ModularGrid uses so-called cookies to ensure it's so-called functionality. We also use dubious tracking scripts. Find out more in the Privacy Policy. We use cookies and wanna let you know.
Out of curiosity I decided to just look everything up, as my rack gear is not so many pieces. I found only half of my rack items list their power consumption, and the ones that do list a range of 30-70W with typical draw around 30-40W. I'm on a normal "home" circuit of 15A in the US (implying max load of 1800W and circuit breaker tripping around 1440W). SO it looks like, unless I have a giant power hog on the same circuit, I should be fine to run my updated audio rack.
I'm doing some updates to my 19" audio rack gear. I love how the MG tool shows power consumption on draft modular setups. Do any of you know of a tool (or other easy way) to similarly calculate power consumption for other audio gear including 19" rack units? I've recently added SSL Fusion to my rack and want to check the totals won't overrun my power conditioner or circuit.
I would make a manual list if needed, but if there's a slick online tool, I'd be glad to use that. No good initial Google finds so thought I'd ask around. Not exactly a modular question, but similar ballpark... I'll appreciate any ideas you have!
I have 1 very nice case from lake, it is big, and kind of too awkward / heavy to move much.
I am getting another Case From Lake, it will be a joinable pair, more HP than the first, but also easier to move due to its being a splitable / joinable pair. If you follow up with Alberto at CFL and ask about some pairs, he'll show you some pictures.
Suggest you grab a wmd time warp before wmd goes away. The ability to pitch slew on demand with ease and full control will come in very useful for acid.
If you follow that thread you'll find a bunch of first principles and ur-patches for perc synthesis. It is one I should revisit too. A key takeaway: you can make perc out of lots of things.
Found this old thread after Hexinverter emailed their list to announce upcoming closure. In sadness and greed I went and bought a bunch of Mutant drums.
@Jim: "I think the biggest challenge is finding what works for you and not what works for other people - experimentation is the key - not 'specific techniques for patching modulation + utilities in Eurorack patches" --> nicely said. Modular has taught me a lot about "groping and listening my way through" sound design; in fact a great boon of modular is that it absolutely forces experimentation. A lot of my earlier VST time was cursed with "nail that patch I'm hearing somewhere" vs. playfully getting to know the ins, outs and quirks of a particular instrument. Howard Scarr can nail patches, do the Batman scores, write the Virus programming handbook and the Bazille Cookbook, but I still have to grub my way around hearing and understanding the building blocks of sound design (though Rob Papen's fabulous "4 Element Synth" helped get me past ground zero).
@Garfield, good question, yes I have a bunch of filters (and waveshapers) but I'm probably underutilizing those too. The more of this thread I write and read, the more it occurs to me a lot of my time on modular is focused on really exploring 1-2 modules at a time (which is all well and good), and pretty rarely am I focussed on building a robust signal chain that has a chance of having good sonic depth, interest, movement, etc., while still being a good "role player" and fitting into a reasonable mix.
Net net, this is helping me shift mindsets a bit from "OMG there's still stuff I don't know about this module I've got to focus on it more" to "make sure to spend a good chunk of making a nice and full sounding patched instrument, and enjoy getting to know modules a bit better along the way."
... AND while we're talking filters, I have to give a shout out to my latest addition, Jolin Agogo (Octal LPG). Sounds really good and it's great to have 8 LPGs in a small package!
Happily, all this leaves me really jonesing to get back in front of my modular rig -- need to wrap up my work for the day and leave some patching time before bed!
Thanks for the ideas and encouragement guys, cheers!
In my big studio rig, I do have a bunch of relevant scale/offset/mix utilities: Maths, Sum*Diff, SISM, Levit8, Doepfer A 1-38m Matrix Mixer, and 12 lanes of VCA (3 quads). I also have plenty of CV sources from standard envelopes, LFOs and sequencers through chaos and random. Your tagline of "sound sources < sound modifiers < modulation sources < utilities" I've tried to keep in mind for my modules --> but I probably haven't kept it in mind for all my actual patches!
So I'm probably vastly under-utilizing my existing scale/offset/mix utilities --> my current guess I should press my upcoming patching to have i) a lot more modulation targets and ii) nearly all mod signals "dialed in" or restrained via attenuate / offset / mix.
I think one challenge I've had on this point so far is not having a great sense "what good looks / sounds like" in terms of #s, balance and specific patching techniques for modulators + utilities in Eurorack patches.
... returning a few hours later, after managing to get in a good session on the modular rig tonight, here are a few reflections:
I) I often have a pretty short device chain, not a lot between OSC and line out. Partly this is because I love OSCs and like to focus on exploring the depth of the ones I have.
II) BUT as a result of (I), I often don't have a lot of modulation destinations. I can see how adding more devices post OSC then adds more mod destinations and adds dimension to the "wavespace" I'm creating gestures through.
III) net net, I'm probably "chronically undermodulating," and when I do apply modulation, maybe I'm using too many sources with too much gain. Maybe more mod destinations, fewer mod sources, more carefully trimmed mod settings would be a good rule of thumb for my patches for the near future.
Reminds me of earlier times doing sound design on VSTs or fixed hardware, I thought "I should look at patches I really like, count the # of modulation sources, # of modulation destinations, and get a sense of the median modulation depth..." something like that. Probably would still be a useful exercise for me to spend a bit of time on.
Reflections above notwithstanding, I'll be interested to hear any suggestions (in response to the original post above) that you might have, thanks!
Hi, a few comments:
-- I have SISM and am very happy with it. Yes the mini-pots are small, but the spacing is adequate for me to use happily.
-- Levit8 has medium-sized nobs and can handle a lot of duties SISM can
-- Joranalogue Morph4 may be interesting for you, but it is more of a mashup module than offset/attenuvert
-- WORNG Vector Space does a tone of CV mashup and everything is selected by tap
What I like about Doepfer is they're widely available in stock, are stackable (with some basic hardware), have great reputation for PSUs, and I imagine they'll be available for a while so in the future when I need another case, I don't have to mix and match, I can probably get another Doepfer.
Case From Lake is super responsive, nice, easy to deal with, does wide customization, and made me a real nice case.
I'm about 2 years into modular, with many other years in music and VST synthesis. Enjoying modular a lot!
I'm finding a lot of my modular patches are "flatter" than I would like -- they are 1-2 dimensional, and not as fluid, bouncy, dynamic, juicy etc. as patches I hear from Heinbach, Divkid and other power-users with videos online. I have plenty of modular gear at this point, so "not enough gear" can't really be the problem. I'm guessing either i) my approach to modular is somewhat stuck in VST based thinking and experience ii) I haven't picked up enough modular-specific techniques and patches iii) or simply more modular soak / practice time is required. Practically, I imagine I'm probably underutilizing CV and CV mashup/mixing.
That being the case, I wanted to pick your brains for favorite techniques, patches, (and to a lesser extent) modules that you love for getting a modular system to give that multi-dimensional, (broadly) dynamic sonic response we associate with a good modular system being played by a strong modular synthesist. Any suggestions of i) specific techniques or patch types ii) great videos or books on this iii) key modules you use for this?
I use a variety of high end and middle end gear to listen to modular. The only things I do are:
-- make sure I have a limiter in the DAW when I go modular --> DAW --> nice monitors
-- in another room I sometimes play through a Line6 PowerCab, in which case I make sure to turn on other gear before I turn on the cab, so I avoid power on / off transients
Modular levels can be very hot, so you would want to set those to zero or otherwise limit / control them so you don't run into problems with downstream gear. Most modular out modules already do this.
Overall, I think its fine to monitor with whatever you want, just follow some basic protections you would likely follow with any audio source.
Addendum: some additional searching shows a few interesting "trigger / gate addressable voltage" sources, none of which are solutions for the exact use case above, but all could fit in other somewhat similar use cases:
-- Random Source SEQ8 XL Serge Sequencer
-- SPUTNIK 5-STEP VOLTAGE SOURCE
-- Xodes PV44
(Capturing these here in case its of interest to anyone else.)
... all told, Verbos Sequence Selector (VSS) or a smaller HP/$ version of its selector function would be my best fit solution in this case. If you know of any great VSS alternatives, please let me know, thanks!
I can offer a little more explanation of what I'm looking for: let's say I have 4 input signals (audio or CV) 1234 and I'd like to output any 1 at a time. Yes a sequential switch would do that, and it would let me produce sequences like 1234, 2341, 3412, 4123. BUT that gives access to only 4 of 24 possible permutations of 1234 --> I'd like access to all 24, including things like 1324, 4132, etc. that can't be done easily with basic switches. A switch with CV-address like Doepfer A-152, BossBow2, or NE Vice Virga could access all potential permutations, but its driven by CV and would generally need to be CV sequenced to generate the flexible output I'm looking for. I have and use BossBow2, it's super, but it is not the right fit for this particular situation. Rather here, I'm looking to gain access to all sequential permutations of input signals, with selection driven by trigger or gate. Why? Because my trigger / gate sequencers are super hands on / intuitive / visual SO I'd love to get to use them in this type of setup and extend their functionality in my rig beyond the traditional use as perc triggers. Imagine hocketing anything in any pattern with the entire pattern immediately visible and touchable, controlled by Tiptop Circadian --> that's the type of outcome I'm looking for here. (BTW I'm updating the thread name to be hopefully more indicative of my interest here.)
Best fit trigger/gate controlled selector/switch I can find so far for these purposes is Verbos Sequence Selector (VSS): the setup is inputs to Signal Selector A (or B) and gate signal to Stage Select In. The bad news is VSS lists over $400, is 16HP, and this use case uses at most 30% of the module. SO I'm crossing my fingers it may be possible to find something that is basically the bottom half of VSS, with a lesser HP and $ footprint.
Net net, it's kind of a strange duck use case, and I'll go with VSS if there aren't lower HP / $s alternatives.
I am looking for a module that can do the following:
-- take several (let's say 2 to 8) DC or AC signal inputs and route them to 1 (or more) outputs
-- have signal pass behavior driven by trigger inputs, such as from any normal trigger sequencer
-- triggers would "latch" causing the last triggered channel to be routed to the output
What this would let me do is to use trigger (percussion-type) sequencers to sequence other CV or audio. This would be different from normal switches in that i) it would accommodate lots of channels ii) it would not be "sequential" but rather trigger-per-channel selectable iii) switching would be driven by triggers (e.g. not continuous CV signal in like an LFO).
Any suggestions for a module that would work in this instance? I have looked around online and not seen a good solution for this.
"i'll check out the SISM and Triplatt, as well. probably hard to envision how useful these kinda modules are until yr actually using them."
example: let's say I'm sending an LFO through a quantizer (like Intellijel Scales) to get pitch and trigger outs. Let's say I want 1 octave range of pitch info output from my quantizer, and the LFO outputs -5 to +5v. Then the LFO is giving me 10 octaves of pitch range, I need to scale that down by an order of magnitude, so the range is 1v; I probably also have to shift the center of the LFO range up or down to get to my desired pitch register.
That type of scenario happens super often: the control signal output range is way bigger (or sometimes smaller) than you want, and often with a different center point. Hence the ability to scale and shift is control signals is super important. My example above applies to pitch, but very similar things happen with filter and timbre controls. More often than not, if I'm using control voltage, I have to constrain it in some way to put it into a musical range for the given application.
@golddrone, nice rack update (Thursday July 21) I see that version as having zero waste.
I do think that setup is a bit too bare bones to be deeply usable / enjoyable. IMO some very solid adds would be:
-- envelopes of some kind, depends how many channels of envelopes you want, and how deeply programmable they need to be. I like Stages (not sure that is still buyable) since it is up to 6 very basic envelopes or 1 huge complex envelope depending on how you patch it. That said, there's a lot of merit to smaller, simpler envelope packages.
-- you'll want something to wrangle CV signals with: offset, gain, invert, mix, etc. SISM and Triplatt are my go to's, but there's options on that front.
-- do look at the expander for Batumi, it's good bang for buck in 3HP
That said, overall I think your 2nd rack is a stronger "core" design and is all "no regrets" modules including several top choices in their respective categories (e.g. Pams, Batumi, FX Aid, QuadVCA, Plaits).
"I was mostly concerned about utility/basic type modules and if I was missing anything obvious that would work well and compliment what I had in the case already, or just general essentials. Or if what I had didn't make any sense at all."
In that case, a few additional comments:
-- I find something like 4ms SISM or Tiptop MISO to be essential in almost any rack. Control signals so often need scaling and offset, and its great to be able to blend them in some way.
-- Intellijel Triplatt or something like that is another great utility to have; low in $s and HP, very useful.
-- for mixing, IMO there's a lot of options, and none of them are perfect, they are almost always bigger than I would like, and missing something I need or including something I don't need. IMO the main questions for mixing are i) how many channels do you need to mix ii) do you need stereo or not. I will be getting some Mixups when possible, but it may not be possible for a while. I would suggest the Doepfer Narrow Mixer (mono) if all you need is mono, as it is low HP and $s and will suit many basic needs.
-- lastly, I would put Instruo Ochd on your radar if it isn't already. I have Batumi and Ochd, Ochd offers lots more LFO signal in a small package. IMO Ochd offers a lot of bang for buck to get a patch moving musically.
-- in smallish cases, it's important to be thoughtful about big-ish modules. Tapographic Delay and Benjolin2 I think merit close attention to alternatives given their (large) size. A small do-it-all FX module (like Happy Nerding's one) could do wonders. And there are a lot of good alternatives for chaos-type modules with great capabilities in smaller HP. Nonlinear Circuits (NLC) Hipster or Sloths are ones I can highly recommend; Joranalogue Orbit is similar to Hypster, but I prefer Hypster. And there's a lot of other NLC units that are worth looking at. I looked at Benjolin a few times but it didn't make sense for me vs. alternatives.
-- I understand you're looking at experimental / ambient / noise. Still, I suggest you don't ignore the value of "basic b$tch" modules which form the core of almost any usable system. Jim and Lugia say basically that much all the time. I will re-emphasize that. Basics with some clever and flexible patching yield perceived complexity. Jim loves CV matrix mixers; I love stuff like Joranalogue Morph4 or sequencing control signals through a switch like Boss Bow2. Net net, I think there's a lot of merit to "focus on a strong (generalist) modular core plus some modules specific to your taste" approach.... That said, I DO see your Doepfer, Intellijel, Xaoc, Pam's, Plaits, and filter module as solid choices that would play well in most systems. Just beware adding too many "specialist" modules in a small case.
-- More generally, I can recommend considering "balance," particularly in a rack that isn't huge. 1/3 of HP devoted to things that make or change sound, 1/3 of HP devoted to control signals and things that modify control signals, and 1/3 of HP dedicated to utilities and some finishing FX. That type of rule of thumb was critical for getting me working modular systems of 240HP and less. Over that HP, assuming there's a solid "core" system, then one can go more buck-wild here or there on specific module types. IMO, it's best to ensure there's a solid "core" system, then add selectively from there.
-- I'm on probably my 8th+ distinct modular setup and I'm still f$cking things up a little. There's a ton to learn in modular. Now, I have a great home rig and a work-in-progress travel rig. Lugia, Jim and a few other forum regulars helped me a lot. Hope you enjoy the process and get a nice system that works for you.
@Jim, thanks for the ideas! Lots of points you raised, I'll try to respond to the major ones below:
-- The Jolin LPG bank you mentioned is likely a great fit here.
-- "Mixing really needs to be addressed..." Agreed! Working backwards, ES8+6 give me 10 outs to DAW, I don't see myself needing more than that with this setup. Lots of potential ways to manage the up to 10 voices, let's say main options are 4 mono + 3 stereo pairs, or 6 mono + 2 stereo pairs. I have some spare Doepfer A-138N (4-ch narrow mixer) I could slot in, those can cover some mono needs. I'm inclined to get 1 Intellijel Mixup, which seems like a low $ and HP way to up the mix channel count, and a 2nd Mixup (if needed) could later be added and chained to the first. Also, SoundStage is a new module for me, I need some more soak time to get a sense of how I'll likely use it... I'm inclined to run a LOT of my pitched sources through it and treat it like a stereo sound-field out. Net net, my current sense is another 10-16HP devoted to mixing could really meet the needs for this setup.
-- you mentioned CV mixing. On that end I've got Sum&Diff, SISM, and Morph4. Do you have a more preferred setup for CV mixing / mangling? I did see your suggestion of a matrix mixer, just wondering if there's anything more / less to your preferred CV mix setup?
-- "low priority modules" and remaining space. As of today, I've got 95%+ of the modules above (most being re-racked from earlier cases into the new case). AND there's some fluidity between this setup and my home setup. My home setup has all its major functional needs covered, and some HP to spare, so if I want to pull a few items out of the travel rig (above) and slot them into the home rig, that works fine. BUT I think where we're netting out is I'll probably need to free up 16-26HP in the rig above for LPG and mixing additions. In my next few sessions with the setup, I'll focus on (top) rows 1-3 to check which of those modules I least need in this setup.
-- likely next steps: add Jolin LPGs and a little more mixing capability, and get a bunch more soak time with the setup before other changes (if needed).
@Toodee, thanks for the clarification above, that sounds right.
Thanks a lot for the review and suggestions folks!
My new 15Ux126HP Case from Lake! has arrived, and with it I am re-racking some modules, and arriving at this:
I'm curious to hear your ideas on this and if there are any obvious improvements. Below I'll go through i) my purposes for this rig and ii) my current ideas for likely changes.
The purpose for this rig is to have an inspiring and powerful mobile rig, mainly for use at my GF's place in the company of her and the cats(!!!), but more broadly to have a good mobile modular instrument. It is indeed mobile, thanks to Case from Lake!, but fully loaded a bit of a pain to move around, about as much (or little) fun to move around as a small drum kit. The musical purposes for this rig are:
1. provide a playground for sound design
2. provide some deep sequencing capabilities, including opportunities explore extended sequencing techniques (e.g. sequencing sequencers)
3. have enough perc voices and lanes to do some interesting rhythm programming in modular
4. have enough basic mix and FX capabilities to do a rough mix in modular
5. be able to record several tracks of audio and CV to a laptop (currently covered by ES8&6). I don't plan to get a full song out of the rig at any one time, but to get some key pitched and perc tracks out of it (via ES8&6) should be doable. Net net I'd like to be able to rough out track ideas on this rig, suck them into the DAW, and finish them there.
My current sense of this rig:
a) it feels both inspiring and unbalanced. Yay that it's inspring! I doubt I'll ever fully balance this rig, but a little more balance might help.
b) yes, I've gone OTT on oscillators (top two rows). Note that maybe half of those work well as perc voices also. I intend to keep 75%+ of the top two rows dedicated to "voicing."
c) middle row is sequencing. Of course mainly these will be doing pitched voice and perc sequencing. Vector's 8 tracks would be enough for most applications. The other sequencers are there to give me some options: different UI and workflow, some more lanes, some more opportunities for complex sequencing (e.g. switching or sequencing sequencers, etc.). I DO plan to run some sequencing to Xaoc Lipsk when that arrives, which should allow me to sequence timbres / wavefolding; Flux to Lipsk is an intriguing possibility. On the middle row, I feel like Vector+Extender will always be there, but some of the other stuff might get swapped out for more "workhorse" alternatives.
d) 4th row (from top) is CV and utilities. I feel >80% good about this row. Sum & Difference I don't seem to use much. I might try to free up space for another Quad VCA.
e) bottom row is sound mangling, FX, mix, and output. Module order is kinda strange (due to case depth limitations in some places). Basically on the left I've got sound mangling (XAOC Leibniz units, wavefolder, filter), middle is several mix & fx units, and right hand side is signal out. The WORNG unit is in that row to fill some rough-mix / spatialize duties.
My current sense of opportunities for revisions:
-- more filtering. I'm not a huge filter user, but this rig could benefit from more filtering options. Any suggestions on i) stereo filters that would fit well here or ii) LPGs with lots of lanes per HP (which might be great adds to the perc sound design)?
-- more mixdown lanes in small HP: the Doepfer + WORNG units are not really cutting it presently. I would gladly take suggestions for simple but HP efficient mix solutions to consider swapping in.
-- more switching / logic for complex sequencing: BossBowII (when available) or similar might be good for helping me get the sequencer lanes interacting musically with each other
-- another obvious possibility is to move the E370 out of this rig, as it is so huge! But for the near future, it is staying.
-- obviously most of the HP is already claimed, so any swap ins will require removing a lower priority module. And FYI I already own a lot of these modules (I've been re-racking them to the new case).
Curious to hear any ideas / responses you might have to the above rig, thanks!
In a setup like this, I'd strongly recommend you look at various switching options like:
-- Befaco Muxlicer
-- Verbos Sequence Selector
-- Boss Bow 2
etc.
With some switching like that in your system, you can sequence your control signals of any kind, including sequencers, lfo, envelopes, etc. With not much HP and $ extra, you massively extend the depth of your control rig.
Also, with the goal "have a modular sequencer that can easily be adapted to use with a wide variety of other system" that begs the question -- what will it be linked to? Hence, any of a range of interface modules like Expert Sleepers or Boredbrain might get you fun extra linkages out (to PC, MIDI, etc.).
My net recommendations
-- think of how many pitched sequence lanes you need, how many perc sequence lanes you need, how many spare sequence lanes you need, and get a bit more than that, with maybe different sequencers handling pitched vs. perc
-- very much consider ergonimics and workflow in a sequencer, it matters a ton. I like Five12 Vector for pitched stuff and Tiptop ones for perc, because of all the knob per function, and how those really make more sense to my mind than others. IMO sequencers are a very personal thing so take some time to find ones that jive with you
-- totally include some switching in the rack and sequence control signals, it's the bees knees
-- with a good signal out box (Expert Sleepers) etc., you could use a rig like this to cover a majority of scoring needs
FYI folks I bought some for TOMMI001's vented blanks, they are great! The look nice, pass a lot of air, line up perfectly with a 4HP slot, and have small enough slots to reject cords and rack screws. He even did a custom (all black) design for me. Thanks Tom!
Thanks for the ideas above folks! A few comments / questions:
-- the Noise Engineering modules and Dnipro DOT mentioned above could really be a good fit here, I will look at those closely
-- @JimHowell1970 could you explain a little what you mean about marbles as mini-grids+++? I would have never thought of that.
After a quick scan of this thread, I would toss in a few "left-field" ideas for consideration:
-- agree with the point above on snappy low pass gates, more generally, an envelope with really great control over very short parameters would suit you well
-- reminds me of the Dave Smith Instruments Tempest forum chain particularly https://stimresp.wordpress.com/tempest-recipes/ ... I suggest you scan that thread. It has a ton of useful information about perc synthesis
-- lately I've gotten into more digital modular OSCs and they are astonishing. Qu-Bit Electronix Scanned Organic Wavetable VCO and several of the Noise Engineering products are really blowing my mind. NE-BIA is used for perc but several others would be good too including LIP. Those paired with a snappy perc envelope / filter would be great. SSF Tryptich as processing to add a ton of filth is also worth considering. The Xaoc Leibniz Binary system components are also things I'm considering to go into sonic outer space.
The takaways here would be i) a good perc envelope will be key ii) there's a ton of other sonic space you can look at, particularly on the OSC or FX side, to take you into undiscovered country for perc sounds.
I meant to get Mutable Grids a while back, didn't get it, and now it's discontinued.
Are there good current alternatives to Grids? What I'm looking for is a percussion-oriented trigger/sequencer that will spit out an interesting and changing musical line while I'm working on something else.
Use case: let's say I'm dong a pretty deep sound design effort on a pitched voice chain, but I'd like a bit of perc running in the background so I don't lose my ears or mind in the meantime. $s budget to this "Grids substitute" is under 500, HP budget for this is 26HP or less roughly. Hence a good chunk of $ and HP to this purpose, but not buck wild.
The idea of running a few channels of VPME Euclidean Circles 2 through a switch is also a possibility. Sadly my favorite basic switch (Acid Rain Switchblade) is now also discontinued unobtainium.
Appreciate your ideas for a good Grids alternative.
This may or may not be helpful, but Rob Papen has a very good book called "The 4 Element Synth". It lays out the basic building blocks of all synths and how they interact normally.
Additionally, you could get a demo or paid version of any of a range of software modular synths. U-He Bazille is interesting, for example, and isn't as hindered by latency and GUI issues as some others. If you spend some time with Bazille, open one instance with a preset patch, open a 2nd instance and re-create that preset patch, that will show you a LOT about how to make modular patches.
More generally, if you're not much experienced with synthesis, spending some time listening to and goofing around with software synths (demos or paid) is a good way to get some basic fluency.
Last, it should be emphasized, modular synthesis is by nature very exploratory.
Somewhat off topic, I have to mention http://www.steadystatefate.com/triptych -- from your inquiry I thought maybe the SSF module is in the direction of the sounds you're looking for. The Perfect Circuit Baseck video demo of that is good.
Hi folks, any updates on ETA for Tiptop / Buchla modules to be available? I've done some internet search but haven't found any new info.
I'm expecting some holiday sales at my favorite US vendors. BUT if the Tiptop / Buchla stuff will be available soonish, I may wait and save $s to go to the Tiptop Eurorack Buchlas!
Thought I'd check around and ask if ya'll are hearing more than I have on this front. Thanks!
Thanks @Lugia, yes that will be my next step, to re-run some of the cabling and try to distribute the draw more evenly across the 4 PSUs. Fingers crossed this will help!
Hey BrumoD, great point, yes the 4 PSUs do look do be 1 per quadrant vs 1 per row. Out of the quadrants in my rack, Q1 (upper left) has the biggest power consumption #s and the most heat.
SO looking by quadrant, MG estimates Quadrant1 draw of 1478 mA +12V | 848 mA -12V | 0 mA 5V. If the case's total specs divide evenly across its 4 PSUs then one PSU should give 2000mA @ +12V, 1200mA @ -12V, 4000mA @ +5V. AND if that's right, then my Quad1 draw is ~75% of +12V capacity, 70% of -12V capacity and 0% of the 5V capacity. Am I looking at this right? Are those %s high enough to be making a lot of heat?
Looing at the total case (all 4 PSUs) my draw vs capacity is about 55% usage at +12V, 52% usage at -12V, and 0% at 5V. SO, while I have lots of power headroom in the case overall, maybe I'm pushing 1-2 PSUs too hard and getting excess heat as a result...
I can put some #s on this:
-- Deopfer Monster 12u case power specs (per Perfect Circuit): Available Current: 8000mA @ +12V, 4800mA @ -12V, 16000mA @ +5V
-- my 12uMonster rack's row1 draw per MG: 1075 mA +12V | 487 mA -12V | 0 mA 5V | ... about average (1/4 of total below)
-- my 12uMonster rack's row2 draw per MG: 1496 mA +12V | 764 mA -12V | 0 mA 5V ... higher than average
-- my 12uMonster rack's TOTAL draw per MG: 4421 mA +12V | 2535 mA -12V | 0 mA 5V
So if my case has 8000mA @ +12V delivered by 4 PSUs (one for each row) am I maybe pushing Row2 too hard by using ~1500mA +12V?
"Careful...one of the standard MG caveats is that the current draw figures aren't always 100% accurate...or sometimes even present!" -- I hear you @Lugia. BUT if the #s above are roughly right, would we be expecting a heat problem?
I have some other cases that are NOT experiencing heat issues -- they get warm but not hot -- so I'm just hoping to identify and fix the issues going on with this one Monster case. Thanks!!
I have several cases and the heat issue is popping up only in my most power hungry setup. So no, not common on this end. But I am trying to troubleshoot it so that my expensive OSC modules can have a good long lifetime.
QUESTION: might I be overrunning power on PART of my Doepfer monster case setup? MG shows my rack power consumption is way under max capacity for the case as a whole. But maybe I have a lot of power consumption focused on one row of my 4 row case? If this is a potential culprit for the heat buildup, I could move some modules around. But I have a good module setup I don't want to fuss with if moving them elsewhere in the case wouldn't help...
@Ronin, thanks for those suggestions. My first few checks showed "out of stock" but I can keep checking for availability elsewhere.
@TOMMI001 thanks for the news, maybe post again when the units are available? I am in the US, I'm not sure mail from your location in the Netherlands would make sense, but we'll see...
I am also considering ordering some perforated aluminum sheet such as https://www.onlinemetals.com/en/buy/aluminum-perforated-sheet which is quoting about $5 per for 10 units of "custom cut" 1x5 inch panels, or $40-50 for me to get more than enough vented blanks as I would need, which is not bad. I've seen people in other forums say the cut tolerances are not exacting SO one might need to buy big and cut down. Do ya'll know what capacity metal sheers are needed to get clean edges / angles / dimensions on blank-sized metals? I don't have any such tools presently.
@JNH-83 thanks for that Shapeways suggestion! They look like good candidates, IMO they are also a bit $ for plastic, so I may continue to look for some other alternatives. But I'm happy to have at least 1 good pre-fabricated option here!
@wishbonebrewery, yeah, how is it vented blanks are not more widely available and used?
I suppose we may as well compile a few of the better DIY options in this thread, such as preferred materials, potential preferred BOM vendors, dimensions, etc. A few weeks ago I'd found a good vendor and dimensions BUT I seem to have not noted that (sigh)... I'll post more on DIY options when possible.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but any steel or aluminum with (appropriate sized) vents would be a candidate material right?
Do any of you know of good "blank" panels that vent (such as via metal screen or mesh)? I'm hoping to find something available and at a reasonable price.
Use case: parts of my rack get pretty hot, despite my having left intake / outlet spots for outside air to enter and exit the rig. I'd like to add some "venting blank" panels to more of the rig so it can move more air, while still protecting the rig from unwanted wires, screws, or other objects potentially getting inside and causing a damaging short. I'd love to lower the internal temp to help my modules have long lives!
I probably need 5-10 4-8HP "venting blanks," not a lot! So I'm hoping to find a ready to use alternative vs. having to mess around with DIY for such a modest HP usage.
I have to say, I'm surprised there isn't already something like this widely available in the marketplace.
I'm in the US and mainly use Patchwerks (Seattle-based) and Perfect Circuit. Patchwerks I find has a solid selection and great recommendations, service, and ship times. Perfect Circuit has a wider selection. On rare occassion I've bought from Detroit Modular and a shop in Oregon who's name I forget. All 4 of those have been worth going back to.
I buy most of my other stuff from Sweetwater, or less frequently, Vintage Audio King, but both SW and VK are much less knowledgeable in modular than those specialist retailers mentioned above. Hope this helps!
@XODES thanks for the clarification above. I did not arrive at that same understanding by reviewing the info & videos available for PV44, so your added text helps. In particular, I had been left wondering how the panel controls relate to one another and to various possible input / output signals.
Might I suggest you add to your manual / videos:
-- a panel diagram labeling the controls and discussing their normal interactions
-- a few patch examples clearly illustrating a few of the main use cases, the required patching and settings
-- a basic "intro" video showing the 2 points above. The existing videos were too "busy" for me to make out the unit's basic functions.
I believe that added text / video would make the unit pretty clear to most.
I do think if I had PV44 in my rack I would learn it quickly.
Again, thanks for your input above, I'll keep PV44 in mind for the future!
Hi guys, an update, I did get a Keystep Pro -- after the above recommendations and some research into that, it seemed like a great fit for my uses.
@Ronin1973, per your point above, its not that I want to routinely do polyphony in Eurorack, but that I want to send arpeggiated chord info through (mono) Eurorack. Mainly the reason that I really enjoy chord to arp (mono) in my DAW and I want to be able to have the same fun in Eurorack plus the fun of Eurorack sound design. So the use case here is basically setting up a gnarly modular patch with plenty of CV shifting the sound, and then having KSP hooked up so I can enjoy playing the patch with powerful arp and other relevant live controls.
Wish I'd found KSP earlier, it seems like a great fit. Now I just have to find some time to dig in! This weekend hopefully...
@farkas and @Ronin1973, I hear you re: Xodes.PV44. I just saw the PV44 recently and thought it was neat and another option worth considering along these lines. I'm not in any rush to get a PV44 because i) it is pretty big HP wise ii) documentation for it is poor so its still slightly mysterious iii) there do seem to be plenty other usable alternatives.
Here's another idea. I'm not 100% sure it will work BUT I think it should work and it has a few advantages.
Required modules: i) Mutable Branches (or a similar Bernouli gate) ii) any mult iii) 2 lanes of envelope generation iv) a duo (or greater) VCA.
Setup: i) take your main trigger and mult it to get 2x of the same ii) take your desired audio and mult it to get 2x of the same iii) send your audio to VCAch1, and trigger to ENVch1 then VCAch1 to get the basic, non-accented output with your desired base envelope iv) send the mult trigger to Branches, dial in your desired random weighting (e.g. likelihood of occurrence), send the Branches output to ENVch2 then VCAch2, and the mult audio to VCAch2, that is your "random accent" lane v) dial in the VCA settings for ch1&2 to get your desired balance of accented vs non-accented sound vi) tap the combined audio outputs of ch1&2 to your downstream devices.
Here are the advantages of this type of setup:
a) Branches is a useful module, and not crazy expensive. Plus you probably have enough mults / VCAs already to pull this off, or else it wouldn't hurt you to have a bit more mult and VCA capacity.
b) importantly, this WILL let you dial in to taste the random weighting. Branches is a "coin toss" type module BUT you will be able to control the probability from 0-50% probability by using only one Branches output and setting the weighting control to taste
c) also importantly this gives you direct and full control over the relative levels of your accent vs non-accented sound, and full control over the envelopes of the base vs accented portions. Hence you could modulate any of those envelope parameters for further change and sonic interest
d) hypothetically you could chain this type of setup as much as you want (which would require more channels of Bernouli gates, mults and VCA) so that you have an unaccented lane and 2 (or more) completely different accent lanes running. Practically that would give you some (quantized) gradations of least to most accented notes.
e) this setup could be combined with other techniques (such as those above) to give you as much or as little complexity as you'd like.
Also worth considering instead of Branches (or in addition to it) would be any type of "neuron" or counter module (like EMW Pulse Counter). For example set up 1 counter to fire a trigger on every 3rd trigger input and a 2nd counter to fire a trigger on every 5th output. Then route those triggers similarly to Branches above. That would let you do "Euclidean" accents. A neuron module is generally like a counter but less regular (though it depends on the specific module).
In case you do want to run a few different lanes of accent control signal, THOSE could be routed through something like BossBow2 or Verbos Sequence Selector, hence you would be switching or sequencing different lanes of accents.
And lastly, a totally different option, you could just look for a module with "degree of random" as a built in option, such as Winter Eloquencer.
Thanks for the comments guys. Glad to know there are good options that won't involve buying loads more modules!
If there was a Keystep Pro 49 or 61 key that would be a great fit for my setup... the longer Keylabs look like a departure from the CV oriented Keysteps. No tight fit solution yet : (
I will confess I’ve never yet looked critically at external hardware controllers to connect with modular. I got into modular years after most of my other studio investments.
My main studio/modular rig has NI Komplet Kontrol S88mkII keyboard to my DAW, with a Roli Seaboard49 less used (but I’m wanting to use it more esp MPE). I figured any MIDI/CV from this setup would be via the computer (not the controller outs), SO I haven’t looked seriously at best external controlers interfacing directly with modular (eg bypassing the computer).
My travel modular I use alone or alongside other small things like a Roland Jupiter XM. The JXM I could do as Farkas suggests, ARP out…
Sounds like the Arturia lineup is worth consideration, if I don’t already have something close enough to that.
And the general theme above I’m taking as “handle as much of the note instructions as possible outside of modular” eg it’s more efficiently done in something like an Arturia controller or DAW…
