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Hi Sacguy71,

Oh yes! Finally you ordered your monster case and did you made a choice in the sequencer matter :-) Quite curious how you will experience the Metron. Did you already order the Voltera (how many) and Axxent extender modules? I can't wait for your review video :-)

Kind regards, Garfield.

I was literally just working on a patch like that @lugia before I saw your comment, great tip and definitely opens up some interesting possibilities.

the-erc's got it, yep. By having a quantizer at the ready, there's a lot of interesting things you can do, such as scale constraint, deriving arpeggi from LFO curves, making more use of the Stages as a sequencer, and the like. It also functions as a useful on-the-fly transposition tool via its BIAS control. And, with a quantizer on hand, there's some glitchy things that becomes doable, sort of along the lines of using the MS-20's input section. By using the quantizer to "mistrack" incoming audio, and then also employing the Plankton ENVF to mess with the VCF in conjunction with that, this has loads of potential for Aphex-ish percussive glitching. Most people tend to associate quantizing with sequencers, but the fact is that they've got tons of abuse potential beyond that.

There's another twisted thing about those two modules: you can send the envelope gen's outputted CVs to the quantizer AND somewhere else...but one of those ENVF outputs is inverted, so this opens up another stage of glitching that the MS-20 cannot do. For example, you can have the quantizer deriving CVs from the inverted envelope, but FM the complex VCO via its modulation oscillator in the OPPOSITE direction. Pitch goes down as chaotic racket increases, and so on. And of course, if there's a sequencer in a future upgrade, the OP's set already.

what is the use case for the 2hp tune? I'm not conviced of it's usefulness - Pams does quantized doesn't it?

Pam can quantise its outputs but it can't quantise external signals. (Unless they improved the firmware AGAIN while I wasn't looking.) Since it is an LFO at heart and not a sequencer this is a bit melodically limiting. I'm thinking of getting a 2hp Tune just to release my Disting for other duties! Although the Disting has many variations on the theme of quantisation, which Tune cannot do. Sad.

Thanks Garfield,

Actually I pulled the trigger so to speak and ordered a new WMD Metron sequencer and Doepfer monster base case! I need more of a trigger sequencer anyways for drums and bass lines. I will probably consider either the 512 Vector or some other melodic sequencer in the future to complement the drum bass sequencer. The cool thing about Metron are the expanders to use for cv and drum accents with Voltera and Axxent plus get Arpitecht for chord arpeggios similar to what Sinfonion does for way less cost and smaller size. I will post a video review once both arrive. Since I have a few percussion modules, it was important to use versus Korg SQ-1 and Varigate 4+ which are not ideal for complex trigger gate sequencing duties in rack.

Do you say that the 2hp tune can also be done by PAM and therefore you can pass the stages from there?
But then this could limit the use of PAM for other feats with quantized Stages?
Jim is right, the new Veil is large 10 hp instead of 12hp. Instead of two 2hp could be re-added Links that permitted more functions?

EDITED Nov 19th 2020, 19:26

what is the use case for the 2hp tune? I'm not conviced of it's usefulness - Pams does quantized doesn't it?
and re Veils grab the new one for an extra 2hp

Fantastic so dreamy could be an entire ambience type album. Would be nice to see you patch this live for us n00bs to modular.

EDITED Nov 19th 2020, 16:02

A fellow banana plug junky I chat with is picking up one of the Korgs. Way too rich for my blood, so I'm very interested in the Behringer too.

Thank you very much at all, so instead of Links, Kinks and Mixup I save space with mix and tune of 2hp and Roti Pola and still keep minimal effects with Stasis Link and Modbox.
Nice. Very clear also the organization of modules in rack.

I'd look at the mi branches code - should have almost everything you need there

@humanstrobe good trader, would deal with again!

I can certainly think of a few good and rare old ones. Harvestman Double Andore 1 and Hertz Donut 1 are absolutely fantastic modules that are difficult to get a hold of nowadays. The Livewire AFG was a staple module when I got started in 2010 as well as the Toppobrillo Sport Modulator, both now obscure and hard to find. Of course the elusive QMMG. :-)

On the topic of what 'modern' modules are becoming rare, I figure the Sputnik modules will all essentially be hard to find in the future. They are all very good, and as far as I know all production has seized. Maybe the Roland Demora/Scooper et al are candidates too?

Hiya! I'm in the process of making my first own module. I think using the Atmega 328PU is a common and popular way of making fairly complex task without having to design complex analog circuits. Examples such as the original ALM Pamela, 4ms PEG, Mutable Instruments Grids, Bastl Kompas etc really show this potential.

Now, are there any common tips when designing such machines? Is there a common rule for all arduino projects? What are some pitfalls that you got into when sketching?

I am building a trigger sequencer for the 1u row. Using trigger inputs it will read from a buffer and decide wether or not to output a trigger.

Thankful for absolutely any tips. :-)

Both Intellijel and Mutable Instruments make superb gear! I love my Mutable Instruments Kinks+Links combo for logic and support mixing tools and mults and Plaits is a wonderful macro-oscillator capable of many different synthesis models and can crank out percussion to strings and more. I really like my Intellijel Quadrax module and Plonk is fun as well. I have the Intellijel Quad VCA and mixup are soo useful tools. You really cannot go wrong with these modular companies.

sacguy's version above is excellent... much more functional, and fun as well.

Intellijel and Mutable both make tremendous modules... hard to go wrong with either of them.

OK...I had a go at restructuring this:

All of the previous modules are still in there. But the additions are all designed to work with other modules as "units".

For starters, I put a 2 hp quantizer right by the Complex VCO. This will let you use the sequencing function of the Stages with actual pitch data being outputted to the VCO. And I added a 2 hp mixer after the VCO to let you sum different waveforms, adding some more timbral complexity beyond what the Verbos VCO does.

Belgrad, then Veils...two of the Veils VCAs can then easily be used for VCO-VCF levels and for the level off of the VCF to the Frequency Central Stasis Leak. That, I chose because it allows you to send in a mono signal, but get stereo chorusing, reverb, or tap delay. This then makes full use of the stereo output capability. The ENVF is next to this, right by the audio input. This rework also puts ALL of the audio path on the top row for an easier signal flow, moving the modulation, etc down so that these signals "patch upward" to the audio modules above.

Bottom: Pam's, Plog, then there's a dual LFO with a LOT of additional functions, notably sample & hold, noise, and 120 degree phase shift for the LFO outputs so that synced-but-rephased modulation can be done with this. Maths, the dual VCA, then I moved the Qx to the left of the Quadrax so that it's a little easier to "abuse" it and the Maths in tandem by crossrouting start and end (and likely many other) signals between these two. Then a Roti Pola, which is there to screw really hard with four channels of that Ochd octal LFO, by combining, attenuating, repolarizing those signals (and others, potentially) into complex LFO curves for elaborate modulations while still leaving four more outputs free for elsewhere.

Lastly, I rehoused the whole thing in a Doepfer A-100 case, since you'd mentioned that above as being where this should all end up. This still has all of the original modules, therefore...but NOW, all of the support modules are amply present that rip the lid off of them, and bring the whole build up to speed. In fact, note that my additions all have to do with the functionality of OTHER modules...this is how you've got to think when building modular rigs. You WANT complex interoperability and functionality to be present, if you need it...but at the same time, the build needs to be straightforward and performable. I think this nails both.

EDITED Nov 19th 2020, 01:26

Thanks a lot for the heads-up, I want to wait to get a larger case since I already purchased one.
I've been looking at the Pamela's New Workout and like what I have read about it and the FX Aid too, small form factor for the reverb is a plus.
I want this rig to be more of a side piece to my semi modular gear, incorporate as I see fit to my ambient/ downtempo style.

What is your opinion the mutable instrument & intellijel gear?

Thanks for the input, greatly appreciated sacguy71,

R/

Orium

Hi Mowse,

Wow, that's beautifully done. I don't know how you do it, taming that Telharmonic so nicely?!

I got myself a Telharmonic, I like the beast but taming it? No Sir, I am not able to do that at all however you seem to have made an art out of taming the Telharmonic :-)

Too high sounds? It didn't bother me. I do love high sounds so I didn't mind at all and actually really enjoyed the high tones in your track.

It sounds actually as a beautiful drone... having said that... drone? 17 minutes? ;-) I wouldn't mind if your track had been 17 minutes or more, it would have been a pleasure listening at it.

Kind regards, Garfield.

Hi Sacguy71,

I still love to see you play with your system :-)

Ha, ha, at 5:00+ minutes you are taking that patch cable as if to say: "Here, this is all about patching and watch this!" :-) Most probably not intended, you just took a patch cable, however I felt it was a quite fun-moment :-)

Somewhere around the 6:00+ you are using a sound there that reminds me a slightly bit of one of those frogs out from my pond in my backyard for sampling interesting sounds ;-)

That voice I heard around 7:00+ is that from your Plaits module?

Thanks a lot for sharing this and kind regards, Garfield.

Yes 100% fun support from me too... modular bleeps and bloops and I love your attitude and approach - spot on!!

Right now you have enough to spend some serious time learning... stick with what you have right now and experiment.

Try some tutorials on how to create classic modular patches, I didn't look too closely, but you probably have enough to create a Krell patch - this should be your next video - hint hint ;)

I very rarely shout anyone out for their entry into the world of modular, but you really made me smile :)

Hi Zuggamasta,

He, he, looks like you are enjoying modular synthesizers and the nice thing of all, you made it all by yourself :-)

I noticed you got a Teenage Engineering module too, how is that one, do you like it?

Keep up the good work and thank you very much for sharing this. Kind regards, Garfield.

Yes, I would get a much larger case to start with, perhaps a 9U Doepfer case? You also need more support modules: VCAs, attenuator, matrix mixer, and modulation sources like LFO and function generator. Also, I would get rid of the Rainmaker module way too large for a smaller setup. Replace it with something smaller like Erica Synths Pico DSP or Happy Nerding FX Aid.

Here is a suggestion on your build above to improve it:

I removed the massive Rainmaker and replaced it with Happy Nerding FX Aid unless you plan on larger case.
-Added LFO with 0chd
-Added function generator- Make Noise Function
-Added VCA- Tangle Quarter is great
-Pamela New Workout: great clock that gives you many other things like logic, Euclidian sequencer, and much more
- passive attenuator

Hello Internet,

Today I got my first module, the Instruo Arbhar. I started to add some modules that I would like to get next, does this community have any thoughts on this setup.

Also, what are some of the best starters.

Thanks,

Orium

Hey you two :)

The DIY modules where all fun and games, but the Muxlicer was annoying as hell: first a missing part, then a burned in switch due to overheated joints and now I noticed one LED did not sit perfect while soldering...

But it is working a at last. there is still so much to do and learn with this setup but I thought it would be nice to document what I was able to quickly come up with today. And after some tests before hand a Patch that is not controlled by midi this time!

I read a bit into the syncing of the pocket operators again and found the befaco outputs cue really useful to attenuvert the signal. And having a clock divider inside of the Muxlicer is great for converting the clock.

Onto more musical patches! And thank you for your kind words!

Thanks guys, glad you enjoyed. With your encouragement maybe next time I can make it to 17 minutes :)

I'd be tempted to get a second Stages and link it to the first, but then you'd be done for space.

If you like Ripples, you could take a look at Popple. It's essentially a stereo Ripples in 8hp.

Excellent, @mowse, really really digging this, the voice placement in particular is fantastic but the melody and everything else too, well done.

Yep, that was me @GarfieldModular and I'm glad to see it having influence already 🤣, this rules pretty frickin hard @the-erc, the textures, dynamics, and rhythms are great, thank you for sharing, and for advancing the 17 minute-long cause lol

first I would get a bigger case (6u/104hp is a good sized starter case) so you can actually build a modular synth in it rather than a collection of a few modules that won't play nicely together

you need to add modulation, envelope generators, utility modules

either a bigger case or cut back to 1 or 2 voices at most - otherwise not enough space for the support modules you need

-- JimHowell1970

Thanks for the great feedback! I’m such a n00b and could use some more examples of what you mean by utility modules. I have 8 LFOs, and 6 VCAs — what other basic utilities do I need other than an envelope generator? Pardon my ignorance

-- trazo5

you could do with some more mixing capabilities for starters - I see you have a sequential switch and some logic (too much logic not enough mixing) - first off all throw both the logic modules out and get a kinks - you get a rectifier and a sample and hold thrown in - but only 1 logic channel - which is probably more than enough in this size case

I usually recommend links, kinks and shades as a utility starter set, after that a sequential switch and a matrix mixer

to me the turing machine and expansion modules take up way too much space in this size case - but then so do the instruo modules - I'd choose one or the other but not both - or a much bigger case

marbles would be my choice for replacing the turing machine and the quantizer - almost all the functionality (plus some more) in just over 1/3rd the space

a lot of the interesting stuff in modular comes from sequencing the sequencer, or modulating the modulation - which is where utilities usually come in

Utility modules are the inexpensive, dull polish that makes the expensive, shiny modules actually shine!!!

I'm also not convinced by ochd as a primary lfo - not a great deal of control and only a saw iirc - great as a secondary lfo though

I'd second the recommendation of Maths - check out the illustrated manual online - it's a great learning tool - if you want to actually learn about modular - which some do and some don't

EDITED Nov 18th 2020, 18:42

I would get a sequential switch or matrix mixer which are great for ambient.
-- sacguy71

Would love to hear/see some creative uses for sequential switches in a max-240hp build. I have one myself that I've generally been using as a modulation sequencer or creating random melodic lines from multiple oscillators. Curious about other creative techniques for them.

Playing Make Noise Telharmonic through Optomix, QPAS, Rossum Panharmonium, Clouds, and Mimeophon. Lots of knob turning over a simple set of sequences from Rene that feed Telharmonic. I had some gain staging issues running through this chain and a tough time taming the high end noise generated by Clouds feeding on Panharmonium. I'll revisit the patch today to sort that out. Telharmonic can be tough to tame but I really like where this one is going.

Interesting kinks. Is a contrary links that add effects and noise instead of clearing and mixing. Nice thx

If I was looking to fill the 10hp left, I would probably add a Happy Nerding FX Aid XL and a Mutable Instruments Kinks.

+1 for everything above. Start with a bigger case like a Mantis, and get a copy of VCVRack.

For modules, you might also want to look at Grayscale's 18hp Permutation module. It does a lot of the stuff that the Turing Machine and expanders do and uses a lot less hp. Other good ones to look at for this kind of music are Ornament+Crime, Disting, Ultra Random Analog, Control Forge, Cloud Terrarium, Triple Sloths, and 4ms SWN and SMR.

Keep in mind that all this good advice you're getting is pretty expensive when you start buying everything. Starting with four modules is a good idea. I'd say get yourself a complex oscillator like DPO, Troika, or Furthrrrr Generator, a function generator like Maths, Grand Terminal, Zadar, or Scion, an irregular modulation source like Ultra Random Analog, Permutation, or Ornament+Crime, and an output module, like XOH or Intellijel's Outs. Will that give you everything you need to make generative music? Not really, but it will get you started. You'll be able to make sound, modulate it, modulate the modulation, and listen to it. Then get to know all four modules, figure out what they're not doing for you, and then go look for new modules.

EDITED Nov 18th 2020, 15:38

I agree with tip of mixing/patching with headphones. I have clashed several times on this aspect.

well... This will be a possible finalization of first rack that I could complete in the next months...

About effects, is there space (10 hp) for something? My first idea was Mimeophon and others but the space now is not enought.

About power consumption I will use the power supply and bus board of Doepfer A100 that have 1200 mA so I think will be enought.

EDITED Nov 18th 2020, 10:48

Ah i see you have a mult but it is way to big for a small case. I would ditch the ripples get a freak instead. If it is for studio use you don't really need the mixer adsr i would also recommend from 2hp. Generally unless you plan to build a monster case every hp is essential. Plaits and Manis have already a vca in them so i would ditch veils and get also a smaller vca for example 2hp for the spectrum module. Or get altogether a vca with build in envelope like the pico mod.

This is my rack so far i make industrial techno. I use it along a with a Tr 8 run through a distortion pedal. With the Mysteron i am not so happy since the soundpalet is not so big. Next modules will be plaits and clouds then Loquelic Iteritas Percido , cursus versio, mimetic digitalis and 2hp hat. I am also planning to sell the milky way and get another fx aid xl. Sequencing i am with beatstep pro and korg sq-1

EDITED Nov 18th 2020, 07:19

I would suggest to get a smaller plaits module and clouds module so you have more space for future modules. Plus 2 modules that i highly recommend is is the vult freak and the fx aid xl plus i recommend 1 or 2 mults to split cv signals

EDITED Nov 18th 2020, 06:54

Also download a free copy of VCVRack that is such a valuable tool for planning and trying out modules. I have 2 full 6U cases but still use the software for testing and trying things out. Bigger case is great. You can fill in empty space with blank panels.

Fun drone today

Hi The-Erc,

Now this is what I call a drone ;-) Yeah!

You know what? This is certainly not the shortest track here on this forum but it didn't feel at all that it was too long, no the opposite, somehow this 15 or 17 minutes long drone track thing, it makes sense, after about 10 minutes or so the whole mind, body, soul and whatever we got in us, it's all focussed just on your drone! And that's a fantastic experience :-)

That ticking sound that kicks in around 14:00+, I love that, a nice surprise: a kind of saying goodbye and a thank you to the listener, well done!

How lovely this is and thank you very much for sharing it! Kind regards, Garfield.

P.S.: Next time perhaps a real 17 minutes or longer drone? ;-)

P.S.2: Who was that with this 17 minutes, was that you Troux? Well, spot on! :-)

Hi Lugia,

Ha, ha, well... after 10 years or so, perhaps you can then smile about it, for now... take a very deep breath...

And let's wait for the 2600 from Behringer to come out and have it tested at our local dealers. My local dealer updated the availability of the B2600 from March 2021 to early January 2021, so it's a not too long wait any more, I hope...

Kind regards, Garfield.

first I would get a bigger case (6u/104hp is a good sized starter case) so you can actually build a modular synth in it rather than a collection of a few modules that won't play nicely together

you need to add modulation, envelope generators, utility modules

either a bigger case or cut back to 1 or 2 voices at most - otherwise not enough space for the support modules you need

-- JimHowell1970

Thanks for the great feedback! I’m such a n00b and could use some more examples of what you mean by utility modules. I have 8 LFOs, and 6 VCAs — what other basic utilities do I need other than an envelope generator? Pardon my ignorance

Someone on this forum said a drone track has to last 17 minutes. I tried, I really tried.

Hope no one is offended by the lack of modular on this: the only sound source is the DFAM playing into a big mess of cheap-ass... er I mean... vintage digital delays feeding back into each other, most prominent of which is the Boss RSD-10.

I'm so underwhelmed.

I just got an email from Perfect Circuit, saying that one of the RAR KARP 2600 FS UBERKOOL "limited" synths (plus stamped-out-of-dried-jello "road" "case") CAN BE MINE!

Nice. Uhhh...OK, so I needed to allocate space and budget for this about...ah...10 months ago. As in, when it actually came out, it should've been available THEN if Korg wanted my money. Not now. Not after I've completed the purchases for the studio with the sole exception of an ARP 2600...from Behringer. For a lot less. With no worries about availability. Or having to fight for one vs the people who Korg "decided" that should get one. Or a roadcase that makes it "special" while being utterly useless otherwise.

I reiterate: someone (or several someones) over in Hamamatsu needs to be chucked into a padded room and shot full of thorazine. Screw those bastards. I don't like giving Uli my money, but if they're going to step up where Korg massively stumbled, well...

Two modules come to mind...one would be a new offering from G-Storm: their Gyrinx VCF, which is a clone of the Synton Syrinx filter, well known for all sorts of wild modulation capabilities with a filter set that focuses on vocal formants. And the wavefolder...Tiptop's Fold offers a nice wavefolder, dual inputs, and a suboctave generator for massive square-wave bass with its own separate output. Dirt-cheap, too!

TBH, I don't recommend trying to patch with headphones...for the same reason that I don't recommend mixing with headphones. In both cases, the frequency response and the driver proximity are going to cause various alterations to your sound that, once the sound has been routed to a pair of speakers, will become glaringly apparent. The tendency will be to lower the bass and high end when listening to phones...leading to sounds that won't cut and won't pound. Never do this. The ONLY rationale for using headphones with any synthesizer would simply be for practice; never do that when you're playing live thru a PA (unless you need them for a cue send) or in the studio.

As for the build itself...sacguy's on the right track here. I would suggest the addition of an Intellijel Quadrax, also...this gives you four cycle-able two-stage EGs, which means you can loop them to make additional LFOs for modulation purposes. Make sure and add the Qx expander for that, which then allows you access to the start and end pulses for more complex composite curves...and you can still break out an ASR three-stage from this for the VCF and/or the output VCA. Oh, and you can have CV over rise/fall parameters here, too, since the Quadrax has a pile of routing possibilities (it's got a mod matrix hiding in it!). Makes a good match with the Veils! Plus, since the TAI-4 has no envelope followers (boo hiss!), adding one to track your drum machine's volume contour might be very worthwhile (auto-wah? ducking? all need this). Plankton makes a nice 2 hp one (you won't need to tinker with it much once it's set) for a bit under $100.

Oh, and sacguy? Good call on mating the Pam's with the Plog! All sorts of wacky timing possibilities with that pairing...

+1 on Jim's suggestion here. Without the additional utility and supporting modules, this is a nice accumulation of modules...and that's about it. Start with something pre-powered like a Mantis instead of these way-too-small skiffs.

Or maybe that:
Instrument interface (befaco) through a little bandpass filter, through disting for pitch and cv tracking)...
-- deniSound

Yep, I've been looking at the Befaco: https://www.perfectcircuit.com/befaco-i4-instrument-interface.html?gclid=Cj0KCQiAhs79BRD0ARIsAC6XpaX8aH6USyFV91YKPED9YK0Jgcw6KY-kQRF2NM3-ochS9iHaDOKULAUaAijKEALw_wcB

@Lugia,

I actually just reached out to the company, and they confirmed that the finished module will have phantom power. As for the impedence and input levels, I would imagine that's what the Mode 1-2-3 switch will be, no?

Unfortunately, they also said 2021 for release.