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Yes, I have noticed that doepfer generally has more affordable modules. On the other hand they tend to have 1 function per module. I mean, to put together the equivalent of a disting I would probably need 84hp.

-- Startics

more like 8 * 84hp - average size of doepfer module is about 8hp - and there are over 80 algos

what puts people off disting a lot, is if they try to test everything, constantly and have to refer back to the manual everytime to remember what every input and output is doing... if you set it up to use favourites - say a dozen algos, and then concentrate on those and replace the algo with a dedicated module, say you find 70% of the time you are using disting as a delay - buy a delay and replace the delay algo in favourites - it is much easier to work with - the menu is about as deep as a puddle!!

using favourites.txt for disting is a massive help

there is a reason that they call it eurocrack

it's because it's gonna be a near-constant drain (however small) for the rest of your life if you get into it

it has advantages over lots of other similar endeavours in that you may actually have something left to show for it and it probably won't kill you, but never the less it always ends up as - what's the next module (or modules) and where is the next case coming from, often at the same time - unless you have near unlimited funds

your maths is way out with buying a second case!!! I kinda knew EU prices - but I just checked sweetwater for US - they are about the same

2 * Nifty case $538 168hp = $3.20/hp
1 * tiptop Mantis $335 204hp = $1.64/hp

with the left over you can buy a better midi->cv converter - everything else in the nifty case is superfluous and can easily be replaced for under $30 - a passive mult and a 1/4"->1/8" cable (and you may still have money left over)

so buy the bigger case - you will need it - imo 84hp is ok for 1 voice, once you add in the support modules you need to get it to do anything interesting, you may be able to fit 3-4 in to a mantis, if you choose wisely

as for the 'bundle' - why would you waste even $60 on modules you probably will not want in 2-3 months time

put the money towards something you do want - such as a better case or modules

once you have about $1000 to spend at once get the case and a couple of modules

as starter modules -

Rings - get an OG - pay some respect to Emilie for designing it and it has a massive advantage that you don't need a filter or vca after it

Maths - how to learn modular synthesis in a single module - well not quite, but as patch-programmable analog computers go - it's a great module!!

if you want midi sequencing get a midi->cv module (mutant brain if you can find one is a good buy) or maybe a korg sq-1 - I think it can do midi->cv too, but don't quote me on that - they are inexpensive and handy to have around

and that's it - work your way through the illustrated maths manual a few times, try all the easter egg modes of rings, next module should be a quad cascading vca - veils for example - then you might want to think about exploring disting (I'd try to get the EX if possible)

every week / month throw a bit in a kitty and when you have enough for the next module buy it - then patch it with everything else and work out what's missing and repeat!!!

or as @farkas suggested get a crave

EDITED Oct 18th 2020, 20:01

Ah, thanks, sacguy71. I had a close call with Our Pal Covid this week, but both my test and the one another person in my "line of contagion" had came back negative, so everything's golden for the time being. Can't play with that virus, though; I've got a pair of cardiac stents, which puts me in one of the riskier groups.

Still, not feeling so hot, so I'm not exactly back in overdrive just yet. Gimme a few...
-- Lugia

hope you are feeling better soon Lugia!!!

1 clouds is out of production - only knock offs and used available - but clouds2 is imminent (and smaller) I would await this
2 far too much sequencing - I would throw everything out and decide between midi or in rack - and then start again from scratch - huge amounts of redundancy and space wasting!!!
3 quantizer is completely redundant - all the sequencing methods are already quantized
4 replace the erica dual fx with 2 fx aids - possibly xl
5 replace intellijel quad vca with new veils - 2 hp smaller
6 mixing appears to be an after thought - once you have ripped out half the sequencing and have space this is where a lot of it should go - sub-mixing before effects and mixing cv to create more interesting modulation are powerful techniques that should be learnt as early as possible
7 do you need a buffered mult? - probably not - but if you do get links instead as it adds a couple of small mixers (which are always useful)

From the manual
The upper part of the front panel offers con-trols for the signal analysis blocks. The enve-lope follower input jack (9) labeled follow is internally normalled to the output of the import block, but it allows for directly patch-ing other signals.

there is no level in cv for the export block so the module on it's own will not do what you ask

however you could just use a vca

having just re read your original post:
the sewastopol does not do wet/dry mixing - a simple way to implement this is to use a cascading vca and an inverted copy of whatever you want to use to modulate your wet/dry mix - mult of original signal into ch1, sewastopol out into ch2 - modulation and inverted modulation into cv inputs of vcas - which channels will depend on how you want to modulate them

EDITED Oct 17th 2020, 01:42

the ES9 is an excellent tool for just that cv (including pitch) and audio to and from rack and computer - Silent Way or CV Tools work well once set up I believe

personally I mostly use it (actually an ES8 in my case) for audio - including a clock out from Logic

well I was taking the piss a bit!!! - most people claim they've spent a long time researching - when it is obvious that they haven't - or at least they have been researching in the wrong places - 6 months looking at videos of tiny focused cases that are one patch wonders - does not equal adequate research!!!

I always try and look as far ahead as possible for what modules I may want - so that if I buy/build a vca (or mixer or any other utility) I get one that is big enough for future requirements - which is why I recommend a quad cascading vca to beginners - but no harm in a smaller one - just my advice, which you can take or leave as you see fit - but do take a look at the "Jim and Lugia were right thread"!!!

as I probably stated above just get a few modules to start with and grow slowly - a sound source, a sound modifier, a modulation source, a way to play, a way to listen and a case

Marbles is great I use it in every patch near enough - currently with a branches attached to t2 (for skip/open/close hats) and a sinfonion as an extra external quantizer for the x section (not that you need a quantizer - as Marbles has 3 already) - if you like generative music then this is a great place to start

EDITED Oct 15th 2020, 12:30

Lots to take away from this! I've already started to make adjustments after reading your previous response & a lot of it makes so much sense. I had a further look into Links/Kinks & now I see how valuable they can be & even better they fit so many utilities into a small amount of HP! I already scrapped Levit8 & the VC8 - as I had a feeling the amount of VCAs I had planned for this case was overkill & having a mixer with submix capabilities within a rack when I planned to buy an external mixer was quite redundant. In turn, I may add a 2hp mix for how nifty & convenient it is.

I would look at Happy Nerding for a small mixer - much more ergonomic than the 2hp ones!!!

Then, I was led to the realization that an ES-9 can indeed be incorporated into the rack like you had suggested & since it has SPDIF I/O, I can link it up to my Scarlett & BOOM, everything can be recorded into the DAW without the need for an external mixer! And instead of getting a cv.ocd to do my sequencing via MIDI, I added a Mutant Brain since plenty of space was freed up. The Disting got scrapped, as I now don't really know what I would use it for + I don't really want to deal with that tiny screen & its 1 million algorithms. I feel I still have plenty of research to do, but your feedback & suggestions really have cleared a lot of things up & I definitely feel more confident about the end results!
-- cameliamusic

I would read the ES9 manual thoroughly before committing based on SPDIF - I think it will be very (limited 2 channels) - although it can also be set up as a mixer - depending on the daw (and plugins) you are using you can also use it to send v/oct and modulation to the rack - and potentially not need a midi->cv module (which will potentially have higher latency)

Disting - I would get an EX - the whole point is you don't know what to use it for - so you'll have it when you need it - if you spend a short time setting up favourites.txt it's much easier to work with - menu is not deep - it's really useful for working out which modules you need

I would stop doing research (at least temporarily) - just buy a case and a few modules - a sound source, a sound modifier, a modulation source, a way to play and a way to listen - plus a few utilities (quad vca, links, kinks, something like shades maybe) and start patching - learn that inside out and then add a module and repeat

Hey Jim! Thank you for your input on this!

NP

I added Cara into the rack as a last minute attempt to save space BUT originally, I planned (& will ultimately end up with) to have the actual Marbles in there! I hate how cramped the panel on Cara is. I really love the possibilities of random & probabilistic gates/triggers & voltages that Marbles provides & I would use it, for example, to trigger an Optomix or one of the Doepfer ADSR’s!

I use mine every patch - often these days through a sinfonion and branches (for hihat slip/open/close)

I’m actually so far VERY 50/50 on Clouds or any of its variations. Something about me likes it & wants to LOVE it, but I just can’t fully commit.

I know what you mean - I use mine a lot (mostly as a delay though) but right now I would wait to buy anything like this until after hearing clouds2

As for VCV Rack, in all honesty, I haven’t used it for quite some time now — a few months since I last opened it up.

I'm not a big fan either to be honest - maybe once or twice this year on flights in January - I think it's a great introduction though

As for the buffered mult, I totally agree. It was another thing I was thinking about ditching & since I probably won’t be doubling up on 1 pitch sequence to 2 different oscillators, it can definitely get the boot. Will definitely look into Links/Kinks & all their functions! I have read many posts on here recently & you’ve recommended this combo time & time again, so it must be for a good reason!

yeah but that is something that you may well want to do in the future - 2 vcos -> filter
which is why I recommend replacing it with links which has a buffered mult - just not 3

As for VCA’s, do you think there could be such thing as TOO MANY in this situation?
yes - 15 is too many, definitely not too many in some modular synths but it is in 6u - I'd be happy with a quad cascading vca (veils) and a dual lpg in 6u tbh

I just counted and I have 15 vcas including lpgs and vcas built into other modules like filters or vcos in about 24u - I need more vcas! well yes and no - I keep looking at the wmd performance mixer - and that has a load built in - which would free up the 6 standalone vcas nicely - which would be enough and would add voltage controlled panning - but it's expensive, a power hog and big - which all means I need another case and envelope generators for the vcas

Also, what do you say about Levit8? I like the ability that it can do more than attenuate & it also provides the possibility to create sub mixes before sending out to an external mixer.

but to what point? you probably won't need all that many channels of attenuation (some yes 8 probably not) and you won't need to sub mix before an external mixer if you buy the right external mixer!! which if you are going to buy one it makes sense to do!! if you already had a mixer and needed attenuators for each channel and/or wanted to just record stereo tracks then maybe

if you want sub-mixes before hitting a filter - great get something small - if you want some vc panning get a small module for that - if you want to mix some modulation (do this it is great) get a matrix mixer - but you are just taking up space that could be used for other things and negating the point of getting an external mixer

And as for tracking equipment that I have now into the DAW, I have a Scarlett 8i6 BUT all of its inputs are taken up by the 3 Elektrons so I am running Plaits to an external input on the Analog 4 which allows me to records my experiments & noodles for the moment!

I hate making multiple passes to record multitracks of the same piece on modular - so I would consider upgrading this (or extending with adat, if possible) - maybe with a mixer with proper usb multitrack capabilities and enough channels for everything you have now plus however many voices there are in this rack plus 1/2 as much again - so at least 12 channels, but 16-24 if at all possible, in total (for the

PNW is a module I have been watching very closely with googly eyes since its release & I really love how each of its 8 outputs can be freely assignable & I love that it has LFO’s & Euclidean options. I will definitely look more into Batumi & have a look at Zadar as well! They are both modules I have come across many times in my search, but for some reason, I never gave them much thought beyond a glance. I sincerely appreciate your feedback! It cleared up some things I was flip flopping back & forth about!

Yeah I have none of these modules - they are all very popular - and all have their pros and cons - and I think I want them all - and at the same time I want none of them - more vcas means more envelope generators and these 3 are kind of the top contenders - but then I might just go for a selection of diy envelopes - or a mix

Edit: Also, which matrix mixers would you recommend having a look at? I know Doepfer has one which seems to be popular. Matrix mixers are something I still have to wrap my head around as well but there’s plenty of time for that!
-- cameliamusic

AI Synthesis, doepfer (big), nonlinearcircuits - there aren't really that many to look at - not sure about the instruo one though - if I was even considering it I would also have to consider the 4ms vcamatrix - which is even bigger and more expensive - but I think I would like it more than the pin matrix - I'd loose the pins for starters!!!

they are pretty simple really - and really useful for feedback patching - self modulating modulation!!!

we're not dead yet!!!

at least I'm not - dunno about Lugia, but I hope not!

we were right, we are right and we will continue to be right!!

(at least on the necessity of utility modules in modular synthesis)

hahahaha

but seriously - thanks @sacguy71!!! really appreciate it!!

Jim

great idea only plan to fill half the case - then work out what you need - brilliant!! really much better than filling the case totally with junk

a pass but still a low grade due to the ordering of modules before asking and for not including the rack wart (power module) - I think I might have just invented that term "rack wart" I like it... I really hope it takes off - applies particularly to hideous needlessly massive shameless marketing stunt monstrosities - such as that supplied with the arturia rackbrutes

I wouldn't have bought any of these modules or the case - but there you go - it's your modular

at least it's not a palette!!!

So, I'm new to eurorack, but not new to hardware synths. I already own a whole bunch of semi-modular gear and I just ordered a rackbrute 6u to fill up. I wanted to make a wavetable and/or granular synth with eurorack, so I've ordered an Erica synths black wavetable VCO. I also already ordered all the other modules in this setup, except for the Bastle grandpa and the Expert Sleepers disting mk4, which will probably be next modules to order.

get the ex not the mk4 - you have space and it is way more than twice the module

I will be sequencing it with my Elektron analog four mk1 and/or my keystep. I also already own a KOMA elektronik fieldkit and fieldkit FX that I can use as submixers. With my analog 4 and my fieldkit I also already have a lot of modulation sources.

so you would think - probably for now yes - but you will either want more or ways of combining and modifying the modulation sources you do have before filling the rack

I already spend a few hours researching youtube and modular grid, to get to this setup, but it's always nice to hear opinions of experienced eurorack users. So what do you think of this setup in combination with an Elektron analog four, fieldkit and fieldkit FX? Would this make an interesting synth? Would you add anything to make it more interesting?
-- SolNoctis

you spent a few hours?!?!?! - hahaha hahaha and you seem to consider that "a lot of effort" hahahahaha and you spent 1200€ or so hahahaha

again I will point you back to the i wouldn't have bought any of these modules and ask first before parting with cash!!

maybe maybe I would have bought the erica wavetable - you need a vco and it's a vco - no opinion on it other than that
why 2 filters?
why only a dual vca? you can never have enough vcas!!!! obviously you didn't spend enough time on you tube (MylarMelodies video) - well maybe you can have enough (eventually) but as a first vca a quad cascading one like veils or intellijel is a better buy as they are more versatile
why adsrs? mostly ads are used in modular - unless you are "playing a keyboard"!
do you need attenuators and multiples in the rack yet - probably not
why grandpa - wait until clouds 2 arrives check that out first - it will be soon - maybe even this year!!!
why disting mk4 when EX exists?

to make this more rack more interesting quickly - add a another vco (something cheap and analogue, the doepfer basic one is fine or dreadbox or whatever) - add kinks - add a matrix mixer (doepfer is good but large - so maybe an AISynthesis one) - maths - really add maths and weep at the lack of space in the puny rack with the 5hp rack wart - add a fx aid or better yet fx aid xl or 2 - get a waveshaper - get a sequential switch - get a random modulation source - get a chaotic modulation source - get some sub mixers - or don't - play with what you have and learn it inside out

ok... snared me in... was on way to the modular...

drop the mutable knock offs
cara because you have a lot of sequencing already - if you want more random sequencing and gates once this case is full - get another case and a real Mutable Marbles
uBurst because clouds2 or whatever Emilie is going to call it is coming soon

if you are using vcv rack a lot why not an expert sleepers es8 or 9 so you can directly interface that both for cv and audio (both ways) - especially early in the journey I can see a lot of use for this

do you really need the triple buffered mult with so much external sequencing? i doubt it - links would be better as then you get 2 utility mixers and a single buff mult - also kinks - just buy it!!

I'm not convinced you have enough vcas... nah really the opposite(I count 15 including plaits and optomix - you almost need another row for the envelope generators) and you may not need the attenuators for the external mixer - spend a bit of time searching and find one that suits your needs - ie can handle modular levels without needing an attenuator they exist - I use an old yamaha (MG10?) - which happily works with modular levels - more in rack mixing would be good though - both sub mixing (audio before filter for example) and modulation - I always like a matrix mixer

you say you will use a daw - but not how you are getting from modular to daw - if you do not have an audio interface make sure to get an external mixer that has multitrack usb connectivity - or direct outs - and make sure you get more channels than you think you need - or at least the ability to expand somehow

for your next module(s) I would get an fx aid, a quad cascading vca (veils is great) and kinks and then the external mixer and a way to interface with vcv rack

after that get the modules you think you want - the shapeshifter, the filter8 and the PNW (if you think feel you need it given all the external sequencing and drums - might be better of with a batumi or a zadar or something else - but you will know when you get there) and then work out what you are missing

buy stackcables or headphone splitters

only get new modules when you feel you are very very comfortable with the ones you already have - how they work individually and together

but before all that google the "maths illustrated manual" and work your way as much through that as you can without more modules - I think one or 2 patches need another module but I might be wrong - and if you've done that already - do it again!!!

EDITED Oct 14th 2020, 21:09

you need mixers in the rack - both for modulation (ideally a matrix mixer) and for sub-mixing audio before feeding to filters/effects etc, and for panning of mono signals if your final output is stereo

the simple way to judge if you need attenuators or an output module before hitting an external mixer or audio interface is to try it:

1 straight from final module - does it clip (distort) or sound bad in any other way? - if no stop - if yes continue

2 use attenuators - try attenuators in between the final module and the mixer/interface - same question as above - same results!

3 use an output module - if you need balanced outputs then get them - if you don't need balanced outputs, then the chances are that atttenuators and converter cables are all that is really needed

If you need a headphone output then get a headphone output - 2hp and ALM Busy Circuits are places to look for dedicated modules

1/4"->1/8" cables and Passive attenuators - are really cheap - and you almost definitely need them anyway - 2hp trim or pushermanproductions do a DIY 8 channel trimmer - or any other attenuator you already have to try

AISynthesis
Doepfer
York Modular

all do inexpensive matrix mixers

I think it you want small go for the AISynthesis, if you want nice ergonomics go for the doepfer

I like clouds too!!!
Even Rings into clouds from time to time
Emilie says there are 2 modules left for mutable - I'm more interested in the other module than clouds 2 (or whatever it will be called), especially if it is something new and not just a new (smaller) version of another module

Veils!!!! 20db gain available on 4 channels - perfect for audio input

completely agree about the too small case and youtube being a bad influence on this and modular not necessarily being the right way to go, especially cost wise - drum racks and effects racks being some of the prime candidates for that

I think the sound of clouds is obvious if you use it in obvious ways - particularly running rings through it!!
also lots of people use it as an end of chain reverb
more interestingly you could load something into the buffer and use it as a vco!!

AISynthesis do a matrix mixer in 10hp - I would go for that rather than the latest, greatest - unless you've got a pin fetish!!
In a small case I would rather have logic and rectification and sample and hold in 4hp - instead of 3 sample and hold!!
again adsr? do you need it? if so go smaller!!
do you really need the output module? if for headphones I'd get the 2hp or alm busy circuits... otherwise I'd just use 1/8"->1/4" cables straight out of mixer

yes you could replace the doepfer s&h

personally I would remove the cold mac and the precision adder - add panning mixer (for audio - panmixjr) and a matrix mixer (for modulation - input 4 modulation sources get 4 different mixes out)

the obvious candidates are the 2 filters - also the adsr - get a smaller one, if you need adsr!!
I'm not sure I would add links - kinks is probably a better use of 4hp
edit
I just saw you update with a cold mac and a precision adder - these just seem to be randomly added

cold mac looks great - but once you realise it will only do audio or cv at once it becomes less attractive, at least to me

EDITED Oct 8th 2020, 14:22

less 'feature' modules - more utilities

re clouds - if you don't already have it - don't buy a clone just now - wait for the mutable replacement - it will be soon!!!

Thanks and I may swap out the SBG and Zeroscope to free up more space as I don't really use those two modules as much as I thought that I would. Waiting for others like Jim and Lugia to chime in what would be great additions as well. Thinking Disting EX+ PNW + sequential switch + Matrix mixer and maybe 1-2 more oscillators as the BIA and Cursus are more all in one modules and having a solid analog VCO and FM module would be great fun. Perhaps Plaits and Rings? IME Hertz Donut Mk3 looks great as well but it is digital.
-- sacguy71
There's nothing wrong with digital - plaits and rings are digital too!!!
Personally I would go for the Disting EX, PNW, sequential switch and a matrix mixer - and then stop

spend a bit of time researching which vco (if you really want another vco) to get - take your time - watch videos - and only buy when you cannot not buy

or alternatively get one of the three oscillators you like at the moment and then stop (Rings - it's an effect as well as a voice)

on a side note I have both rings and plaits - if I could only keep one it would be rings

I think I would do that (tallin->1u vca) - not sure how much space will be left in the 1u but nonlinear circuits do a 1u sloth in both intellijel and pulp logic formats - nice for slow modulation!

It's always a good idea to leave some space though - so I would get a blind panel to cover up the 6hp hole that's left

If you make the rack public then other users can viez it properly and get click through and infomatics - really useful when helping!!!

You need more vcas - get a quad cascading vca - mutable veils or intellijel for example - I'd also consider replacing the tallin with the intellijel 1u vca - all of these are dc coupled - as are most vcas

How are you mixing? if you do not already have an external mixer - you either need to buy one or put one in the rack - even if you do have an external mixer you will need sub-mixers, panning, modulation

Some utility modules will massively add to the variety of patches that you can create - mutable links, kinks and shades for example

you will need to free some space to accommodate these modules - the erbe-verb seems to be the obvious sacrifice - too big, not really a generic end of chain reverb (which is possibly what you are after) - replace this with an FX Aid XL and it will free 14hp more up - this may still not be enough!!! next to go would be the mimeophon (you seem married to the erica stuff) and again replace with an FX Aid XL

here's the actual link to the rack if anybody wants this instead of a crappy jpg

I'm not convinced you need more modulation - utilities to leverage what you already have would probably be less expensive and more effective = matrix mixer for starters

EDITED Oct 6th 2020, 13:52

stages is great - a very useful module

one strategy for making modulation more interesting and to go further, which is generally less expensive than buying lots of modulation sources is to add more utilities

for example a matrix mixer would be a good idea - so you can, for example, mix 2 decay envelopes from stages with 2 outputs from Maths

have fun!!!

there are also modules that do autotuning - endorphin.es make one I believe, but there are others

Hey ! I'm fairly new to Eurorack. I just have a question I can't seem to find answers...

-- NicoJabbles

Hi, I've had eurorack for years & I have both questions and answers - and I use a few boards - muffs, here and reddit as do a lot of people!!! - I've seen you ask the same question in all 3 of these places - and you have got pretty much the same answers on each - please don't cross post like this, it's bad etiquette - just have a bit of patience - pick one and if after a few days there's no reply, then ask somewhere else - not 5 mins later

EDITED Sep 30th 2020, 16:23

well that ain't gonna get you to generative music - it may be a small step along the way, though - is this what you have now or what you are - I'd suggest that you want a mixer, or better yet a quad cascading vca

I'd probably look at something more 'generative': turing machines, marbles, bloom etc

can't say I'm a fan of the b company or their products, really - I'd go Mantis if possible (for one thing the power supply is more 'right sized' for the case)

If you are confused about the sheer number of modules then I would ignore actual modules for now and think about functionality more - spend some time reading up/watching videos about basic synthesis techniques - both from an east coast and a west coast perspective and then work out what modules you need to achieve that goal

I'd think seriously about dumping the cellz and chipz modules - I've seen a lot of bad reviews from people who have bought them

is the budget a this is it no more ever, or is it a this is how much I've got and I can spare another x per month?

if it's the former I would go for the nifty + the dreadbox modules (get a second vco if you can) and an SQ-1

if it's the latter I would probably go for a cardboard case for now, something like an SQ-1 for sequencing and a simple vco, a simple low pass filter, a simple lfo and a quad cascading vca - use the vca as output to where ever

or better yet learn to solder and build something like this https://frequencycentral.co.uk/product/product/ or this https://frequencycentral.co.uk/product/starter-modular-bundle/ or start out with AISynthesis modules

get a quad cascading vca - such as veils or intellijel - either will be able to be 4 vcas, 4 external input amplifiers, a 2-4 channel voltage controlled mixer

Maths is a great module - but it is more than the sum of its parts - google the unofficial "maths illustrated manual"

kinks is another great module that will add a lot of functionality in a small space = including logic!

EDITED Sep 27th 2020, 17:07

well it seems your English is good enough!!

have you tried without the gate patched to strum, a change in note should trigger rings

the transpose function is on the keyboard - so it is just general playing etc and not the frequency cv input

it certainly does not seem to be correct

I suspect you might be right about the quality of the build - was the vendor a known builder - ie have they built and sold a lot of these or was it just some bloke and a soldering iron?

I would initially try to contact the person you bought it off, describe the problem and see if they will fix it or refund - if you bought it with that possibility

if this doesn't work out then you might try the muffwiggler music tech diy subforum - there is a sticky list of reliable builders there - and of people looking for them - and there's also a mega - unsuccessful mutable diy builds thread - you may be able to find better help there!

hahaha - a modular acrostic!!!

edited to remove the solution

this should be stickied

EDITED Sep 27th 2020, 10:31

i don't remember there being any latching in Rings...

does this only happen with rings? - have you tried the same sequencers with other sound sources and get the same or different results?

please describe exactly what you are doing - by transpose do you mean send a sequence to rings v/oct in and transpose the sequence on the way in or do you mean send a sequence to rings v/oct in and use the frequency cv input to transpose?

is it an original, a clone, a diy module you built yourself?

copy and paste the url

I'd go fh2, utilities, Maths, es9, more utilities

utiltity module ideas:
links
kinks
AISynthesis matrix mixer
shades

link to actual rack

@JimHowell1970 what would you recommend instead?

Thank you guys again 😊
-- gorilla

combinations of basic utilities - multiples (can be stackcables/headphone splitters), mixers (matrix, panning, small utiltiy), modification (logic, sample and hold, rectification), a sequential switch, a quad cascading vca... either as individual modules, or as small combinations (links, kinks etc)

EDITED Sep 24th 2020, 13:26

it's better to use a link -

you appear to have a lot of mixing - but all appears for audio - also I'd split it up a bit

I'd keep the quad vca and add the double andore - 6 vcas is still not a lot for this size case

I'd want more utilities for multing/mixing/modifying modulation

I think you have to add a 1u row and then look for the 84hp 'tile' under 1u

personally I prefer simple functional blocks for utilities and preferably ones that can handle audio and cv at the same time - plus manuals in plain english help - so I would never buy a cold mac, or recommend one

an offset module would be something like shades NOT kinks

How many support/utility modules would I need in a setup for each voice? Like if I have 4-6 VCOs and 4 LFOs, how many logic modules, matrix mixers, switches, VCAs, EGs, and logic/offset modules would I realistically need for a good setup?
-- sacguy71

as many as you need is the answer - do you find yourself reaching for an extra mixer? or logic module or EG or VCA or whatever

if so you need that module so buy it - this is why disting/o&c/maths are particularly useful - as they can stand in for so many things as and when you need them

a good starting point is 2 vcas per vco - but that really only applies to east coast style synthesis - more is useful - and remember some 'vcos' etc have vcas built in

for my 7 voice/4 filter rig (total 63 modules) I have Triple Sloths, Maths, Stages and Peaks (plus a second peaks to be built) as envelope generators/lfos, links, kinks, 3 shades, 2 passive mults (+ a handful of headphone splitters and 2 dozen stackcables), 2 2hp trim, a sequential switch, a buffered mult, Marbles, sinfonion, an a-151 sequential switch, a morphing controller, an 8 way attenuator, a switched multiple, a bank of 8 a/b switches, 2 clock dividers, veils, a dual vca, 2 clock dividers, a panning mixer, a matrix mixer, a 2hp tune/tm combo, Streams, 2 pedal interfaces (one with a cross fader), an instrument input, 2 compressors, branches, a micro mixer, an inv mix, a joystick, an erica swamp, 5 waveshapers and an ES8/ES6 - so roughly 2/3rds of the modules are 'support modules' and I think I need more envelope generators and mixing - currently mixing outside the box - NB I use and abuse as much of this as possible with my video rig - mostly the waveshapers and morphing controller

EDITED Sep 22nd 2020, 13:34

yeah - looks better to me

use one channel of batumi as a clock I guess - which will work fine

I suspect that by the time the second case appears, you will have a better idea of what you need - ie what you feel is missing from this case - but that's also part of the fun - discovery

enjoy your journey!

I don't use midi either - I use a kick sample (available from Make Noise) as a clock to stay in sync

yeah definitely pick up a few 1/8"->1/4" cables - much better than adapters imo

maybe you should just wait and see...

it may be that you don't need anything, if you find that signal too hot - buy a 2hp trim module and try that, if you don't like the results then get an output module

ok - I would probably loose the pip slope - function is probably enough for envelopes - and you have batumi for modulation

this would allow for a bigger filter - any of the 8hp doepfer ones that catch your eye/ear or ripples, for example

maybe an idea to make the rack public! I can't tell exactly what everything is, but looking pretty good