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After some consideration my mind wandered off from moar modules, to... playing.
Twisting knobs and playing theremin won't go together very... um... melodically, right?
Yes and no. It's true that the OG theremins had minimal timbral control. But in the present day, you've got Peter Blasser making his post-West Coast devices which sometimes house multiple theremin circuits, with the ability to mess with those to use them for all sorts of purposes. The Deerhorn Organ (https://ciat-lonbarde.net/ciat-lonbarde/deerhorn/index.html) actually has three different theremin controllers, with the ability to patch them into all sorts of configurations.
Is an expression pedal module worth consideration?
I would rather not look too much into guitar pedals as an fx alternative (researching modular is enough).
Oh, yeah...I've got a good "library" of them, and thanks to Ryan over at 60 Cycle Hum on YT making his jaw-dropping clip about the Cuvave fuzz , I got deep into the Chinese stompboxes. And the "why" there gets explained by that YT clip...these Chinese pedals are really more like little boxes of sonic surprises. Yes, a huge number of them are supposed to be clones of existing models from other manufacturers, but note that "supposed to be" part. Given differences in component tolerance, the reverse engineering processes they use, and on and on...they never exactly behave like their counterparts. So when, for example, I hooked up a Joyo "Classic Flanger" and expected basic plain-jane flanging but instead got something like MXR's wall-powered tripout-monster (not in production these days) from the 1970s...yeah, that's why I get these things. Just check all of the YT demos by bunches of YT creators and see how things sound in various hands, and you'll see what I'm talking about here.
One I will suggest, though, is Aural Dream's "Breath Delay". Basic analog delay...except for this one little switch marked "NO" and "GH". And what THAT does is to let you build up layers of stuff on the delay tails when it's set to "GH" (for "GHost", with "NO" for "NOrmal" operation). It's a little bit like Clouds, minus the ability to directly manipulate what's in its signal path like the synth module. Unlike Clouds, though, the pedal costs less than $30.
Do you use your theremini as an cv source?
-- krmk
Oh, yeah...and that can get fun when I start messing with the CV once it's out of the Theremini. Using one to "control" a Wavetek function generator is simply NUTS due to the different CV standards, for example, but it can do things that you can't get to with just the knobs on that device.
Q1: do modular cables differ meaningfully in quality?
They can. But for the most part, they don't. You can get hi-tweak patchcables with all sorts of voodoo to 'em, but those are somewhat pointless; using silver Mogami cables or some such makes far more sense on LONG cable runs, and not little 1m or less lengths.
At the same time, my skepticism about audio cables still stands. The only place I use something like that are the OFC lines from the amps to the monitors, and there it's mainly due to the fact that those big 12 - 14ga lines pass amplified audio much better and don't pose a resistive load like, say, cheapo speaker 2-conductor lines from Menard's. But at the same time, I have used that low-rent speaker wire for things such as a few amateur radio antennas...and even with the 10 watt signals I put out (I like low power operation...more of a challenge), I can still hang with other stations running ten times that...or more.
The one point where they DO differ, though, is in build quality. Some cheap patchcords really do feel like they're about to fall apart in your hands, either due to using a flimsy cable stock, or janky soldering work on the plugs. That was the scary bit, but I opted to make the leap with these AliExpress ones because I didn't see anything about them that indicated that. And sure enough...really well-done molded plugs with molded-on strain reliefs at the plugs, and they use a bit thicker cable stock which is the sort that has plenty of flex to them...but which can also be easily manipulated to stay out of the way of things and stay there, kind of like what you'd get in the box with an ARP 2600 back in the day. So...
Q2: Lugia, you think these are as good or better than most modular cables?
Bet! After I had a close look, messed around with them and such, I was very pleased. Zero buyers remorse here. And like I mention above, I really like the feel on the cable stock. It's got plenty of flex...but it's not limp, as you can shove it all around and it'll largely retain the position you leave it in. And those prices are really the cherry on the cake here, tbh...the cables are pleasing enough, but the money saved on them? Daaaaaaaaaamn...
Well, they showed up yesterday...50 50cm ones, 50 100cm ones. And the verdict is....
Hot damn, what a DEAL!
Yes, they're everything I was hoping for. True, they're only in black, but unless you're hellbent on having your modular look like a unicorn sneezed all over it, black is fine, IMHO. The cables are pretty much the same sort of thing as Nazcas et al...molded 3.5mm plugs, and a nicely-flexible cable stock that's easy to deal with when there's a bunch of them and you need to get past the tangle. Definitely NOT throwaway grade! So if you need piles of patchcables, I think this might be the mother lode!
Hmm...well, Tiptop should be close to dropping the Buchla 257t at this point, and that would be a good candidate here. Also, Frequency Central's jammed the ARP 2600's signal manipulation section into a little module called the Process 26, and that'd work well, too.
Just that? It's not even implemented properly to just be a synthesizer, not to mention generative work. You're missing a LOT of what needs to be in there...and ironically, there's NO modulation and NO timing aside of Pam's...which, perversely, has pretty much nothing to do here. Given the amount of control signals and control modifiers needed to make generative work, you're already in trouble with just one 3U skiff.
Jomo's advice regarding VCV Rack is probably your best bet for figuring out the what/how/whys of generative. These tend to require either very dense functionality per module, massive amounts of modulation generation and manipulation, or both. Also, timing signals get messed with quite often, with one of the requisites being some Boolean logic to (ab)use the timing signals to make other timing signals, etc etc. The only caveat I'd give about VCV is that it can get pretty piggy about resources, so it's best to run it with as little as possible going on besides it.
One other bit of advice regarding Mutable clones...if you're going to use those instead of actual Mutable modules, examine them closely to see if you see any possible ergonomics issues. One gripe that many have with these is that the knobs get so tiny and so densely-packed that you need to turn them with a pair of tweezers, or damn close to that. But seriously, that's an important consideration...you DON'T want controls that'll see lots of manual tweaking (such as VCF cutoffs) being made hard to use. Plus, keep in mind that the patchcord rat's-nest (generative programming DEFINITELY causes those) will also be obscuring those controls as well.
My new (not very large, only 4 x 104 hp) custom powered case was built by Uryan Modular, a small business that happens to be operating in my country. The prices are pretty friendly, the build quality is great. They use Meanwell PSUs with plenty of reserve power. One example for a larger case (17U/168 hp, 160 module slots, 4 x 2800 mA +12v, 4 x 500 mA -12v):
-- aphew_goodman
Damn, that's a big honker! That price is right, though...840 in 3U and 336 in tiles for EUR 1100, with some clearly BEEFED-UP power, is a helluva deal!
Just got the TD3-MO and want to incorporate it in my eurrack modular set up.
Is it safe to use the 3 5mm headphones socket of the TD3-MO to go straight into a vca ?.
-- Slammer22
In theory, yes. But you'll need to sum that stereo headphone signal down to mono, and if the level's too low, then it won't work without some sort of preamp module like a Doepfer A-119.
But if you want a better trick to do with the headphone jack, try a feedback line from there to the VCF in on the B-0-3. You will need to run that through an attenuator to keep things from going into runaway, but that OLD trick (as in REALLY old...the first synth that had people doing this was the Minimoog) really beefs up the nastiness and adds various weird resonances. Better still, put something like a delay line stompbox in the feedback loop and add THAT to the VCF path. Or a flanger, or phaser, or or or...
Wow Lugia, thank you!
I'm looking up some of the modules suggested; So many mults! Trying to wrap my head around patching... Is swapping one of the the 4x4 mults for another ASK a reasonable consideration?
As for the case, would an alm / brute case do?
-- krmk
You could do that swap, but you'll have to resort to some inline mults to get certain routings to work. As for the 'Brute case, yeah, that should work even better since they're wood...helps avoid signal leakage between the aerials and therefore playing issues that might pop up due to them. Also, you can then add the ASK and keep the mult, since these run 88 (or 89, depending on who you ask) hp.
No, it would be a single voice...you've got one aerial for pitch (closer = higher) and the other for level (closer = quieter, with touching this aerial acting as a "mute"). Or at least, that's how it SHOULD be. I worked for years with a Maestro unit (one of Tom Oberheim's designs...NOT Bob Moog, since that unit came out in the pre-Norlin period) that had an amplitude implementation which worked "backwards": get closer, it gets LOUDER, and "muting" wasn't possible at all. Finally sold it for a pile of money, got a Moog Theremini instead which offers more connectivity, a far better sound module, etc.
My concern here is that the case might not be wide enough. Those aerials need some distance so that you're not accidentally changing pitch when you need volume changes, and vice-versa. A 1 x 84 would probably work better here...sort of like...wait for it...
OK, there we GO...width is now 84 hp, which keeps the aerials further apart AND which allows for some trickery.
You'll notice that this seems to violate one of my own rules, namely that mults don't belong in small builds. However, given that this ISN'T a "proper" synth and that this really NEEDS them to distribute various signals in parallel, there's three (technically, four) of them to help with that. Two are at the obvious places, to distribute the various aerial signals. The others make sense when you look at the signal flow...
SO, after the amplitude (left) aerial and its mults, you've got a pair of ADSR envelopes which get gated via the left aerial. Then there's one of Noise Reap's weird dual LFOs which has some capabilities for scrambling its OWN operation for weird, non-symmetrical modulation curve outputs. After that is a Bragi ASK, which provides two attenuverters with 3-way multed outs for altering modulation signals and distributing them to various destinations.
For the oscillator, I opted for a Twin Waves mkii, which gives you two oscillators, several useful internal routings, and a quantizer which allows you to play discrete steps in addition to the typical theremin glissandi. Another mult after that lets you distribute the oscillator outs to the various audio processing modules that are placed just after it. Mind you, you don't HAVE to use the mult there; it's just as valid to patch those in a post-VCA configuration...especially given the VCAs in question. I went with one of Plankton's dual VCAs that use a NuTube triode which you can slam the crap out of for some distortion/waveshaping.
And since we're definitely now in stereo, the VCF I chose was Bastl's Ikarie, a very odd and somewhat nasty stereo filter that can behave...or get really gritty, plus it has a dual-peak architecture so that you can have some similarly-tracking but different-sounding filter responses in its two channels. Then, effects...theremins are awesome with some processing, so I opted for Happy Nerding's excellent FX Aid XL for a useful effects "library". Then past that, I put in a HN 4x Stereo Mix...this lets you deal with the stereo outs of the VCO, VCA, VCF, FX Aid...however you want to deal with them in parallel so that you can have sound events that involve the sound "evolving" between those modules via some judicious patching of the various modulation bits. Lastly, the HN Isolator is a MUST here, since you're dealing with RF circuits and you don't want crud getting into those and destabilizing them...which is an inherent issue with theremins, and why many of the cheap ones sound like total ass. Then mult, pitch aerial, and there you go!
As for aerial placement, that'll vary a lot depending on how you feel comfortable with interfacing with the aerials. In theory, you can keep the amplitude aerial partly un-telescoped and aimed sideways so that you've got something with some similar ergonomics to the RCA and Moog designs. Pitch aerial definitely goes straight-up and at full extension, though. And remember to keep this away from metal surfaces which will couple with the RF controllers and cause various control annoyances.
humbly request an option to hide the clean up the mess cat or at least fix the CSS so it doesn't make the rack jump down in the viewport when the cat appears. a lot of us use that space as a staging area.
-- scragz
True dat...but I find the function that reorders "staged" modules into a single stack to be more annoying. There are reasons why I scatter 'em in various places while working out a build, especially reworking someone else's design.
As for ModularCat...you'd just better hope it didn't hear you complaining about it. You might log in one day to find clawmarks all over your module collection!
Solution simple: Case From Lake. Not only do they do custom builds, you can have them add custom features to their "standard" fare. Power supplies on those are always overspecced, they're super-solid, and you might even wind up working with them to come up with a fully portable solution...yes, even for THAT MANY modules! https://www.casefromlake.com/
Another source for gawdawfully-huge studio cabs is ADDAC...they've long offered cabs that offer 197 hp (ie: 1 meter) rows, plus they share CFL's philosophy about having enough current capacity...and then some. You can even get some 2U 19" rack toppers for those, and there's 2 x 168 of tile rows right there just by adding some tile frames and power connections.
Then for the ultimate in Eurorack case overkill, there's https://eurorackmodularcase.com/. Just click it...no explanation needed there!
A fine, FINE example of specious reasoning. WMD closes shop, people make assumptions.
Let's explain something, shall we? First up, module manufacturers closing up shop is nothing new. We consistently lose several a year, and yes, some of them are big names. And while some of those have more annoying reasons (like Emilie finally getting quitting-grade discouraged after Herr Behringer lifted Plaits and Veils from Mutable's lineup), much of this is simply what you'd expect to find in an overheated field with lots of "churn". There's nothing odd about that...typical capitalism at work.
And yes, the current supply-chain fubar over electronic components is hitting everything, not merely synthesizers. That's the "changing forever" that's far more scary, with acres of cars waiting for chips sitting around idle worldwide being one obvious symptom. And yes, that shortage makes it difficult for synth companies...but it works the same way for any company that uses electronic components.
But when you get down to it, the components needed in a big percentage of modules aren't anything too esoteric. By and large, there's typically a larger amount of passive components (caps, resistors, diodes, etc) than anything VLSI-ish...aside of certain modules that are dependent on Atmel/Atmega, RasPi, etc devices for their engines. Since these passive components don't require any hi-tweak manufacturing methods (like UV litho), they're far less "endangered", and those components have made up the majority of what's on a module board since...well, Bob and Don.
And another big source for Eurorack devices is the used market, which apparently wasn't figured into the idea. There's a lot of used Eurorack out there, with a big chunk of that these days from erstwhile synthesists thinking they're ready to step up to modular...followed by a litany of bad choices and sales pitches...which results in plenty of viable modules popping up on eBay, Reverb, et al when these users discover that they got tossed into an infinite gulf of confusion (which this is IF you're not capable of doing some basic research) and not the wading pool. Frankly, I think overheated "analysis" like the above clip does more to HARM Eurorack, inasmuch as it attempts to spread a poorly-reasoned but seemingly-authoritative rationale for some impending implosion of Eurorack, etc. People that are incapable of looking into things themselves have long been self-generated problems in modular, and I (and others) have a bone to pick with "influencers" that use YT as a bully pulpit for nonsense such as that.
This is worse on some levels, though. Instead of being able to explain simple technical issues (such as why you're going to have trouble building a full system in 1 x 84), this hits more on some ontological level which takes advantage of potential users hearing this and then giving Eurorack a wide berth due to the general state of imposed panic these days. Boo. Hiss. NOT GOOD.
There's a big difference between causation and correlation...and there's more of the latter in the YT clip than the former. While I agree that losing WMD and especially Mutable is not a good thing at all, the only "changing forever" that's going on here is the usual constant change that's part of reality in general. And ultimately, that's not an actual change at all.
Not pictured is the dual buffered mult above the 1U row on the Intellijel 62HP 4U Palette case.
-- graycat
Easily fixed. Just add another tile row and check under Intellijel's listings for the Palette 62 utility bar. Just remember to pull up the "screenshot" and refresh that, otherwise we'll still all see this layout.
The more obvious problem has to do with the Intellijel stereo mixer tile. That's usable in that position...but it can also connect directly to the cab's 1/4" jacks, which then lets you fly a second signal (such as effects) over the main mix to parallel it into the final stereo output. If there's no earth-shaking need for the connecting modules at the left end of the tile bar, I'd suggest tossing those and then adding Intellijel's stereo VCA tile to have CV over one or the other signals to mix. And adding a DuATT would also be a VERY good idea, as you don't have any way to add offsets, mix CVs and modulation signals (the stereo mixer is AC-coupled...won't pass anything below audible range!), or do inversion/polarization of your modulation.
Hmmmmm...
...sort of like that. Also, I ejected the speaker...yeah, I know it sounded cool and all, but by tossing it and the Ochd, I was able to put the NANO Quart in instead. That module has four AD envelope generators which can be looped to serve as variable-waveform LFOs where needed. And that was 100% needed...otherwise, all you had was the Ochd as a modulation source, with NO envelope generation. It even rocks the same look as the Qu-bit black panels!
With ornament and crimes on sequencing duty is there enough audio oscillation?
-- emergencypeanut
I think you might have some bigger problems than enough oscillators. For one thing, you DO realize there's only 104 hp for those honkin' big modules in the 3U row, right? By having those there like that, you're causing them to monopolize the build, and the end result is that you've got some really cool modules...but very little in the way of getting them to work together as an instrument. Part of the problem, of course, is the cab itself; while it's possible to cram a decent build into a Palette 104, this majorly involves reducing the module sizes so that everything that should be there CAN be there. Instead, three of those modules take over half of the 3U row, which is forcing you to jam things in as afterthoughts, where space allows. This isn't a good thing, especially given that the Panharmonium is sort of the only nonreplaceable that's there. And I say "sort of" because there's likely ways to do what it does with certain combinations of modules. Although in this case, you don't really have any audio sources to feed it (hence the stereo inputs as well as Dave noting that the module is a "mutating spectral resynthesizer"...and resynthesis tends to need some sort of incoming audio to...well, resynthesize.
Deckerd's? Mmm...OK, having a CS-80 laying around the house gives me a bit of an insight there. Basically, you've got the basic voicing of a single CS-80 card there...but that's not the only aspect to that sound. Adding the Rachael "expander" would do a lot to remedy this, but then you're talking about 46 hp in cab space and a tab of $1048 for a monosynth that still won't approach the "playability" of the OG. TBH, given the prices I'm seeing on vintage Yamaha's CS-01 as of late, you could get TWO of the little Yammys for that and still have beer money left over. Things are changing, to be sure...
It would honestly be a better choice to get a patchable synth and then use that with the modular, then use the space gained from removing the Deckerd's for more modules. In fact, one combo I'm liking is a pairing with my other modular/patchable devices with one of Uli's 2600 "Xmas tree" clones. It's...well, it's an ARP 2600, a synth I've used off and on for some 40+ years now, made more compact (without becoming difficult to play!) and including the 3620 circuits, which Korg left off of their 2600M. Ergo, I look at Korg's available-to-everyone version as literal "crippleware", and the snarky SOB in Penang gets the win for creating the real Version 5. Plus, unlike the Deckard's, it's 100% complete...you can even cram it into an 8U road case (plus, you can even find 3rd party cases out there that emulate the original's form factor). And the fact that you can "break out" the modules via the patchpoints for full-on modular integration is the cherry on the cake.
And Jim's 100% on about that larger case. It's possible to do a build in 104 hp, sure...but 2 x 104 hp means more room for utilities and other "helpers" that make the spendy ones do what they oughta.
Given the amount of sheer unadulterated BASS that you can get out of a modular without even trying hard, I would suggest that you go with monitors that have at the very least 8" drivers for the low end. I use a pair of SF-era KRKs, myself...9000Bs...as "critical nearfields" with a Crest FA601 amp. However, be careful that what you get is actually rather flat; one monitor that I've learned to DREAD are the horrid Yamaha NS10Ms and the various descendants of those...they make everything sound like refried ass when you check your mix on more typical monitors. Some people swear by them; much of my time with them over the years found me swearing AT them. Just. Say. No.
Try and find something that's more "point source-ish", actually. Uli's reissued some of the Tannoy single-point ones for decent prices, but my money would be on the more-spendy powered Presonus Scepter 8s. But get the best thing you can afford...monitoring is 100% NOT the part you skimp on, as that subsystem of your studio is how you know what you're doing!
I wouldn't suggest that you sell off the current 1 x 84 skiff. You WILL want it for adding more modules later on. If you doubt this, contact me in a year's time and tell me about what you repurposed it for.
But instead of trying to build an entire synth in a 1 x 84 skiff (always a bad idea...you WILL wind up compromising subsystems in this build if you do!), I would suggest that you check out a Tiptop Mantis. We say that loads on here...and it's not JUST because of the 208 hp of space you get, but because the Mantis is a sensible size, has really good power specs, is lightweight and portable enough that Tiptop sells a custom gig bag for it, AND you can stack a second one with its special stacking brackets to double your space.
As for the skiff...one really good idea might be to repurpose it as a controller/sequencer cab. You could put a Tempi/Rene mkii pair in there for sequencing and touchplate control, then maybe jam your performance mixing in the other half-ish, maybe with space to add a couple of CV faders for "remote" control of other modules. That would get two types of potentially chunky modules OUT of the Mantis...which, in the end, gets you still MORE space in that new cab. People don't seem to think a lot about the case implementations, and in the end that should actually be one of the FIRST considerations because that's one that depends on both you AND your available studio space. And you'll also hear it said that you should always make your case(s) too large...because, eventually they won't be!
Given that it's usually a PITA to cram a full-on synth into a tiny cab, and also since you've got two "noisemakers" already, you might consider doing the more sensible task of making this into something designed as a "helper" for the two Moogs. Otherwise, no, it doesn't make sense. So... [wait for it]
OK...no audio sources, first off. This is all about playing around with modulation (to a degree that neither Moog is designed for) and some sequencer timing tricks to beef up the DFAM. You'll note right off that I used a different case here, an Intellijel Palette 62. Most times, tile rows are just basic utilities; in this case, there's a Steppy there, along with a MIDI interface which uses the case's USB MIDI. It's also got a DuATT for extra mixing/inversion/offsets and a ring modulator for either audio or modulation alterations.
The row here starts with a Doepfer A-118-2 for noise, random voltages and sample and hold. Then there's an Ornament and Crime multimodule for various modulation tasks along with a bunch of other stuff. Another Doepfer module next, a quad "free-run" LFO.
Now, you'd expect to find a Maths here. But in 62 hp, that'd have about 1/3rd of the 3U row taken up with one module. Instead, I dropped in Toppobrillo's (relatively) new redux of their Sport Modulator, which is sort of like a little more than half of a Maths. Now, that would imply that this won't be as capable as Maths...but that would be true only if you didn't have the next modules. Instead, you'll find an Antumbra dual VCA (based on the Veils VCA) and a Frap 321, and those two together can do A LOT to generate even more modulation signals from the sources in the cab. Then, Paratek's dual Peaks clone gives you two envelope generators, and a Disting mkiv sits between the clocking and modulation because...well, try it on both!
The ANA gives you comparator functions, along with some logic and arithmetical operations on CVs. Then the NE Fractio Solum is a CVable clock divide/multiplier, positioned conveniently so that it can take the clock off of the MIDI interface. And last but not least, a sequential switch which will allow you to use the DFAM's sequencer in a 1 x 16 configuration.
This sort of thing is what these little cases excel at. In this case, the "mission" that the build is "specific" to involves bridging the two Moogs with some additional trickery, as well as massively upping the modulation capabilities...among other things! For example, just look at what the O_&c and Disting are capable of, and it'll be very clear as to why they're there. In short, it "integrates" the Moogs, letting them do MUCH more together with this build than if you either had the Moogs alone, or if you'd tried to build a synth voice with a little cab.
A few others come to mind here...there's ALM's Boss Bow Two, Klavis has the Mixwitch, Mystic Circuits' Tree, and Alyseum has their SELECTOR...which can be expanded to an utterly bonkers 64 I/Os.
One thing I'd note... as a Moskwa II owner, I can't imagine it without also adding the Ostankino expander... it adds so much functionality and fun. I'd suggest making room for that, if at all possible.
-- Shakespeare
Oddly enough, that came to mind when I was working out my variation, but I noted that the problem with adding that to the Moskwa II was that the Moskwa II was taking up the necessary space for its own "helper" module. Hate it when that happens...
There is a hidden advantage to the Klavis modules, though: size. It's as narrow as I would feel comfortable with using, but you get a dual VCO with quantizing in a mere 8 hp. You get a waveshaper in there, it can do additive, has internal ring modulation, a number of random operations (noise, variable LFO weirdness that includes Brownian movement models, etc). So, yeah...both the Plaits and the Twin Waves mkii are fairly complex, albeit with different architecture behind the panel.
I've certainly used them as processing devices. One installation work I put on back in 2000 used my Digisound 80 to the max...nonrepeating cyclical patterns of VCF sweeps, mixing various modulation CVs to create weird composite waveforms to filter processed shortwave audio.
If this is going on a pedalboard, then I would DEFINITELY remove the DFAM. Those little controls stand a rather high possibility of getting broken down there. Plus, it's also a good idea to go larger, as well as adding the necessary support modules for this...
[pause for screwing around with build]
OK...I figured that if you can mash a Make Noise 104 skiff on there, it would be just about as easy to fit an Intellijel Palette 104. And that one change REALLY changes things up...
The tile row on this is largely taken up with pedal interface modules. You've got a stereo input, then two Ritual Electronics Pointeuses with their 1/4" input jacks. These can output triggers with a momentary ON pedal, allowing you to fire triggers at the LFOs or EGs at will. Next to those is the first of several Flexibilite expression pedal inputs, this one being paired with an attenuator for restricting the range for more precise control. It, and the four others after the attenuator, are the "meat" here...in total, you've got four strictly for controlling VCA output pairs so that you can mix the effects manually without having to mess with the controls while playing. And the stereo out after those, natch.
On the 3u row, things get interesting. First up is an envelope follower so that you can extract gate, trigger, and amplitude CV from incoming audio and route those most anywhere. I then added a Zadar/Nin so that you've got four envelopes...all of which will fire on receiving a trigger pulse. That feature works together with the Pointeuses so that you can fire envelopes at will, while keeping two other EGs in reserve for any other use. The MISO then lets you take modulation signals and mess with them...inversion, offsets, mixing, etc. I then slapped the Disting back into that zone, and followed it with a pair of Antumbra dual VCAs...these use the Veils topology which gives you an adjustable response range from linear to exponential, and there's several others in here, as you can see. Last of the modulation section is a Batumi/Poti set...and yes, the Pointeuses can work here, too, to reset LFO sync.
Then the fun begins. The very first Antumbra pair there is for your dry signal, then you've got a Beads for reverb or other granular weirdnesses. This one module is why I put in that extra Flexibilite expression pedal interface...loads of main controls there that can benefit from that. Then another dual VCA, followed by Alright's Chronoblob2, which is a stereo delay line with one weird trick: an insert point in the regen path. So, if you wanted, you could send/return another effect through that to alter the delay's behavior. Another Antumbra dual VCA, then Xaoc's new frequency shifter...that's super-optimal for phasing, flanging, tremolo, and to just mangle the crap out of signals. And again, dual VCA...and next to that is the mixer, which has four stereo inputs.
So how this works is as follows: your guitar signal comes in via the 1/4" jacks on the utility row (splitting a mono signal is a good idea here, if you need to), then the L goes to one mult in the ute row, and R goes to another. From these, you can split out your signal sends to the individual DSP modules. Then by using the four main Flexibilite pedals, you can MIX the different DSPs by foot by using the expression pedals as "faders" that control the dual VCAs. Then the signal passes through those VCAs and on to the quad stereo mixer at the end, where you've set your "overall" levels...so you'd have a stereo pair for "dry", one for the Beads, one for the Chronoblob2, and one more for the frequency shifter.
Now, if you need anything such as a fuzz, OD, and so forth, I'd recommend that those be actual stompboxes so that you can opt to place them UPstream from the Palette rig here, then you can attenuate that signal back down at the stereo input. This should also play nicely with any devices you want to put DOWNstream from this rig. Or better still, have a look at THIS: https://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/TriParMix--electro-harmonix-tri-parallel-mixer I've got one of those...and it's pretty damn mind-blowing! The ability to parallel effects is...well, sorta different. And with that PLUS this build, you can have two other processors on that parallel bus AND still work the Palette via its expression controllers for what'll be a very complex pedalboard setup once completed.
Right now im using delta v as a vca but need for sure a dedicated vca. What other utilitys would you suggest?
-- Don_Simo
Well, it needs to be ones with that "Veils topology"...that variable response curve has piles of abuse potential. My suggestion, since Emilie is leaving the building, would be to grab a good Veils clone (I kinda like the Codex Modulex version). That way, you get four VCAs plus that "breakable mixbus" that lets you break out VCAs when needed. Going to rework this, give me a hot minute...
OK...what happened here...? Well, for one thing I've reordered the build so that the division between rows is a LOT easier to deal with. Some modules were also swapped out for smaller versions of the same thing. And then there were some "fixes"...
TOP: The Miso Cornflakes replaces the Qu-bit sampler/looper. Same idea, smaller space. Kept the Cloud Terrarium...it's a good choice, despite being quite huge. Then you see the Codex Modulex Veils clone...and here's how to split it: send your "lefts" to VCAs 1 and 2, "rights" to 3 and 4, then take the summed results from outputs 2 and 4. Voila!...stereo. Next, I swapped the Beograd out for a similar (but more bonkers) Bastl filter, their Ikarie stereo multimode...but if you look it up, there's a LOT more going on behind the panel than you had with the Xaoc one. I put in a pair of VCAs after that with the intent there being to control amplitudes going on to the Beads from the Ikarie. You can use that dual VCA for input level control over the Beads in general as well. Then Beads...followed by Frequency Central's Stasis Leak, which is a mono-in/stereo-out reverb/tap tempo delay/chorus. I went with that because it fits perfectly with the TEXMIX send/return architecture. The FX Aid XL can also take a mono signal in the left input and stereoize that, so it works with the TEXMIX as well as being a true stereo thruput if needed.
BOTTOM: Pam's, Moskva, then I added a Batumi/Poti combo for your LFOs, a Frap 321 and After Later dual "Veils" VCA, and a Zadar/Nin for envelopes. The modules in between (the 321 and dual VCA) are for modifying/altering/mangling your modulation signals, with the result being even wilder modulation signals for use all over the build. And last is the TEXMIX, but I changed out the stereo input with a mono one, since you've got a build here that's got two potential main stereo ins. Because of that, you can just pan the inputs hard left and hard right, and now you've actually got VCA control over levels from two stereo sources. Perfect!
So, yeah...some squishing was necessary, but now the result is a MUCH more potent build since you've now got the VCAs and modulation that can get this build to really cut loose. You actually get to use the TEXMIX's send/return capabilities as well, since the right sort of FX are present. And in the end, I think this came out pretty solid. Oh...and as for the Cornflakes input, you can conceivably use your headphone preamp on the TEXMIX to feed stereo back to it for live sampling. Just make sure you've crammed a big enough microSD in it!
LOOK NO FURTHER! https://www.aliexpress.com/item/2255800164534876.html
Ran across this while looking for some good deals on 3.5 to 3.5mm cables. No, they're not in candy-colors and such, just black. But DAAAAAMN are they cheap! Around $65 got me a bundle of 50 cm and a bundle of 100 cm cables, shipping included.
And if your modular is big enough to serve as an efficiency apartment, they even sell 'em in lots of 1000!
Remove the DFAM. It's got a case, and it's got power already...so it doesn't need to be in the Eurorack case taking up room and crowding out modules that DON'T have a case or power. Already, you can see here that you've been forced into using some tiny (and therefore difficult to work with under many circumstances) modules that probably shouldn't be tiny. And then there's the CV issue...Moog's 60-hp-ers use a bipolar CV (both above and below 0v values are valid) where Eurorack uses CVs that run from 0v and upward. Erica has a fix for this with their MScale PICO module, but you don't have room for one, so...
In truth, I wouldn't go with a single row skiff here at all. They're sort of a "trap", because while it IS possible to build a rig in a single-row skiff, compromises have to be made and it takes some experience to know how to do that without screwing yourself over. Instead, get (and yes, I know you hear this constantly on here) a Tiptop Mantis which gives you 2 x 104 hp, has good power and ergonomics, and which costs (in the USA) less than $350. It's perhaps the best starter case out there. You can even expand it via joining brackets and add a second Mantis later on (or a third or fourth IF you have some external support for the top cabs).
As for the MPC...if there's a limitation to which channels can address the analog I/O but you can still assign things to MIDI outputs, it might make more sense to look into Expert Sleepers' interfaces, particularly the ones that incorporate a class-compliant MIDI port. These can be expanded as needed by dropping in more 4 hp width expansion modules, so you can literally dictate how many CV/gate/trig/clock/etc outs and ins (yep...you can transmit CV data back to your DAW with one of those!) you need.
And an example of why you need more space fits right in with your industrial noise stuff...go and have a look at the offerings from Moffenzeef and Schlappi Engineering that, at present, you can't fit into the build. Seriously...go bigger.
A 'slide' mode would be great. If I'm swapping out a 2hp module for a 3hp module, having to manually move every module down 1hp is really fiddly.
-- stogoshuffle
It can be if you're manually dragging the modules. But the other mode is quick and works like you'd want here. Hover the cursor over a module, then hit either "," or "." to move it left or right respectively. Even if you have a pile of little stuff in a row, this can be dealt with in seconds by using those shortcuts.
what, where did that Data Bender come from. It isn't permanent right, or?
-- cpaf
It'd better not be permanent, because right now you're missing pretty much ALL necessary utility modules, and some critical modules (such as a proper complement of VCAs) are nowhere to be seen.
If you've not gotten the A-100 cab already...don't. Tiptop's Mantis cases are bigger, have about the same power specs, and cost way less than Doepfer's cabs. The Doepfer stuff is great if you need depth, or if you're planning to take your rig on the road, but if the build is intended mainly for studio use or only occasional live work, it's just about perfect.
And yes, you can expand the Mantis via a link bracket to have two of them stacked. Plus, going to 2 x 104 gives you 40 more hp to put some of those modules I mentioned above into this so it'll work like a synthesizer and not like an expensive box of noisemakers.
As a general convention in Eurorack, clock pulses are +5v, but not vpp as clocks (and gates and triggers) are only positive-going from 0v. There are negative-going trigger/gates out there, but they're unusual, such as Behringer's use of the VERY EFFING ANNOYING Moog S-Trig standard in some of their Moog-alikes, or the various modules that invert the clock for synths that use that, such as the Korg MS-20. That adherence to the +5v standard is what allows you to run that module, clock an internal sequencer by some other manufacturer, send gates through Boolean logic, etc and have the whole mess work together...it's been that way since Dieter Doepfer came up with Ye Olde Eurorack Standard about 25-ish years ago.
The reason for moving the Strega is because it has its own cab and power, and the Eurorack cab is for things (as a rule) that DON'T have those. So here, you're taking up a healthy chunk of hp for that, which now blocks adding modules.
The better solution would be to remove the Strega, then fill the space left with modules that can expand BOTH the Eurorack cab and the Strega, since there's no bar against patches that go "outside" of the case.
Plus, check what's NOT in the case due to the Strega. For example, modulars need VCAs...but all you've got of those here are the ones in the Strega. Not good. So take 8-12 hp for some proper VCAs right off the bat. No attenuverters, only one (DC-coupled) mixer with a mono output while there's piles of stereo path modules, and so on. Part of that can also be fixed by looking at SMALLER modules with the same functionality. For example, the Starlab. It takes up 28 hp, costs $650. So, instead of that, you could go with a Rings clone and a basic stereo reverb such as Purrtronix's spring reverb clone. For the Rings clone, my suggestion would be Oscillosaurus's version. Those two together fit in 22 hp (you get 6 back) and cost $304-ish. That's less than HALF of the Starlab's cost, and it replicates much of the primary functions that the Starlab has. The rest of the stuff, such as LFOs, etc, are already supposed to be in the build already for other functions...which, again, you're crowded out of having in here. And yes, I AM counting the Maths that's there, because using it just as an LFO is like buying a vintage Lamborghini Countach and just driving it to the grocery store.
...and so on. Fact is, there's NO ONE on here that can precisely nail a build on the very first try. The process of building one of these instruments requires a pile of thought and constant reconsiderations to arrive at a system that both fulfills your needs AND which has the necessary module complement to be an instrument that you'll use and grow with over years, instead of a noisemaker that'll wind up in a closet several months down the road. Plus, you also find ways to make it cheaper, like the above strategy. And even though I've done loads of builds on here for others that I can knock out pretty quickly, I'm doing that with 40+ years in electronic music to inform me as to how they should be built out. I might SEEM fast at that, but if you factor in that backlog of experience, you eventually realize that you have to factor the experience into the time outlay. Others on here also have similar background experience, and can do much the same thing...but it's due to their long backgrounds making things easier.
Gonna work out a build on this, in fact...I'll put the Strega in a blanked-up row at the bottom so you can see how it fits...
EDIT: OK, here we are. Thanks to Make Noise, we have this nifty "utility bar" in the middle of the case that'll come in handy.
UPPER: First thing there is a KonstantLabs PWRchekr, which lets you keep an eye on your DC rail health. Then instead of the XPOs, I opted for something even more over the top and put in a pair of Neutron Sound Dust of Time dual digital oscillators. Each one of those contains TWO oscillators for a total of four; in theory, you could actually use the build as a 4-voice paraphonic synth. The DoTs also have MIDI inputs, plus a pile of other surprises. And they can also receive updates as well as third-party oscillator models. Left the Moddemix by these in case you want to ring-mod the oscillators together. Then the first Codex Modulex quad VCA (a Veils clone) lets you maintain the stereo balance; just run the LEFT outputs to VCAs 1 and 2, then take output 2, and the RIGHT outs go to 3 and 4, with their output being on out 4. Feed outs 2 and 4 to the QPAS...but now, they're under VCA control.
QPAS, of course, is still in here...but with another Codex Modulex quad VCA after it. This is where things get even wackier, because you can now use TWO output pairs from the QPAS, with VCA control over both pairs. This set of VCAs can feed directly to the mixer in the lower row, but what I would suggest is to use that utility row and two of those mult busses to split the 2 and 4 outs from this VCA set and then feed them to the mixer AND the Beads in parallel. We'll see how those are dealt with in a sec. But anyway, the Beads (instead of just a stereo reverb) allows loads of granular screwing-around in addition to being a mere reverb. Now things get weird...
From the Beads, you can send its outputs on to the After Later VCA (or you can split its inputs off of that with mult busses 3 and 4) or it can go directly to the Doepfer mixer OR to the Happy Nerding 4x Stereo Mix. With that, you can run your mult busses as "aux"-like sends, and even split the last quad VCA out to feed the Beads and the VCAs simultaneously. Those VCAs, btw, give you level control over whatever is after them, and for the Rangoon's summing from stereo to its mono input. Or, or, or...suffice to say, I left that pretty open-ended so that you can adapt the mixbus and its send/returns however you like. And like I said, Rangoon is last, and it provides the physically-modeled resonator that's the Rings clone...with an extra trick or two.
LOWER: Your Tempi/Rene mkii stays where it is, and it's a great choice for both control AND sequencing. Then Ochd, Maths...and new stuff, in this case a Frap 321 and another After Later VCA pair. This is what I sometimes refer to (in its various forms) as your "modulation core"...it lets you modify your modulation signals in a pile of ways. After that, there's a Zadar + Nin for all of the envelope generation.
And then, the mixers. Plural. And this is so that, if desired, you can PARALLEL your effects processors via the 4x Stereo Mix by sending the Beads and the Rangoon's outputs to two stereo pairs, then take your synth feeds through the Doepfer mixer for panning and level adjustment. The Doepfer would then get sent on to the third or fourth 4x input pairs, and you can directly control the balance between FX and synth via that little thing. As for the Doepfer, it's got four mono ins with panning, so in theory you could go directly off of the second quad VCA's individual outs for both level control AND discrete mixing. Of course, I left lots of that rather open-ended so that you can easily vary the mixer/FX routing and balancing via a few different methods, not merely one fixed method. Last, the Strega is down below so you can get an idea of how it would fit into this; it's not actually in the build per se.
i have korg volca modular and wanto make pharao music like superb artist in video
what modules i need to make this music style?
-- esmeralda
More. That's what's needed.
Simply because you've got a modular (or rather, patchable; the Volca Modular isn't a true modular synth) synth doesn't mean that you've got the Golden Ticket to being a one-man backup band for the likes of Umm Kulthoum. Instead of looking at what this one artist uses to get at that sound, look instead at what the actual practitioners are using. For one thing, you'll find a lot of "home keyboard" like things that have this little extra keyboard (like this: https://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/Pa700OR--korg-pa700-oriental-61-key-arranger-workstation ...look below the left speaker) for doing all of the different scalar tunings that you find in the various Arabic stylings. And there's a BUNCH of those!
So, one problem right off is going to be some method to get at those microtonal bits. In a real modular, this is pretty easy, as there's quantizers out there that can do microtonality...some even take Scala files. But otherwise...not so much, as the majority of instruments in the West are designed for plain ol' dodecaphonic equal temperament, which is one thing I find rather annoying at times because I like Pythagorean-type "pure" tunings in my ambient work, but a perfect 5th isn't a pure 5th, so I have to resort to expression controllers, odd quantizer settings, etc to get at that reliably.
Then there's the instrumentation itself, which is pretty different from what we find in Western instruments. You're going to want to be able to get at simulacra of those with your electronics, so knowing what things like an 'Ud, Santur, Setar, Bendir, and so on sound like is also important here. And if that sounds like some beefy ethnomusicology shit...well, it is. Even to aim for that sound palette requires that you've got a handle on them, sound-wise.
So, yeah...I get it, but I also get what's necessary for that sound. Perhaps trying something like VCV Rack might make sense here, as I know for a fact that it's got microtonality-capable quantizers.
No proper VCAs is a big no-no. Also, relying on JUST a Maths for all of your modulation duties is possibly asking too much of that one module alone.
A lot of this is happening because of the cab size. It's just too small. I know everyone wants to whip one of these things up, especially since you've got certain YouTube influencers showing these off as viable options for beginners. But they're not, because it takes way more experience and/or smarts to sort out how to cram ALL of the necessary modules into a single skiff of 104 hp or less (ESPECIALLY less!). Plus, with that Tempi in there, you're going to miss out on all of the cool stuff it can do when paired with a Rene mkii sequencer/touchplate controller because...well, space.
Rule of thumb in modular is to start with a case that you are 100% SURE is too big...because, invariably, it's not. Your build above could work fine in something like a Mantis, because that gives you the space to add all of the modulation, utilities, etc etc that can make those modules really cut loose. But in a single skiff, the results show some serious "sexy module syndrome", because you've got no room due to those "showcase" modules...which can't perform at their best without the utility, etc stuff. Sure, attenuverters and adders and so on aren't "sexy"...but they ARE essential.
One other VCA point: both Antumbra and After Later that I know of offer something of a "half-Veils"...two variable-topology VCAs in 4 hp with a summing buss that allows you to output them separately or together as a 2-into-1 mix. These can be VERY useful, especially for dropping into little spaces in your modulation complement so that you can futz around with modulation levels. Pair that with some small CV/mod mixer such as Frap's 321 or Tiptop's MISO, and you'll have a VERY powerful "modification core" solely for your LFOs, EGs, slope gens, etc.
Yeah, most people don't consider parallel routing for effects...but I ain't most people. Besides, I've been hooked on the parallel method ever since I got my hands on an Electro-Harmonix TriParallel mixer for stompboxes. Instead of the series result, which can easily result in lots of similarity, parallel opens up a huge pile of possible configurations which don't have a tendency to sound the same. I liked it so much, I built a more complex version for my studio by using a Studio Technologies Model 80 buffered distro amp for splitting and sending, and then a Rane SM26B for the return mixing. So, eight pairs (plus an unbuffered "thru") out, six pairs (seven if I use the stereo bus expander input) in. Utterly effing unbelievable...hell, you could use JUST THAT plus one single stereo audio source to cook up an entire piece all by itself!
As for the envelope followers, here's what's going on with those...
These take an audio input and then derive a gate and trigger from an internal comparator. When the level exceeds your setting, it'll fire a trigger and a gate, and all the while, the actual follower will extract the dynamic info from the signal and put that out as a CV that changes with your input's amplitude. Say, for example, you want the Lubadh to speed up as your external signal gets louder. This is the thing (or things) that does that. Want it to do the opposite direction? Easy...run the envelope outs into two QuadrATT attenuverters, and invert the envelope info. Easy-peasy! These can be a bit touchy when first dealing with them, but once you get a little practice with them, there'll be zero issues, and having that dynamically-related CV signal is something you'll seriously dig.
Well, if you DO step up to something like a Palette 104, you'll have some room for modulation modules. Plus, the gate outs from the envelope followers can then work to control envelope generators, and you'd get something of an auto-wah capability with the Twist. I'll cobble up a quickie to show how that could work...like, say, this:
OK, in this version, I've added a modulation section and made use of the tile row. This one also allows a stereo thruput directly to the mixer.
TILES: QuadrATT first for mixing/inverting/offset generation, then there's a 2-channel sample and hold which you can trigger from the envelope followers. A blank next, to show the separation between modulation and audio...very useful for live use. Then we have the stereo input, and a pair of buffered mults...although these can do 1 to 6 splitting, which gives you a direct "thru" as noted, but which also feeds effect #5, which is a basic stereo delay/reverb/chorus device. And last, the stereo outs. This version utilizes the onboard 1/4" jacks, so any mic preamps needed will have to be external...not a bad thing, really.
ROW: In this version, we start with a 4ms QPLFO...a quad LFO that can run from audio rates all the way down to periods of as long as 70 minutes or so. VERY useful for slowly-evolving effects. Next is an Intellijel Quadrax/Qx pair for four envelope generators, plus the Qx's interesting EOF/EOR trigger capabilities. You can fire the Quadrax from the envelope followers' gate outputs, plus you can use the followers' triggers to "ping" timings for the QPLFO. Note also that you can now mix the extracted amplitude signals via the QuadrATT for a L-R "composite" if you like. The blank panel does the same as in the tile row, and everything's the same as the 84 hp version until you get down to the end, where there's an 8-in stereo mixer from EMW (I suggest ordering direct with them, btw) that's considerably easier to use than the Happy Nerding one.
And yes, I know that the Palette 104 has its own mults and adders. But you'll want those for control routing and combination, whereas the After Laters in the tile row are solely for audio splitting for the five audio processors and your dedicated dry pair. So, the "core" is the same as the 84 hp version, while this gives you numerous modulation options that weren't possible in that smaller cab.
Normally, I wouldn't suggest doing a build in 84 hp like this, but that would be for full-on systems. This fits better in the "mission specific" build category, though. Let's see here...
(time passes, then...)
OK...this is a fairly radical reworking of your original. Note that I didn't go with the mic pres on either end; you don't build these systems for looks, but functionality...and having these in the same place (with the new supporting modules) makes far more sense. So they're on the left end, and each one is paired with a buffered mult and an envelope follower. That last addition is super-important, as each one extracts gate, trigger, and amplitude information from the incoming audio, and these can be used in a number of points in the build for modulation, start/stop signals, etc.
As for the buffered mults...yeah, normally I would say to not put mults in a build that's this small, but I envisioned this as a parallel processing rig, and those buffered mults are critical to equally splitting the incoming signal. Once split, the signals (and this is a wholly stereo device) are sent to:
Beads: Mutable's updated (and soon to vanish!) version of Clouds, a granular processor.
Lubadh: Your stereo loop/tape delay.
FX Aid XL: More standard effects such as delay, reverb, and the like.
So, instead of being forced into a series arrangement (although, this being modular, you can patch it however you wish), you now have the capability of all four processors receiving and transforming the SAME signal. So, right after the FX Aid XL, you'll note that there's a 4-in stereo mixer. This lets you control your composite mix made up from the processors. And given that you can easily tinker with the wet/dry on the FX Aid XL, you also get a thruput from the preamps. Then at the end, since this is going to see field use, use with electric instruments, etc, I put in one of Happy Nerding's Isolator 2022 modules for a balanced output and your headphone preamp.
I removed several things...the Sisters VCF (the Twist does much the same thing...and FAR more, such as a 20-band vocoder), the Strymon interface (this will be dense enough...no stompboxes needed!), the quantizer (not really necessary, as you'd noted) and the Pam's (you can clock this...if needed...with the clock gens in your other devices) in order to implement the other modules, but from my experience with audio processing, this PLUS the parallel architecture will result in far better and more controllable results.
OK...a basic rundown of the types of modules is useful here...
GENERATORS: oscillators and pretty much anything else that can make a noise
MODULATORS: sources of control signals which alter the behavior of other types
MODIFIERS: modules that alter signals from the above two types. Filters, effects, etc. And...
CONTROLLERS: the stuff you use to interface with the first three.
If you're missing one of these, you don't have a synthesizer. Also, it's worth noting that some modules do a few of these functions at the same time, such as what you get with performance mixers which fit into both modifiers AND controllers. It's important to keep an eye out for these, as you can get more function into a build by using these "Swiss Army Knife" modules. Case in point is one of my fave small rig VCOs: Klavis' Twin Waves mkii. That module not only has two oscillators, but the control inputs are quantized, so you've got both "generators" and "modifiers" there. At the same time, DON'T get modules that either induce eyestrain and/or require tweezers to safely tweak settings. Those are no fun whatsoever, so make sure your build's ergonomics are in a zone you feel comfortable with. Basically, you need to ask "will I feel comfortable using this in five years?" as sort of a sorting guideline.
Second, before diving further into the $$$ zone with hardware, start your inquiries in SOFTWARE. And when you say "software" and "modular synth", you may as well just go ahead and say "VCV Rack". It's probably one of the best ways to sort out what YOU want modular to do, because VCV is a very good replication of the Eurorack environment...some modules are even software versions of the hardware ones you'll find here. And the big selling-point here is that...it's NOT for "sale", it's FREE. https://vcvrack.com/ It's a much better way to learn while doing, because doing so with hardware involves a good chunk of cash. The sole caveat about VCV Rack is that it does tend to be something of a "resource hog", so in my case, I've actually gone with a wholly separate machine for it to chew on. Not a bad idea, really, especially since some tiny machines (mine's a Lenovo ThinkCentre, Gen9 i7-8700 6-core, 32 gb RAM) are both beefy AND cheap, which makes them VERY useful for that purpose.
And third: when you go with hardware, do not neglect utility modules! I can't stress that enough; a module with a couple of attenuverters might seem boring, but when you need to invert a signal, you'll be very glad that those attenuverters are there...boring or not! Jim and I are in 100% agreement here...ALWAYS make sure you've got utility modules that expand the capabilities or, in some cases such as VCAs, are 100% essential. And this is also part of the reasoning behind starting with a bigger cab, because those "sexy" modules require signals that make them do what they do, and you'll need space for those. F'rinstance, take something like Intellijel's Morgasmatron, which is a complex dual state-variable filter. So, filters usually require envelopes...so you're also talking about a pair of envelope generators there. Then you'll probably want a pair of VCAs on the outputs. And with LFOs to provide tremolo/vibrato, you wind up talking about maybe a total of 30-40 hp for that Morgasmatron and not simply the 20 hp module itself. That sort of thing. I'd suggest looking at some of the "classics", such as the venerable ARP 2600 (probably the best teaching synth ever) to see how their designers implemented these things to create synths that are still on sale 50 years later. And speaking of 2600s...
DO take advantage of some of the prebuilds out there. Uli's 2600 clone (which actually has ALL of the ARP 2600's v.3 and on functionality as it retains the 3620 submodules, while Korg's "M" reissue is missing that) only runs about $700...and as a longtime ARP 2600 user myself, I can safely say that Behringer won the "version 5" competition, while Korg's stumbled here. But ARP 2600s (irrespective of WHO made them as long as they're functionally complete) might just be one of the best "core synths" for a larger modular setup, and something I can recommend equally for any and everyone...especially starting in modular, because it's easy to use and make sense of, and you can patch loads of other devices into/out of/through it since it uses the Eurorack standard of 1 V/8va and positive gate/triggers. I would call that $700 cost a bargain!
Hi,
After seeing lots of videos about modular systems, I'm planning my first
I'm using a beatstep pro as controller.
The choice for a 62hp from intellijel, is because I'm planning multiple little cases as one big case. Next case it would be for drums.
What do you think.¿
-- supernatur
Well, I can't see what you're doing, but I can guarantee you that what you're planning will be expensive and rather pointless. Cases are some of the biggest expense in Eurorack, especially since they come in as an "up-front" cost when you're starting a build. But hey, let's do some math...
So, right now you're talking at least TWO Palette 62s. These go for $299 a pop, so $598 gets you 124 hp of space, plus 62 hp for Intellijel-format tiles...we'll call those 31 hp, as most tiles are sort of "half a module". 93 + 93 = 186 hp, with me being charitable. But as far as JUST the 3U modules, you've only got 124 hp.
Now, around here the Tiptop Mantis is generally considered the best all-around starter case. And they give you 104 x 2 hp for a total of 208 hp...for around $350. Definitely FAR cheaper...and as for power and ergonomics, they're pretty damn good. Plus, if you need 64 hp for a certain module subset...in the Palettes, you're screwed. But in a Mantis, it's easy. Which brings up the next point: small cases are really more suited for "mission-specific" builds...like adding a modulation "sidecar" or some such. And while it IS possible to mash a modular into one, you're going to have to make a lot of compromises that will wind up giving you less while costing more.
The best rule of thumb for case sizes is to whittle down a module complement to your desired result...then double the case size that it calls for. Sounds stupid, but the fact is that there's a buttload of "in between" modules that are the "glue" that makes the rest of the build work, and they're the ones everyone forgets. So, when you remember that there ARE important uses for some attenuverters and the like, they're going to need space because you're going to need them.
Now, as for the drums...this is another rabbit-hole. Yes, you CAN get loads of drum modules. Yes, the BSP HAS trigger sequencing. But this doesn't mean that you MUST do that. Fact is, if you just go out and snag something like Uli's RD-8 or 9 (or 6, even), you could get TWO of those and still not come close to the cost of doing that in modular (and yes, even in a Palette 62!). Nor would the functionality come close in terms of sequencing and integrated functions in those drum machines. By all means, yes, do your master clocking in the modular (Pam's to the rescue!) but DON'T just throw a couple grand at an issue that can be solved for less than $500.
So, yeah...that's without even seeing the build itself. But then, with how you're planning to do that, just the details about the cases alone are sufficient to indicate an impending cash bonfire. And since money works better for buying things than using it for kindling, I strongly suggest a rethink here.
OK...3 x 104? Done!
Hooo boy...have I lost my mind here? Might look like it...but...
TOP: This is all voicing. And I sort of violated the "all in 3 x 104" rule here, in that I put an external signal input (with envelope follower) in here. The idea there is to add some odd, quasi-random signal into the fray; I prefer a shortwave receiver for that...probably due to too much exposure to Stockhausen rays. Anyway, that's got a little compressor just after it to level the signal out, and then we're into the synth voices.
Each voice consists of a Doepfer A-111-4, a Codex Modulex Veils clone, an Alyseum QMix, and a stereo VCF. Each VCO has its own VCA, then that VCA feeds a QMix channel where it gets manually panned and summed to stereo. The first four feed a Rossum Linneaus, and the second goes into a Make Noise QPAS. These two stereo filters are quite different in character; one is more like a subtractive VCF but with some VERY odd modulation capabilities, and the other is a multimode with all filter outs live. Accordingly, the first block is "lead" and the second is "wash". We'll get back to how that works out in a bit...
MIDDLE: Generative requires some level of "structured" noise signals, and there's little else that's better than the ol' reliable Source of Uncertainty. This gives you various random and psuedorandom signals to route around the build. Then a Ladik Min/Max stores highest and lowest CV values across four CV inputs. So, since that's there, I put in a Joranalogue dual window comparator. That one module can provide SIX gate outputs, all dependent on the CV levels present at each comparator's input. Then a Ladik Derivator follows, firing gates when its inputted CV goes up, down, stays steady, or moves in either direction. That's a lot of gates, you say? Maybe...but then, you can use 'em to turn things on and off in either the modulation or audio paths, so feeding a couple of modulation signals up to those gives you a lot of switching potential. And then, a Tenderfoot Quad Quantizer.
But wait! Doesn't the Pam's in the next row do quantizing? Well, it can...but it's more busy as a clock source here. Instead, the Quad Quantizer is for taking modulation signals and "melodicizing" them. Four LFOs...plus all those gates...gives you four different moving lines, and the Quantizers constrain each to whatever "scale" you prefer for each one.
Then that hugeass Erogenous Tones VC8 is actually your level control for the filter outs above. The Linneaus and some of the various QPAS outputs get routed through this (left is 1-4, right is 5-8) and summed separately by channel. By doing this, one VCA can be lowering a level on one channel while raising the level on the opposite channel, generating some stereo platform motion. After the VC8 is a buffered mult for splitting the L and R outs, and these go to the Dual Delay and Aurora, with a third stereo feed for direct mixer input. The Dual Delay and Aurora have stereo (Veils topology) VCAs which can go either before or after the FX devices, depending on how you want to deal with the effect tails.
BOTTOM: Starts off with the aforementioned Pam's. Then the LFO mayhem starts with a Doepfer A-143-9 for quadrature LFO curves...loads of abuse potential there...then there's a Doepfer A-145-4 Quad LFO for four "free-run" LFO outs. And a...ring modulator? Yep...you can ring modulate low frequency stuff and get weird results, somewhat unpredictable as the slow LFO curves crossmod each other. And as if that wasn't enough LFOs, the 4ms QPLFO gives four more "pingable" LFOs that can range out to as long as 71 MINUTES...which you need to create events that occur VERY slowly across time and which also preferably are nonrepeating due to the timescale involved.
Then we get conventional for a minute with Maths, MISO, and a 3xVCA, which all has the ability to make even more ridiculously-complex modulation curves. Hence that Quad Quantizer...this isn't JUST for controlling envelopes and basic modulation, but it ALSO functions as a stochastic line generator by feeding some of what's coming off of this part of the build and turning that into discrete steps according to whatever "clock" each quantizer is receiving. And lastly, there's a Quadrax/Qx combo for envelopes...or...? Remember, this ALSO outputs pulses on EOR and EOF, which can be routed most anywhere for firing other events.
And finally, the output mixer. This time, I opted to put in a Toppobrillo MiniMix, which is based on a Buchla 200 design but with a few twists...such as two stereo input channels and two channels with autopanners. And the cherry on the cake is right next to it...a Bubblesound Reducer, which is a quartet of synth to line level converters. The idea with those is...well, surprise again, this is intended for a QUAD installation! In the space this fills, you have two stereo outs, with the stereo field crisscrossed via the Reducer. One pair of signals should be "normal", and the other will be "phase inverted"...in a space about 25' square, so that walking through the space causes all sorts of strange cancellations and reinforcements. No one person will experience this in the same way, thanks to that final trick.
As for this being a "performable" synth...it can be, actually. You'd just patch it more conventionally. But in the sort of signal flow I describe above, with the various control signals rolling off of the lower rows, it's intended to really shine in unattended operation. Note also that not everything is automated; some of these modules are intended as "set 'n' forget", like the QMix pannings in the top row, which puts some control back into the user's hands. So, this build, four portable powered speakers on tripods, and two phase-inverting boxes in the signal line to two of them, and you can be good to go in LITERALLY a matter of minutes!
So...what's missing? Well, I would've liked to have put four channels of hall reverb after the MiniMix and before the quad level shift, but it would be just as easy to snag a couple of cheap FX units (like some tc M350s) and put them in the signal paths coming off of the level shifters. But aside of that...nah. Big sequencer, maybe? Nope...this thing "sequences" by itself with a very low probability of repetition. And aside of that...hey, it's got it all sewn up!
EDIT: Also...note the seemingly-ridiculous amount of VCAs here. You might be led to think that that many of them is overkill, but remember: those VCAs are a big part of what makes this "play", since the normal operation for this build is 100% hands off while running. Skimp on VCAs, and you'll have issues getting that to happen!
Two Maths is probably overkill here, given what just ONE can do. And I concur with your observations about the VCAs...there's way too few here for what you've got. And those are sorta linked...
Let's say that, instead of the extra Maths, you replace it with something like a Happy Nerding 3xVCA and a Tiptop MISO. With those two, plus your other modulation sources, you can generate plenty of other modulation "sources". And you get a few hp back as a result...win! That combo, or something pretty similar, is possibly better than a second Maths...less confusional, for one thing. But also, you can come up with some very twisty modulation "composites", depending on how you patch it up. You could also do this with the B. 297 and three or four more linear, DC-coupled VCAs.
One other thing I see an absence of are Erica's MScale modules...if you've got three M32s, being able to use them completely with the Euro setup would be pretty useful, and the MScale handles the negative CV values (which, for the most part, don't exist in Eurorack). Otherwise, it's not a bad build...kinda jumbly, but I suppose there's a purpose to that...?
Gave this a shot also...in this case, it assumes an external sequencer is in use as well as a separate drum machine:
So, what this got turned into is a dedicated synth. The left side is your modulation, right is the voice.
So, this starts with the Arturia P/S since we're dealing with a Rackbrute if the size is any indication. Then a Batumi + Poti gives you four LFOs, a Zadar + Nin with four envelopes, and between those is a dual After Later VCA (Veils topology) and a Frap 321, with those two being useful for altering your "normal" mod sources into other signals.
Next up, there's a Doepfer A-118-2 for sample and hold, noise, and random signals. This gets followed by...count 'em...FOUR VCOs. Two Klavis Twin Waves mkii modules give you wavetable-based sound generation, plus they come with quantizers on the inputs. These sum down through a Codex Modulex Veils clone and then feed into G-Storm's clone of the Korg Delta filters...lowpass and bandpass, using SSM-style circuitry, giving things a nice, retro feel. This is also the same VCF used in the Korg Polysix and Poly-61. The little sliver next to that is a pair of LPGs, which can also be switched into VCA modes, and then it all feeds into a Frequency Central Stasis Leak for stereo tap-tempo delays, reverb, and chorus. And at the right end, an Erica PICO Output handles your stereo output and headphone levels.
Now, if this isn't an Arturia cab after all, then remove the Arturia P/S and put a Bastl Ciao! at the right end. This will then let you mix a second set of signals over the main feed, which alters your ability to use the LPGs, making them more capable as percussives (via the A-118-2's noise output) panned left and right, plus it gives you balanced 1/4" outputs and, yep, it's got a headphone preamp too. Also, pull the current LPG and PICO Out, then swap in a Make Noise LxD. Plus, this swap would allow you to use the top section of the LxD as a VCA and then this passes on through to the lower section which can function as the LPG itself. Loads of possible swaps...
Pair this up with a Beatstep Pro, and you'll have a potent two-voice (yep...doable!) paraphonic, or stereo gated synth. Just remember to have some inline patching widgets handy, as the build is way too small for mults.
Oh...one thing that's a far better substitute for Ears, fits in the same space, does everything Ears does but which has a MUCH better external audio interface would be Nonlinearcircuits' Envelope Follower. It's sort of misnamed, though...there IS a good envelope follower and gate comparator on it, but it ALSO has the proper preamp circuitry plus a 1/4" input, which really makes it into something closer in capability to the Doepfer A-119.
One of the really neat things about the 258t is that you don't have to go with the internal signal routing. For example, putting a VCA with a slow rise and fall envelope between the second oscillator's output and the FM input on oscillator 1...this "fades" the FM clang in and out over the duration of the note. A frequency shifter in that same insert would also be quite nuts, plus if you feed its signal into a delay before sending it back to the 258t, you'll get this swirling weirdness of rising FM indices if you can set up a feedback path from the delay and back around through the frequency shifter. You can do this with a pitch shifter, too...the Butthole Surfers really got into that sort of whirly psychedelic bad craziness on both "Rembrandt Pussyhorse" and "Locust Abortion Technician".
You're trying to do too much in too small a build. I would suggest losing the drum functionality altogether and going with a drum machine off the shelf, as it'll cost less in the long run, plus you'll get more out of one of those than just the snare and kick that's already there in this build.
Secondly, without modulation sources and VCAs, this'll sound as dull as dishwater. VCAs let you control amplitudes for both control and audio signals, and modulation sources can be used with them (envelopes, especially) to better articulate the notes, in addition to the "all-over" purpose of adding some animation to the patches.
Third, single skiffs like this aren't necessarily the best place to start. These are better suited for "mission-specific" builds, such as putting together a modulation "sidecar", extra sequencing, etc. You CAN get a whole synth into one, sure...but it's not all that simple, plus you have to make sure to NOT use big modules so that you can arrive at a playable device that provides all the functionality while not being so cramped that you can't use the instrument properly. A much better place to start would be Tiptop's Mantis case...hefty power, light weight, and not expensive at $350 or less depending on where you are. With 2 x 104 hp, you have plenty of room for modules such as the Nerdseq and Dual FX AND you can get everything else in there that should be in there.
Damn...sad to hear that. But it makes sense; the entire supply chain for electronic components has been shot all to hell, shipping can still be dicey, and so on.
Do what you've got to do for yourselves...and may the sun shine on you and the wind be at your backs. Godspeed, y'all...
Well, to fix the oversized MIX BX issue AND to add some final VCAs to the audio path, I would recommend having a look at Tesseract's TEXMIX system. With the Master module and a mono input module (4 ins, VCAs over level), you get your final VCA level controls. You even get to stick with the dual AUX send/return architecture for your effects. But the result fits in just 20 hp. Need more inputs? Just add another fader section!
Well, I didn't get this to fit in 64 hp...but you might want to have a look anyway...
Bigger makes this work. Here's what's there...
First up, I went with an Intellijel Palette 104 so as to keep this build gig-bag-able. This also gives you a set of buffered mults and some adders, along with the four 1/4" I/O jacks, and it contains your power supply. The buffered mults in this case can be used to mult-out a stereo pair to three outputs (using two mults, natch), leaving a third for modulation routing.
The tile row here is pretty significant as well. Your stereo inputs are on the left (fed by a pair of the 1/4" jacks), then a QuadrATT lets you mix modulation, or you can use it as a mono mixer...or both, since you can "break" the output bus into a pair of two-channel outs. This also gives you the ability to attenuvert various modulation sends, it functions as a DC offset source...very useful thing. Next, you'll note the VCO right next to a ring mod tile; the VCO is the ring mod's "carrier", offering four waveforms. Plus, that VCO can be dropped into low frequency rates...so, send a slow square wave in one side, the guitar in the other, and voila! Instant "Crimson and Clover" audio chopping! After those are two more utility LFOs...both of which have wave restarts, which is also important here (you'll see why in a bit). Then the output mixer lets you separate two different mixes and then combine them when going into the outputs (the other two 1/4" jacks). This should function as a very capable wet/dry control...run your dry signal (or maybe the wavefolder output?) into pair #1, your FX mix into pair #2, adjust as desired.
The MODULE row, though...that's where things get interesting!
First up is a pair of ADDAC 301 pedal interfaces. These have an expression pedal input as well as a "latch" switch for sustain...or for firing something else, such as the huge thing at the end of the row. After that, a Bastl Dynamo does double duty by providing two channels of envelope following/gates, plus an A-B switch, all under the control of the input signal's dynamics. After that, there's a trio of AR envelopes from Nonlinearcircuits and a rather twisted LFO from Erica. The Black Octasource is a single LFO...but with eight outputs, all set 45 degrees of phase from each other. With that, you can have things like autopanning, weird modulation "lumps", odd modulation "cancellations", etc. Sure, you could have four LFOs...but this thing gives you eight ways to use one LFO, all in perfect sync. The Black Noise Voltage Processor is your waveshaper...stereo waveshaper, in fact. Get used to that word, btw...from here on, the entire audio path is STEREO.
So, once you get past the waveshaper, you're into the effects. The first two are from Xaoc...their 4-pole multimode stereo VCF, followed by their CV controlled frequency shifter (also stereo). You might notice the lack of phase shifters or flangers here, and that frequency shifter is the reason. It can do those things, but it can do them to extremes; crank the shift control, and everything turns into clangers and howlers with gnarly anharmonic timbres. But turn it back down to just barely off zero, and suddenly you've got this phasing...SOUND. Nothing like 'em, really!
Then we've got an Alright Chronoblob2. This stereo delay hides a surprise: an insert in its regen path. Want to listen to things warp out of shape with each repeat? Insert the frequency shifter into the Chronoblob's regen, set the shift for a half-step, and hear the echoes whirl upward into weird aliasing. Or drop the VCF in, and degenerate the repeats, or or or... Anyway, after that is Mutable's Beads...which, if you're going to get one, you'd better hurry as Emilie is shutting down pretty much now. But if not, no prob...there's 14 hp variations on the very similar Clouds that'll drop right in if you don't get lucky.
And then, the Qu-bit Synapse. This is billed as a "crossfading switch", and it's a bit complex as to what it's capable of. But one thing that immediately comes to mind here is the fact that the Synapse can store and recall eight different settings, and you can access that via its "advance" jack. That's why the ADDACs with their footswitch capability is there, as one of those footswitches can be dedicated to that "advance" control. Otherwise, it's sort of like a variation on Mutable's Frames mix-scene module...set up your signal path, CV levels, etc etc, and store it.
So, no...I totally blew it on the form factor. But that was very deliberate on my part, because that 64 hp build was very restrictive due solely to the available space. By shifting to a Palette 104, though, I was able to toss a LOT of potential into the build...and in the end, 104 hp isn't that difficult to shlep around, especially if you pick up one of these from Intellijel: https://intellijel.com/shop/cases/gig-bag-for-4u-palette-cases/ Not too shabby, those...about the size of a violin case, actually.
That Joranalogue Receive is incredible sounding, crystal clear and no noise. Same can't be said for the A-119, while not being terrible does have more self-noise and high end roll off.
-- liquidcolor
The original ARP 2600 preamp/envelope follower was also a noisy critter. A lot of this seems to be due to impedance mismatching between the input and the device feeding it, which is also a source of noise with some guitar pedals when they have to deal with a mismatch. You might try some experiments with matching transformers before the A-119 input to see if you can find a "magic number" that brings the noise under control.
It's also worth noting that Roman's Input module (now discontinued) in the Sputnik modules had a switch for helping with impedance matching.
