod combination?), and 12 up top. My next move there would be to add one more device, something you can use as a doubler for one (or both) of the audio samplers. Like this: https://www.modulargrid.net/e/flight-of-harmony-sound-of-shadows which is a delay line that would work great for doubling, plus it also offers an insert loop in the delay's feedback path for even more fun. It's sorta gritty, too...adds character, done right. That way, you don't have to tie up the Mimeophon for simple delays, making it more useful for global delays/loops.
Oooo...you might add something like this: https://www.modulargrid.net/e/ladik-s-186-dual-delay or this: https://www.modulargrid.net/e/ladik-s-090-dual-probability-skipper Both could be fun...the first would allow you to offset the timing of whatever was being clocked through it, letting you "slip" the other sequential parts. And the other would allow the sequencer to actually skip a pulse (or three) to let the sequencer fall off of whatever primary beat was underpinning things. Toss a delay line into this for audio strangeness, and you'd have something pretty nifty...and not for a whole lot, given how cheap the Ladik modules are.
...I fear people might start listing modules at unrealistic prices in order to game such a guide. Both inflated and undervalued scenarios are plausible.
-- senor-bling
Actually, a problem like this exists on eBay, and he's known as the "Flower Pot Guy". Infamous. The user posts up pro audio gear at prices which are sometimes twice the normal average, and charges "normal" prices for stuff that's broken. The name comes from his habit of putting the gear in front of some cheap clay flowerpots before photographing it, and its been going on for literally years.
The problem arises when you have non-online dealers that might be trying to price some obscure device, and they use this bastard's inflated prices as their own, because...hey, HE asked that, so WE should ask that too! I've actually run into this once or twice, and dissuading dealers from following this jackass's prices is like pulling teeth...until/unless they recognize that they might not sell the device in question at those insane prices of his. But his antics have caused considerable problems on that platform for pro audio shoppers for the precise reason you mention here. MOST...but not all...have learned to ignore him, but his "au-thor-i-tay" is still occasionally cited by non-eBayers for their own psychotic used gear prices.
Mmmm...except...there's some things missing here: phantom power and impedence settings. Very important...
If you're planning to use a high-end condenser mic for your horn, this might prove to be a problem. A better idea would be to go with something like this: https://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/MixingLink--eventide-mixing-link-preamp-and-fx-loop and then take the line out from this (or the AUX port) and go to a more conventional input preamp such as a Doepfer A-119 for your boost to synth level and the envelope follower/gate result. A box like this also allows for a separate FX loop besides the modular. As for modules WITH phantom power...ahh, you're utterly screwed unless you hold an AMEX Black Card, because then you're looking at Cwejman stuff, and that ain't cheap! Even at $300 for the Eventide box and $100 for the A-119, you're STILL a few hundred ahead of that.
However, if your horn has a piezo pickup (most wind pickups these days are), then you'll need a module that doesn't have phantom power, but a suitable hi-Z input setting so that the piezo sounds natural. In this case, no external box would be needed, but you'd want to look into something like Sputnik's EF/Preamp, which has the necessary impedence adjustments for this.
The Erica module IS NEAT, no doubt...but it's not out yet. These other solutions are, and they should work just fine.
Hi Rookie,
You got a nice rack there! :-) I like the relaxing music, makes me cool and calm down after a very busy day!
Kind regards, Garfield.
For review reports of Eurorack modules, please refer to https://garfieldmodular.net/ for PDF formatted downloads
Yep, good advice. Cara and nrings seem to be assembled.
I wonder why the Michigan Synth Works rings clone is 100E more expensive than the two others.
I'll have a look to Mimeophon.
Thanks :)
Thank for those precious advices :)
Which clones of Marbles and Rings are the best ? Cara and nRings ?
Nothing else missing ?
-- vincentprimault
Just a note: some of those clones are DIY only, so just be aware of that unless you’re cool putting stuff together and soldering and whatnot. Also, if you’re looking for weird experimental sounds, Make Noise’s Mimeophon is worth a look, though it might be more hp than you’d prefer. I’m actually working with the same setup you are (Rackbrute 6U and Minibrute 2S), so have fun: it’s an awesome ride. And feel free to PM me if you want to talk further—I’m a big Depeche Mode fan.
Thank for those precious advices :)
Which clones of Marbles and Rings are the best ? Cara and nRings ?
Nothing else missing ?
If you don't care about the size of the knobs, clones of Marbles and Rings will save some rack space. The Batumi always needs the 3HP Poti expander.
The 1010 Music FX Box will also run the two other firmwares, so you have another synth and a drum module there as well (just only one at a time). I'm not sure why you have all of those mults. Maybe one buffered mult. But passive mults are a real waste in a small space. Apart from the convenience, you're better off with external splitters.
I'm sort of in favor of such a thing as well. However, I fear people might start listing modules at unrealistic prices in order to game such a guide. Both inflated and undervalued scenarios are plausible. Adding to that, since the marketplace doesn't have a full order/checkout process, there's no way of telling whether a module has actually been sold at the price listed.
Check out the sticky topic "Using the planner". Maybe the keyboard shortcuts will help you accomplish what you want.
Marbles and Minibrute 2S sequencer plays an A minor pentatonic scale randomly through Plaits, 2HP Pluck, a flute sampled in Disting MK4 and Minibrutes VCO 1.
Is there a way to control to which rack a module is added?
I created 4 or 5 different racks and want to copy some modules of each into a new "buy this" rack. Therefore I opened each module in a separate tab, but "add to rack" does not add to the desired target. I closed all other tabs that have racks and only opened the "buy this" rack.
Any other workflow that would help?
This one will put all my musical ground together. This will raise my horn to a galactic level. I'll be patient enough… I hope!!
Still seeing some flaky behavior with screenshot functions
-- Lugia
Thanks for reporting, it should work again for now with help from the wonder called "server reboot". I try to find out what the reason for all the trouble is ...
Beep, Bopp, Bleep: info@modulargrid.net
Thanks to the ModularGrid developers, you can now go directly to the virtual VCV Rack version of a module if it exists by clicking "Available for VCV Rack" on the sidebar of a ModularGrid page. Example: https://www.modulargrid.net/e/mutable-instruments-plaits
You can also go the opposite direction, but clicking on the ModularGrid link on a VCV Library module page. Example: https://library.vcvrack.com/AudibleInstruments/Plaits
So far there are about 100 modules on ModularGrid with authorized VCV Rack clones. Soon we'll have more clones of Malekko, Grayscale, Befaco, and Mutable Instruments modules, as well as some brands I can't announce yet. If anyone sees any errors with the links, let me know here or by emailing contact@vcvrack.com.
.pngs might scale a bit better, but MG accepts JPEG just fine as well. It's pretty forgiving about image quality. However, I avoid the autocrop function, and crop everything before loading. That way, there's less for MG to chew on, which is more efficient.
Still seeing some flaky behavior with screenshot functions, such as linking in rack images in forum posts. When attempting to load just the screenshot of a project from last night, the shot wouldn't load at all in its window...I got an error message instead. And in the forum post in question, it will only put up a generic link to the build's page, probably due to the screenshot function being linked to the forum's image display capabilities.
Good choice. The Pittsburgh Structure cabs are built like a brick s**thouse, too, which means all of these widgets will have a very sturdy home. Plus with the +12V rail total PLUS inrush figures coming in at around 2.5A, it's got the P/S that can handle that...and then some! Should be a killer rig once it's built...
Hey Lugia,
Thanks for the improvements, it looks great to me now. I'll probably go for a Pittsburgh Structure Ep 208 case (you've advised it to me in a past treat) both because of the cost and solid power supply to keep the system safe.
Hope to carry out something really enjoyable from this system throughout years.
All the best,
Marco
Thanks for the advice!
A stereo mixer and some more VCAs will be added.
More logic modules is put on the wish list.
Now I will start to build. But it is hard to decide in what order I shall buy the modules.
I guess I have to start with a simple voice: VCO+VCF+VCA+LFO+EG+mixer and a sequencer or Marbles.
Sometimes the machines rebel and the automatism does not work. So see the note from further up:
So if the autocrop does not work uploaded PNGs that were edited with an external software indeed give the best results.
I have reworked the pictures, your pedalboard looks good now.
Thanks for the info and rework! Just to be clear, you're saying a reworked PNG is better than a jpg?
I am in the middle of making an 84hp 6u rack using the Doepfer DIY Kit and Laser Cut Acrylic.
I plan to have a rig that is good for soundscapes/ambient (melodic). I plan to use the OP-Z to send CV and Clock in some cases; it will for now, be a bit of a brain. I (like many) love granular sounds and want to use this along with there stereotypical soft chimes and plucks that many get nowadays.
As a guitarist with some pedals (delay, reverb etc) I would like to be able to utilise these. I have included I/O and Ears to get both audio from the OP-Z (I an run a drum track from that for now - panned left and right into the InAmp, and then around the rack, Ears for other inputs). I wonder if there is a specific send/return module that I should consider to use the pedals?
I have put together the following proposed modules:
https://cdn.modulargrid.net/img/racks/modulargrid_1144642.jpg
I would welcome criticism, along with any guidance as to 'what to get first' that will be usable with the kit described above. I have included a Marbles clone but had looked at the Chance too - I haven't formed a strong opinion on this yet...
Do I need Maths... everyone has Maths...
Thanks!
EDIT: struggling to understand how to insert a screenshot, sorry!
Lovely little module.
Just a heads up: if you use it for audio, it doesn’t fully close.
